RE: 2019 Mazda MX-5 vs Toyota GT86 Blue Edition
Discussion
It's impossible not to bring one's prejudices to this comparison.
I test drove a GT86 when they first came out, as a possible replacement for an aging RX8. I really wanted to like it, and had I not had the RX8 I would definitely have bought the GT86.
But- it was certainly fun, but felt slower than the RX8; it felt much less special; it had less useable rear seats; it felt less well made than the RX8 (even comparing new against old) , and it seemed much easier to lose grip. It was better in town traffic that the RX8, but any number of other cars would have been better than either at that.
All subjective of course, apart from the rear seats, but enough to make me sure that it wasn't worth the cost difference.
None of the above proves than an MX5 is better than a GT86, but if I could have managed with only 2 seats at the time, I would have had an MX5 with no regrets. So the MX5 gets my vote!
I test drove a GT86 when they first came out, as a possible replacement for an aging RX8. I really wanted to like it, and had I not had the RX8 I would definitely have bought the GT86.
But- it was certainly fun, but felt slower than the RX8; it felt much less special; it had less useable rear seats; it felt less well made than the RX8 (even comparing new against old) , and it seemed much easier to lose grip. It was better in town traffic that the RX8, but any number of other cars would have been better than either at that.
All subjective of course, apart from the rear seats, but enough to make me sure that it wasn't worth the cost difference.
None of the above proves than an MX5 is better than a GT86, but if I could have managed with only 2 seats at the time, I would have had an MX5 with no regrets. So the MX5 gets my vote!
If I had the money and was looking to buy one car new which I would keep for ten years, I think this MX-5 would be it. I cant see where Mazda will go from here other than hybrid drivetrain, electric power.... its one of the very last affordable, small, light cars with a n/a engine which will rev out to 7500.
Love the Toyota GT86 as well. Haven't driven one, but sat in one and felt absolutely brilliant. Definitely a modern Japanese Capri.
I also love the Fiesta ST, By far its my favourite of the 2018 crop of hot hatches or warm hatches (although a little 140 PS Ecoboost S Line ticks my fancy a lot too).
So reading this on a Monday morning brings a smile to my face. A rare Pistonheads article where I would happily take home each of the cars featured and be a very happy chap I suspect. A pleasant change from all the uber power German stuff...
The changes to the 2019 MX-5 are enough to make me want another one when my 2 year lease comes to an end next year.
I have a 2.0 SEL-Nav and it’s just brilliant so I can’t wait to try the new one - although the review seems to be talking about more differences than Mazda have mentioned ?!?!
One word on the present 2.0 is that it definitely needs time to bed in, mine is considerably brisker now with 6k on the clock, pulls from low down as well. However, my main criticism has been that it’s a bit soulless but the new one should fix that...
I have a 2.0 SEL-Nav and it’s just brilliant so I can’t wait to try the new one - although the review seems to be talking about more differences than Mazda have mentioned ?!?!
One word on the present 2.0 is that it definitely needs time to bed in, mine is considerably brisker now with 6k on the clock, pulls from low down as well. However, my main criticism has been that it’s a bit soulless but the new one should fix that...
mac96 said:
It's impossible not to bring one's prejudices to this comparison.
I test drove a GT86 when they first came out, as a possible replacement for an aging RX8. I really wanted to like it, and had I not had the RX8 I would definitely have bought the GT86.
But- it was certainly fun, but felt slower than the RX8; it felt much less special; it had less useable rear seats; it felt less well made than the RX8 (even comparing new against old) , and it seemed much easier to lose grip. It was better in town traffic that the RX8, but any number of other cars would have been better than either at that.
All subjective of course, apart from the rear seats, but enough to make me sure that it wasn't worth the cost difference.
None of the above proves than an MX5 is better than a GT86, but if I could have managed with only 2 seats at the time, I would have had an MX5 with no regrets. So the MX5 gets my vote!
I think that's probably fair.I test drove a GT86 when they first came out, as a possible replacement for an aging RX8. I really wanted to like it, and had I not had the RX8 I would definitely have bought the GT86.
But- it was certainly fun, but felt slower than the RX8; it felt much less special; it had less useable rear seats; it felt less well made than the RX8 (even comparing new against old) , and it seemed much easier to lose grip. It was better in town traffic that the RX8, but any number of other cars would have been better than either at that.
All subjective of course, apart from the rear seats, but enough to make me sure that it wasn't worth the cost difference.
None of the above proves than an MX5 is better than a GT86, but if I could have managed with only 2 seats at the time, I would have had an MX5 with no regrets. So the MX5 gets my vote!
The RX-8 was engineered closer to say an S2000's price point than that of the MX-5/86 and it shows it/feels it. Even for an older car.
BTW, the BRZ had stiffer ARBs than an 86, so if you want a less ridiculous (or fun) front/rear handling balance, perhaps you ought to give one of those a go.
After waiting years for the GT86 and BRZ to finally get released I got the chance to drive one up the hill at the UK launch at the Goodwood FOS - but they gave me an auto! 
Anyway I got a pension lump sum in April 2014 so I booked a test drive for my birthday that month, as you do!
I liked it, but its performance felt adequate rather than impressive - so I bought a BMW Z4 Coupe!
Then 6 months or so later I got an E46 325ti as a daily.
Are Japanese horses lazy, or are their kgs heavier?
GT86 with 200 bhp and weighing 1,238kg takes 7.7 seconds to get to 60 mph.
E46 325ti with 189 bhp and weighing 1,380kg gets to 62 mph in 7.1 seconds.
That revised MX5 looks like a much better idea.
Anyway I got a pension lump sum in April 2014 so I booked a test drive for my birthday that month, as you do!
I liked it, but its performance felt adequate rather than impressive - so I bought a BMW Z4 Coupe!
Then 6 months or so later I got an E46 325ti as a daily.
Are Japanese horses lazy, or are their kgs heavier?
GT86 with 200 bhp and weighing 1,238kg takes 7.7 seconds to get to 60 mph.
E46 325ti with 189 bhp and weighing 1,380kg gets to 62 mph in 7.1 seconds.
That revised MX5 looks like a much better idea.
Onehp said:
Great enjoyable article, PH all the way. These little cars really feel special to drive compared to most modern performance stuff.
Thanks! Good to know they respond well to some light tweaks, will have to do try them when I finally get my own...Honeywell said:
Good review,
The GT86 kicks as IF IF IF you stick on a sports exhaust and remap. Do that and it’s a strong and charismatic engine.
The manufacturers in Japan virtually beg you to tweak their cars to transform them.
Indeed. As much as I hated the stock engine, now I really miss it since it is gone, the FT86SF manifold and Milltek really tranformed the engine and it had real character to its sound, no other 4 banger comes close and many a (stock) six falls short too... The GT86 kicks as IF IF IF you stick on a sports exhaust and remap. Do that and it’s a strong and charismatic engine.
The manufacturers in Japan virtually beg you to tweak their cars to transform them.
I found the BRZ great. I've driven a couple as i ocassionally do some work for a Subaru dealer.
Proper low slung driving position , lovely wheel right ahead of you, facing you, not upwards etc (how many cars actually are like this? Not many!) Lovely snickety yet nicely weighted gearchage. Suprisingly good ride (IMO) and a nice sounding engine that IMO went pretty well!
Yes it's not crazy fast, but it's not slow.....just everyone has got used to the turbo oomph factor. I liked the 'piped in' sound and found the car tremendous fun to drive, it really did have that 'pivoting' feeling that journos go on about (i'm no Godlike helmsmith!)
I also personally liked the interior. It's quite....basic....and you could say dated (Toyota still seem to be still using those 80's lcd clocks!) but it was very tough in there and durable. Proper sporty supportive seats, too. Tiny seats in the back...but seats nevertheless, gives you that option for child emergencies of transporting adults with no legs.
To me...you could feel it had been designed from the off to be what it was. It's not a normal hatch based coupe that's been 'sportified'...it's just a small, 'proper' little coupe!
I also even found it decent on the juice! (if the computer is to be believed) When i'd stopped 'ragging' it around the twisties, i had a bit of motorway journey at 70-80mph at it was showing 40+mpg, which i thought was good.
It wasn't super quiet on the motorway....but was ok.
Anyway, i loved it. I drove a (then new) WRX on the same day...and whislt the WRX was much faster.....and more intense....the BRZ was the one that made me smile and feel 'involved' in the process.
However! - Saying all that, i haven't driven the ND MX-5 so i dont know what im missing there.....
Proper low slung driving position , lovely wheel right ahead of you, facing you, not upwards etc (how many cars actually are like this? Not many!) Lovely snickety yet nicely weighted gearchage. Suprisingly good ride (IMO) and a nice sounding engine that IMO went pretty well!
Yes it's not crazy fast, but it's not slow.....just everyone has got used to the turbo oomph factor. I liked the 'piped in' sound and found the car tremendous fun to drive, it really did have that 'pivoting' feeling that journos go on about (i'm no Godlike helmsmith!)
I also personally liked the interior. It's quite....basic....and you could say dated (Toyota still seem to be still using those 80's lcd clocks!) but it was very tough in there and durable. Proper sporty supportive seats, too. Tiny seats in the back...but seats nevertheless, gives you that option for child emergencies of transporting adults with no legs.
To me...you could feel it had been designed from the off to be what it was. It's not a normal hatch based coupe that's been 'sportified'...it's just a small, 'proper' little coupe!
I also even found it decent on the juice! (if the computer is to be believed) When i'd stopped 'ragging' it around the twisties, i had a bit of motorway journey at 70-80mph at it was showing 40+mpg, which i thought was good.
It wasn't super quiet on the motorway....but was ok.
Anyway, i loved it. I drove a (then new) WRX on the same day...and whislt the WRX was much faster.....and more intense....the BRZ was the one that made me smile and feel 'involved' in the process.
However! - Saying all that, i haven't driven the ND MX-5 so i dont know what im missing there.....
I couldn't care less how wonderful or fast the Toyota is, the fact remains the roof is fixed so it's no more than a glorified saloon
The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
WJNB said:
I couldn't care less how wonderful or fast the Toyota is, the fact remains the roof is fixed so it's no more than a glorified saloon
The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
Not sure if serious...The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
VeeFource said:
WJNB said:
I couldn't care less how wonderful or fast the Toyota is, the fact remains the roof is fixed so it's no more than a glorified saloon
The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
Not sure if serious...The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
M1C said:
VeeFource said:
WJNB said:
I couldn't care less how wonderful or fast the Toyota is, the fact remains the roof is fixed so it's no more than a glorified saloon
The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
Not sure if serious...The MX-5 is far more fun, will get you from A to B in nearer enough the same amount of time & you'll laugh all the way to the bank when it comes to running costs.
I have both, but then I compromise on comfort in seeking other delights.
Apples and Pears, no?
I'll take a GT86 any day of the week.
The MX-5, I appreciate it for what it is, but it's not for me. Years back I owned a Fiat 124 Sport Spider, I loved this car, until a mate took a photo of me in it. I looked like a big bloke (the car made you look bigger than you actually are) who'd borrowed his wife's car. I promptly sold it and haven't owned a convertible since
I'll take a GT86 any day of the week.
The MX-5, I appreciate it for what it is, but it's not for me. Years back I owned a Fiat 124 Sport Spider, I loved this car, until a mate took a photo of me in it. I looked like a big bloke (the car made you look bigger than you actually are) who'd borrowed his wife's car. I promptly sold it and haven't owned a convertible since
Matt Bird said:
Thanks! Good to know they respond well to some light tweaks, will have to do try them when I finally get my own...
It's surprising how much they can be improved with a few choice upgrades, and it's not too pricey either. Mine has a catless manifold and remap, which makes a huge amount of difference to the way it pulls in-gear. Overall I'm up 17bhp peak, but the big gain is 25% more torque around 4000rpm. It's one of the most common performance mods for the 86, and can be done for £1500 including fitting, labour, dyno time, and licences.Also, as good as the stock gearchange is - and it's really very good once it's warm - that can also be improved very cheaply. I have an aftermarket shift spring and gearbox mount, and the difference is a revelation. For well under £100, I'd advise anyone to have those done. It's a mod that goes under the radar but really improves the driving experience.
Lastly, tyres. Despite the GT86 being relatively low power, the stock tyres really can't handle it. You can easily light them up from standstill, and they're pretty atrocious in the wet. They also last forever so don't bother waiting for them to wear out before replacing them; after 20k miles including a handful of track days I still had about 5mm of tread.
sr.guiri said:
. Years back I owned a Fiat 124 Sport Spider, I loved this car, until a mate took a photo of me in it. I looked like a big bloke (the car made you look bigger than you actually are) who'd borrowed his wife's car. I promptly sold it and haven't owned a convertible since
I know but I too love open tops. Baseball cap and sunglasses mandatory
spikyone said:
Matt Bird said:
Thanks! Good to know they respond well to some light tweaks, will have to do try them when I finally get my own...
It's surprising how much they can be improved with a few choice upgrades, and it's not too pricey either. Mine has a catless manifold and remap, which makes a huge amount of difference to the way it pulls in-gear. Overall I'm up 17bhp peak, but the big gain is 25% more torque around 4000rpm. It's one of the most common performance mods for the 86, and can be done for £1500 including fitting, labour, dyno time, and licences.Also, as good as the stock gearchange is - and it's really very good once it's warm - that can also be improved very cheaply. I have an aftermarket shift spring and gearbox mount, and the difference is a revelation. For well under £100, I'd advise anyone to have those done. It's a mod that goes under the radar but really improves the driving experience.
Lastly, tyres. Despite the GT86 being relatively low power, the stock tyres really can't handle it. You can easily light them up from standstill, and they're pretty atrocious in the wet. They also last forever so don't bother waiting for them to wear out before replacing them; after 20k miles including a handful of track days I still had about 5mm of tread.
I didn't know about the shift mod - it's not at all bad, unless you're comparing it to the same 'box in the S2000 and then it does feel rather notchy.
The Michelin Primacies are are either fun or annoying, largely dependent upon one's mood.
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