RE: Porsche 928 GT 'Clubsport tribute': Spotted
Discussion
Olivera said:
330bhp, lightened and a manual 5-speed - do these actually go as well as the figures imply? Those figures suggest a very quick car even today, but I'm not so sure of the reality...
1580kg with lighter seats and aircon delete, plus a roll cage. Wonder how much it's been lightened?I went to buy a 1988 928 S4, for its looks, V8 and investment potential but came away extremely disappointed from the test drive. The bus sized steering wheel and the archaic 4 speed and performance that could only be described as glacial made me think I was driving a fairly slow lorry, not a Porsche masterpiece. Clearly something was amiss with this particular one, but made me realise that at least the automatic was not for me. A 928 GT or manual 928 GTS should be the pick.
JohnG1 said:
LordFlathead said:
;) It's my third XJS and as much as they have their flaws, behind the wheel is a nice place to be. This is the one of very last 1996 V12, 6.0 Litre Celebrations.
Sorry for the thread hijack, but that XJS is lovely...Superb car!
TwigtheWonderkid said:
It's no 928 though. It's a 30 year old car that wasn't very well built or reliable when new. No comparison to a 928 imho.
They most definitely got more reliable and better built through the decades, so a late 90s example should be just fine.It's also got a V12 and performance similar to the later 928s for half or less of the price, so it's most certainly got its plus points.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
JohnG1 said:
LordFlathead said:
;) It's my third XJS and as much as they have their flaws, behind the wheel is a nice place to be. This is the one of very last 1996 V12, 6.0 Litre Celebrations.
Sorry for the thread hijack, but that XJS is lovely...Superb car!
Both magnificent, and both likely to break at this age, both fantastic in their own ways.
No 928 was ever “glacial”, the original ones are 40 years old now and things move on.
rassi said:
I went to buy a 1988 928 S4, for its looks, V8 and investment potential but came away extremely disappointed from the test drive. The bus sized steering wheel and the archaic 4 speed and performance that could only be described as glacial made me think I was driving a fairly slow lorry, not a Porsche masterpiece. Clearly something was amiss with this particular one, but made me realise that at least the automatic was not for me. A 928 GT or manual 928 GTS should be the pick.
I think your comparison is a little bit harsh, in no way in a million years can a 928 S4 be compared to a fairly slow lorry, I presume that you left the car in D in which case it would make good headway rather than brutal. The auto box is pretty good but it can't read your mind. When pulling off in D it selects 2nd gear rather than 1st which explains why it will wait till 90mph before changing into 3rd if you are being lead footed, and will hold this until around 121mph when it will change into 4th, this fact ensures that at traffic lights it normally crushes the opposition when they go to change from 2nd and then into 3rd, before continuing onwards to approx 160mph with very little drama. The noise the V8 makes is quite intoxicating.If you select 1st gear at traffic lights and bury the pedal it quite happily spin both rear wheels such is the level of horsepower and torque that is available throughout the rev range should you decide to use it. Most owners are quite content to leave it in D and just savour the experience and rumble of the well designed and low-stressed 5 litre V8 engine with buckets of torque at low revs and a not inconsiderate 320+ horse-power at higher revs.
I note that you have owned several BMW M5 which kind of explains why you think the 928 is leisurely, but how many generations are we on since the 1970s when the 928 was first unveiled, and when most folks were driving around in Allegros, Marinas (of the 4 wheeled variety), or the Ford Capri and Escorts.
In the 1980s the bikes were getting faster and I owned one of the fastest around, but even that ran out of steam at about 125mph whilst the 928 would just be shifting into top gear. I did actually chase a 928 down a winding country lane on my bike and the damn thing just didn't slow down for the corners and went round them like it was on rails, being a bit of a nut-case in my earlier years I was mighty impressed with this level of performance!
I managed to wrangle a spin out in a manual 928 S2 in the mid 1980s and was astonished at how well it accelerated down the A1. The owner used to commute down to London on a daily basis so clocked up over 50,000 miles per year before buying another, he had bought several 911s in the past before moving on to the 928, he mentioned that after a long day at the office the last thing he wanted to drive was a 911, which although was considered a better 'drivers' car if you were in the mood to give it a good thrashing, it wasn't the most practical of vehicles, and demanded total concentration all of the time, whereas the 928 just drove you wherever you wanted to go in total luxury and minimal drama. It was light years ahead of anything of that era. It's closest rivals were of course the Jaguar XJS and the Merc 500 SEL or 500 SEC which were all a bit bland in comparison. The Jags were probably the best in terms of ride quality but they couldn't be relied upon to get you to your destination without breaking down which was a great shame, and the 5.3 V12 used to drink petrol on a scale that used to bring tears to the eyes, whereas the 928 was surprisingly frugal, which in layman terms meant you could drive considerable distances before having to refuel.
By all means look out for a good 928 GT which I am led to believe are all manuals, or the slightly larger engined GTS which were available in both auto or manual, plus there are a sprinkling of 928, S, S2 and S4 models in manual as well as automatic, but I think you will be sadly disappointed with the level of performance if you are comparing them to a modern generation M5 with nearly double the horsepower at your disposal along with all the nanny-state computer related safety features so prevalent in cars nowadays. The 928 was old-school in that respect and it didn't suffer fools gladly!
TwigtheWonderkid said:
It's no 928 though. It's a 30 year old car that wasn't very well built or reliable when new. No comparison to a 928 imho.
The Porsche is 27 years old. The Jaguar is not a 30 year old car, the Celebration model is built on the galvanised Aston Martin DB7 platform so rust is less of an issue and I am informed so it is at least 5 years newer technology than the Porsche. This later 5.0 litre Porsche V8 was made from joining two Porsche 944, 2.5 litre engines together, so the engine technology is only based around a 1987 engine design. The Jaguar has the 330hp 6 litre engine and the four speed auto box with electronic gearbox control so it's very equally matched to the 928 GT for power and torque. Both cars are proper Grand Tourers in specification, they are not sports cars. The Porsche has more immediate handling and turn in along with a better 50/50 weight distribution, but the Jaguar has the refinement and prestige quality. It did have the most silent ride if left standard, and the pace is acceptable right up to 160mph. The Porsche can muster 170 mph if you have time to kill but both are similar performance to 150mph. Both of my cars have exhaust modifications - The 928GT has a Y pipe with the CATs removed (I still have the originals) and as the car was built in 1991 it was the final year before CAT removal became illegal. Not sure how much power this adds but it is noticeable both in tone and performance. The XJS has the AJ6 Engineering middle box delete stainless steel bypass pipes and it growls. You can hear the engine inside the cabin but as it's a V12 I have no issues with this. Both cars turn heads but at classic car shows they both draw an equal crowd from very different target demographics.
"Twig The Wonder Kid"
I don't see any cars listed in your profile? Therefore I presume that you have never owned either a Porsche 928GT or an XJS Celebration V12? So stop the uneducated trolling comments or enlighten us with your superior knowledge from personal ownage experience, there's a good boy. Olivera said:
They most definitely got more reliable and better built through the decades, so a late 90s example should be just fine.
It's also got a V12 and performance similar to the later 928s for half or less of the price, so it's most certainly got its plus points.
Spot on Olivera. The last ones were pretty much sorted hence the reason I looked for the last 1996 model. There were only 42 right hand drive 6 Litres produced according to Jaguar Heritage which makes them very rare and very desirable.It's also got a V12 and performance similar to the later 928s for half or less of the price, so it's most certainly got its plus points.
Anyway, apologies to the OP for the off-topic hijack and I wish you the best of luck with the sale of your unique and very interesting 928
LordFlathead said:
I've just pulled mine out of storage. It needs some re-commissioning but it's all there. Mine has an extensive service history with over £25k in the folder! I bought her on here ten years ago and they really do get under your skin. It's a genuine GT too.
I just can't bear to part with it but I will have to choose between the XJS or this.. I said that this last year and nothing has changed so I guess I'll be keeping her. Insurance is £78 a year which is another reason not to sell. This is my 3rd 928.
Good chap - I do like a 928 in a colour, rather than white or black. It is also true about them getting under your skin. I've had a manual S4 about 2 years and have just had an engine-out, under bonnet refresh as I really can't think of anything to replace it with that's as fun and practical whilst feeling a bit special too. At least now my engine looks as good as it sounds...I just can't bear to part with it but I will have to choose between the XJS or this.. I said that this last year and nothing has changed so I guess I'll be keeping her. Insurance is £78 a year which is another reason not to sell. This is my 3rd 928.
I think this GT in the ad looks fantastic and has had enough fettling to make it proper value-for-money at that price.
LordFlathead said:
"Twig The Wonder Kid" I don't see any cars listed in your profile? Therefore I presume that you have never owned either a Porsche 928GT or an XJS Celebration V12? So stop the uneducated trolling comments or enlighten us with your superior knowledge from personal ownage experience, there's a good boy.
You are quite right, I haven't owned either. But I've worked on both, which I'm assuming you haven't. Because if you had, you'd know what I'm on about. The Porsche is in an entirely different league from the Jag, every single little clip, screw, connector, is over engineered and is of the highest quality. Thus the finished product feels like it's been hewn from granite. I don't see any cars listed in your profile? Therefore I presume that you have never owned either a Porsche 928GT or an XJS Celebration V12? So stop the uneducated trolling comments or enlighten us with your superior knowledge from personal ownage experience, there's a good boy. The Jag is just a good looking, pretty poorly assembled bag of bolts. This is just my opinion. I won't insult you for having a different one, because we're talking about cars, not bringing peace to the Middle East, and because I'm a grown up.
LordFlathead said:
I've just pulled mine out of storage. It needs some re-commissioning but it's all there. Mine has an extensive service history with over £25k in the folder! I bought her on here ten years ago and they really do get under your skin. It's a genuine GT too.
I just can't bear to part with it but I will have to choose between the XJS or this.. I said that this last year and nothing has changed so I guess I'll be keeping her. Insurance is £78 a year which is another reason not to sell. This is my 3rd 928.
Where do you live, 1978?I just can't bear to part with it but I will have to choose between the XJS or this.. I said that this last year and nothing has changed so I guess I'll be keeping her. Insurance is £78 a year which is another reason not to sell. This is my 3rd 928.
rich888 said:
In the 1980s the bikes were getting faster and I owned one of the fastest around, but even that ran out of steam at about 125mph whilst the 928 would just be shifting into top gear. I did actually chase a 928 down a winding country lane on my bike and the damn thing just didn't slow down for the corners and went round them like it was on rails, being a bit of a nut-case in my earlier years I was mighty impressed with this level of performance!
If you're going off topic I'd at least get your facts right. I had a 1984 GPZ 900 in the 80's, that bike would easily crack 150mph, and get there way quicker than a 928. TwigtheWonderkid said:
You are quite right, I haven't owned either. But I've worked on both, which I'm assuming you haven't. Because if you had, you'd know what I'm on about. The Porsche is in an entirely different league from the Jag, every single little clip, screw, connector, is over engineered and is of the highest quality. Thus the finished product feels like it's been hewn from granite.
This is correct.I found the same level of engineering difference between my '85 G Wagon and the Land Rover. It was quite shocking really.
Back on topic.
The GT handling is superb, feeling small and nimble compared to many oversized contemporary blobs.
Also feels faster than the stats.
PomBstard said:
Good chap - I do like a 928 in a colour, rather than white or black. It is also true about them getting under your skin. I've had a manual S4 about 2 years and have just had an engine-out, under bonnet refresh as I really can't think of anything to replace it with that's as fun and practical whilst feeling a bit special too. At least now my engine looks as good as it sounds...
I think this GT in the ad looks fantastic and has had enough fettling to make it proper value-for-money at that price.
I agree. The OP should not have an issue with the asking price because the car is unique and very well put together.I think this GT in the ad looks fantastic and has had enough fettling to make it proper value-for-money at that price.
Just wow! to your engine. I'm about to start the under-bonnet journey myself. My engine was rebuilt by Paul Anderson about seven years ago and is still top notch but I could do with re-plating and re-painting the shiny stuff and the engine cases. That is an extraordinary level of detail and I will be happy if I can get anywhere near that.
wolfracesonic said:
Where do you live, 1978?
I have a multi-wheeled classic policy with Footman James. I've thinned out the fleet recently, but last year I had two 6.0 litre XJS's, a Jaguar XJ 350, the 928GT, two Renault Espace's (one with a Rolls Royce Viper Jet engine!), and 19 classic motorcycles. The total premium was a tad over £650 - for all with agreed value. The key to the premium is mainly down to low overall mileage around 3000 miles per annum and a very secure storage facility for the motorcycles. I have a new Nismo 370Z and an electric car for the commute so that is how I keep the mileage down on the classics. I had driving to work as well which makes the policy great value for money. You need to be in a members club for each marque though and this knocks the overall cost up but the clubs are a great source of knowledge and meetings and also of parts. bruciebonuz said:
That's a great clip. When under full throttle the dual path plenums open up creating that wonderful induction noise from the 32 valve, quad cam, 5 litre V8. The GT benefits from a pair of wider duration and higher lift camshafts which adds to the visceral experience. They are a great drivers car when driven hard and they also drift really well.. don't ask me how I know 
LordFlathead said:
two Renault Espace's (one with a Rolls Royce Viper Jet engine!)...
Sorry (again) for thread hijack, but you really cannot just drop that into the conversation as an aside. Please - start another thread on the Renault Espace with a jet engine (something I never thought I'd write)Thanks!
blade7 said:
rich888 said:
In the 1980s the bikes were getting faster and I owned one of the fastest around, but even that ran out of steam at about 125mph whilst the 928 would just be shifting into top gear. I did actually chase a 928 down a winding country lane on my bike and the damn thing just didn't slow down for the corners and went round them like it was on rails, being a bit of a nut-case in my earlier years I was mighty impressed with this level of performance!
If you're going off topic I'd at least get your facts right. I had a 1984 GPZ 900 in the 80's, that bike would easily crack 150mph, and get there way quicker than a 928. The 928 was astonishingly well balanced on country lanes considering that it wasn't an out and out sports car, and it had the torque and horse-power to deal with accelerating hard out of corners. Those in the know simply left the auto box in 3rd on country lanes to stop the box from selecting 4th at the wrong moment, and this is why the manual boxes are regarded as the preferred type, when in reality the auto is ideally suited to the 5 litre V8 under the bonnet. It's laid back and relaxed when you want it to be, and a total thug when you floor the pedal. In essence it has a total Jekyll and Hyde personality.
I've owned several 928s over the years and have ridden various bikes over the same time period, the bikes are manic and the adrenalin kick cannot be matched by anything else that is street-legal, but the 928 always put a smile on my face from the moment I turned the key and starting the engine, to parking it back up again after a drive out just for the hell of it.
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