RE: BBC confirms live Formula E coverage

[TheBigUnit]

Formula E Salesperson: There’s no noise, no atmosphere, no speed and no fans.

BBC:

Formula E Salesperson: And no emissions..?

BBC: Where do we sign?

[PorkInsider]

200Plus Club said:

Fittster said:

Can't possibly be more dull than F1.

When do they start racing around Brum?

Oh it is, and by some margin. Imagine F1 if you will, but with no noise , spectacle, interest or pedigree.
Luckily I have some paint drying, quietly.

Yep.

However unlikely it may sound, it is indeed even more dull than F1.

[coppice]

God , what dinosaurs some folk are. I heard my first F1 engine live in 1971 and have attended - live- every type of motorsport from NASCAR to Autograss , F1 to drag racing - and the rest. I welcome the inclusion of Formula E - if it were the only show in town it'd be a tragedy but it isn't . It's close racing , lots of manufacturers and a different approach to its audience . About time , as every race meeting I attend feels like being in a hall of mirrors as it's full of tragic old gits like me.

My spine tingles every time I hear a T70 (or a Top Fueller, a T35 Bugatti or a 70s F2 car) and I am embarassingly close to tears when I hear a Ferrari 512 in full flight but the sport is far from being all about the noise . You don't even hear the noise when you watch it on TV (just a very, very pale approximation ) and as 99% of viewers will watch from their sofa who bloody cares if FE cars whine a bit? If you like pure racing - not DRS , undercut and overcut pitstop algorithm bks of 2018 F1- none is finer than Formula Ford 1600 , as has been true for 50 years . Noise? Generic Xflow bark and pops , you hear more noise on the high street from some parpastic AMG or M 4 . Does it affect the racing , does it matter it doesn't sound like a field of DFVs? Does it buggery ....

[Usget]

It's not the powerplants that bother me. I think it's pretty exciting to see how they can be developed. It's the quality of the racing that puts me off watching - I saw one in London a little while ago and honestly it was like watching Scalextric. Some slow cars following each other around a set path with no overtaking possible without a crash.

If they turned the wick up on them and ran them at Oulton Park I'd be glued to the TV.

[Blib]

Do they still have to switch cars half way through the race?

ETA: Note to self: Read the flippin article before posting.

[GroundEffect]

Usget said:

It's not the powerplants that bother me. I think it's pretty exciting to see how they can be developed. It's the quality of the racing that puts me off watching - I saw one in London a little while ago and honestly it was like watching Scalextric. Some slow cars following each other around a set path with no overtaking possible without a crash.

If they turned the wick up on them and ran them at Oulton Park I'd be glued to the TV.

The new car is significantly faster than previous seasons.

[tejr]

My interest in F1 declined over the years for various reasons, then they put those horrid engines in and they sounded crap - that was the last nail in the coffin.

FE adds a bit more interest in that there is some proper racing going on. But for the same reason I no longer watch F1, I can't watch FE. It just seems so tedious.

[Atomic12C]

SamR380 said:

Why don't they race on proper race tracks?

Because if they did race on proper circuits they'd show up as being very slow compared to alternative ICE formulas. The street circuits are designed to not have much of a straight section, instead many corners are designed to give the impression of 'action'.

Proper circuits are wide with space between the track for run off areas, this would have the effect of making the battery powered milk floats look quite slow.

But the other important thing, is that with battery powered milk float racing, where is the noise and the atmosphere?.... placing these things on to an open circuit all you'd hear are the birds singing, and squirrels playing with their nuts

[DavidStarkey11]

It'll be like watching porn on mute. Still watchable but not as good.

[coppice]

And what are these ICE equivalents? Aside from historic racing , where we have single seaters a-plenty , modern single seater racing in the UK is virtually extinct . An F3 series which is a very pale echo of what British F3 once was , F4 ( the BTCC support act which can induce narcolepsy ) and that's it outside club level Formula Jedi etc .

Outright speed is unimportant - or so I conclude from rubbing shoulders with 25, 000 BTCC fans whose cars lap far slower than many forty year old Clubmans' cars. Yet I watch the latter in the company of 2 men and a dog .

FE laps quick enough to attract near premier league drivers- and I don't even think noise is the issue some think it is . As I said above , many racing 'fans' don't leave their front rooms much and haven't a clue what a racing car sounds like anyway. So what is it ? Shock of the new , fear of change , innate conservatism - echoes of Sixties ' good ol'
boys aghast at rear engined cars at Indy ...?

Edited by coppice on Wednesday 14th November 10:20

[swisstoni]

We are probably seeing that last days of motorsport as we know it then, if so much of it is dependant on noise.
I experienced the screams of the old F1 engines at a few circuits. You had goosebumps before you actually saw the cars at all.

[Harji]

Pericoloso said:

Last chance saloon for some of the drivers.
F1 rejects.
WEC and DTM drivers with nowhere to go because their drive has disappeared from whichever series.
And some others with manufacturer allegiances who took the drive just to stay " onside".

There wasa time, when I thought of F1 drivers as supermen, the physicallity of driving a car at full speed, think Keke, Mansell, Senna, Prost, Schumacer,Hakkinen etc F1 always had pay drivers but the cream always rises to the top and most pay ddrivers were shown up for what they were.

Now, you have money buying seats big time, even teams outright, F1 no longer has a bigger talent pool IMO, of the drivers mentioned before, think of those that didn't win a WC, go back to the midfield drivers then and compare to now. It's no longer the field for the best drivers in the world but richest dads.

ETA: ALso the cas must be so much easier to drive , teenagers in them, I cannot believe the best drivers in the world fill all the seats in F1.

Edited by Harji on Wednesday 14th November 09:58

[Usget]

Atomic12C said:

SamR380 said:

Why don't they race on proper race tracks?

Because if they did race on proper circuits they'd show up as being very slow compared to alternative ICE formulas. The street circuits are designed to not have much of a straight section, instead many corners are designed to give the impression of 'action'.

Proper circuits are wide with space between the track for run off areas, this would have the effect of making the battery powered milk floats look quite slow.

But the other important thing, is that with battery powered milk float racing, where is the noise and the atmosphere?.... placing these things on to an open circuit all you'd hear are the birds singing, and squirrels playing with their nuts

That's not the actual reason. BTCC cars were slower than FE cars and they looked bloody rapid on park circuits.

The reason is that Liberty don't view this as a motorsport, as such. They view it as an "entertainment experience". Hence the RoboRace support, hence the eSports tie-in, hence taking it to city-centre venues where ICE vehicles are banned. They want to appeal to non car nerds - people not like us, basically. If it's tucked away in a grotty motorsport venue, they don't attract the families to spend money in the FanZone.

I know this contradicts what I posted above, but just because I understand it doesn't mean I have to like it.

[Mark Benson]

coppice said:

Outright speed is unimportant

As someone who's raced a Jedi and a C1 I have to agree, I've had more fun in a C1 in a single stint at Spa than I did in a season in a Jedi. However.....

coppice said:

So what is it ? Shock of the new , fear of change , innate conservatism - echoes of Sixties ' good ol'
boys aghast at rear engined cars at Indy ...?

I've tried to like it, but FE is (or at least was) dull racing. Not as dull as the F1 pantomime I'll grant you but that ceased to be about the racing a long time ago.
I like technology and I'm interested in the development of electric vehicles - I think a decent PHEV is the solution to many, many people's daily driver needs and I can see us getting one next time we change cars.

But on the evidence of FE so far, electric vehicles are not yet ready to form a race series around. Street circuits seldom make good places to race, the lack of runoff discourages overtaking and the lack of long straights means slipstreaming is impossible. I get why they want to use city centres - they don't have noise worries so why not take the racing to the people and hope to attract new fans - but on the evidence so far it's not working.
At the same time, they can't realistically go to 'famous' F1 circuits as they're set up for, well, F1 with huge open spaces which I guess discourages the organisers because, like it or not there will be unfavourable comparisons to F1 lap times. Club circuits would probably be the answer but I suspect marketing and manufacturer involvement precludes that.

I'll give this season a go, but it's going to have to improve a lot for me to stick with it.

[fernando the frog]

I think a BTCC style electric or hybrid car race series using production cars would be more interesting personally

[V8muscle]

ReaperCushions said:

The Birmingham Super Prix was the highlight of my childhood.. I'd love to see them race around there again.

Edit:

https://youtu.be/hamaRwRuhyM?t=114

The Monaco of the Midlands!

Edited by ReaperCushions on Tuesday 13th November 18:15

Totally agree, BSP was brilliant and I feel lucky to have experienced the event as a kid!

[unpc]

FE has been quite dull at times but now they've got rid of the car swap and turned the wick up a bit it should be a good deal better now. The racing has been ok at times too but the biggest issue so far is the tracks. Streets circuits are ok if they're designed correctly like, say, Baku. That's probably a bit big for FE though as they'd take a week to complete a lap.

[PorkInsider]

fernando the frog said:

I think a BTCC style electric or hybrid car race series using production cars would be more interesting personally

As would watching grass grow.

[coppice]

Very short sighted I think - if you really want to watch the grass grow , then try the typical BTCC support race . Or if you want entirely to lose the will to live try watching a nine car field of TCR drone round ...

Close , good racing has one thing in common- big grids, decent drivers and the opportunity to overtake on track. If FE delivers that , with a quieter sound track , then why not ?

Most of the sniping is the usual resentment of change . It sure ain't the lack of noise as TV doesn't even begin to convey the sound of racetrack noise .I bet people were saying the same in 1906 - ' horseless carriage racing ? Nah, I'll stick to the Derby mate '

[g3org3y]

coppice said:

Very short sighted I think - if you really want to watch the grass grow , then try the typical BTCC support race . Or if you want entirely to lose the will to live try watching a nine car field of TCR drone round ...

Close , good racing has one thing in common- big grids, decent drivers and the opportunity to overtake on track. If FE delivers that , with a quieter sound track , then why not ?

Most of the sniping is the usual resentment of change . It sure ain't the lack of noise as TV doesn't even begin to convey the sound of racetrack noise .I bet people were saying the same in 1906 - ' horseless carriage racing ? Nah, I'll stick to the Derby mate '

Bring back chariot racing!