RE: BMW 8 Series: (Not) UK Drive
Discussion
Paracetamol said:
Designs are signed off by committees of large car manufacturers...and so the nationality of the designer is a a non issue. The chief designer will have younger designers present 10 different variants and ask the bosses to sign off the one that's most liked.
The far east is hardly known for design classics. Japanese cars generally follow trends and date very quickly..and there is little coherent design language between the various models in their ranges. Where there is..say Lexus..it a just lotus of lines everywhere and jewellery but with little substance.
BMW seemed to be getting it right for a while but the last few seem to be a bit half baked. I get the feeling that anything sells in China and so no one seems that bothered to do a great job right now..except perhaps Mercedes.
Not so sure Mercedes new design language on the new cls and a class looks just weird.The far east is hardly known for design classics. Japanese cars generally follow trends and date very quickly..and there is little coherent design language between the various models in their ranges. Where there is..say Lexus..it a just lotus of lines everywhere and jewellery but with little substance.
BMW seemed to be getting it right for a while but the last few seem to be a bit half baked. I get the feeling that anything sells in China and so no one seems that bothered to do a great job right now..except perhaps Mercedes.
Amizade said:
Had a lap of Road Atlanta as passenger in a M850 (with a good driver), it felt swift, planted & quite nice .
But more suited to rocking up to the golf course than a circuit & design in the flesh is at best meh.
Not sure track aptitude is high on the list of 'must-haves' for a large 1900kg 4-seat GT?But more suited to rocking up to the golf course than a circuit & design in the flesh is at best meh.
It looks pretty decent, quite muscular lines. The intakes, vents, diffuser styling look quite sporty/aggressive, so generally I like that given that it has the performance to justify it. The rear end is okay but there's a busy/fussy look about it (even by the modern standards of car design that I'm judging it on). I might consider one when they are £5k. 
sidesauce said:
eally?? Ok - Toyota 200GT, Nissan 240Z, Mazda MX-5 mk1, Mazda Cosmo 110, Subaru Impreza WRX... that was just off the top of my head and I could go on.
Yes that's all of them..and now something in this century? Any way it's fine. the rear bumper treatment of the new 8 makes me hideously angry. I have the pleasure of interacting with designers from time to time and not one would design anything as unresolved as that. The rest of the car is ok..but it's no S Class Coupe or Porsche 992..so I will simply vote with my cheque book on this one..or hope that one of the aftermarket companies fixes it (Alpina, AC Schnitzer etc).
Edited by Paracetamol on Tuesday 4th December 10:41
Ares said:
Really? Hideously angry? You need Camomile tea. Or Weed.
I really hoped I would like this car. it ticks all my boxes as a daily driver..I have a feeling that some senior BMW said the original rear was too bland and so the design team designed that lower rear diffuser. It really makes me angry. I can't say it any other way. I feel the same about ruin flats. BMW sometimes does daft stuff..
Edited by Paracetamol on Tuesday 4th December 10:41
Ares said:
Robert-nszl1 said:
You'd have to be one hell of a BMW fan to buy this over the competition.
What (new) competition?But nobody sane thinks they must have a new car surely? Certainly not a new one these, even with the discounts. If you know about cars, you'll know it's just a 6 series, if you don't I suspect you'd go for something which looks better, or has a premium badge on the bonnet. The target audience for this is miniscule
Robert-nszl1 said:
Ares said:
Robert-nszl1 said:
You'd have to be one hell of a BMW fan to buy this over the competition.
What (new) competition?But nobody sane thinks they must have a new car surely? Certainly not a new one these, even with the discounts. If you know about cars, you'll know it's just a 6 series, if you don't I suspect you'd go for something which looks better, or has a premium badge on the bonnet. The target audience for this is miniscule
The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
Ares said:
I had a 640d, it's one of the best cars I've ever owned (current car aside) - as a cruiser/GT/Family steed, it's unbeatable. I bought it new. I wasn't alone. The 840d is only c£7k more.
The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
I don't know how old you are, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think this isn't 'old man'...The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
At the end of the day it's all about personal taste. You think a Merc is old man, I think a BMW coupe is shiny suited salesman. Many think Conti GTs are driven by footballers. The reality is the Maserati is the best of the lot. Lacks the tech, but frankly who cares, isn't autopilot for aircraft? The Maser looks the best, sounds the best, has enough power for UK roads, and most European, and has plenty of space in the back and boot.....
Robert-nszl1 said:
Ares said:
I had a 640d, it's one of the best cars I've ever owned (current car aside) - as a cruiser/GT/Family steed, it's unbeatable. I bought it new. I wasn't alone. The 840d is only c£7k more.
The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
I don't know how old you are, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think this isn't 'old man'...The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
At the end of the day it's all about personal taste. You think a Merc is old man, I think a BMW coupe is shiny suited salesman. Many think Conti GTs are driven by footballers. The reality is the Maserati is the best of the lot. Lacks the tech, but frankly who cares, isn't autopilot for aircraft? The Maser looks the best, sounds the best, has enough power for UK roads, and most European, and has plenty of space in the back and boot.....
). The Merc however is more the silver fox demographic, IME.And I agree, the Maserati is the more attractive car....but not for the person that wants a £70k GT, they start at £95k. There is also the far higher running costs and niggling reliability doubts (I speak as someone that swapped the 640d for an Alfa QV!).
Money no object, I'd probably have the Bentley as the GT option.
Ares said:
I wouldn't disagree that the 8 (and the 6) is for the older owner - I'm in my 40s, and seem typical of 6-series owners age (none of whom own a shiny suit ). The Merc however is more the silver fox demographic, IME.
I'm 45 and I enjoy taking the Mercedes for a service because I'm always the youngest in there by about 25 years(makes me feel young again). Mercedes are definitely an older person brand from what I've experienced. ). The Merc however is more the silver fox demographic, IME.Also the car constantly tells you what the speed limit is, and it also tells you if you're too close to the car in front. I've never had that in any other car, and I think its there to help the elderly drivers who might be slowly losing their marbles(I find it massively irritating).
Ares said:
Robert-nszl1 said:
Ares said:
I had a 640d, it's one of the best cars I've ever owned (current car aside) - as a cruiser/GT/Family steed, it's unbeatable. I bought it new. I wasn't alone. The 840d is only c£7k more.
The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
I don't know how old you are, but I think you are kidding yourself if you think this isn't 'old man'...The S-Class is HUGE, and very 'old man'. It also starts at £104,000. If this has similar rear legroom to the 6, it's more than passable, and a world better than a 911 or LC - neither of which are really pure GTs. This is.
At the end of the day it's all about personal taste. You think a Merc is old man, I think a BMW coupe is shiny suited salesman. Many think Conti GTs are driven by footballers. The reality is the Maserati is the best of the lot. Lacks the tech, but frankly who cares, isn't autopilot for aircraft? The Maser looks the best, sounds the best, has enough power for UK roads, and most European, and has plenty of space in the back and boot.....
). The Merc however is more the silver fox demographic, IME.And I agree, the Maserati is the more attractive car....but not for the person that wants a £70k GT, they start at £95k. There is also the far higher running costs and niggling reliability doubts (I speak as someone that swapped the 640d for an Alfa QV!).
Money no object, I'd probably have the Bentley as the GT option.
My sadness is that Jaguar don't make a big 4 seat coupe. I recognise they are probably short of funds to develop such a car, but a big (ok even bigger!) F type would be a great addition. I assume it could be built off the new XJ platform due out next year.
But the coupe I most want to see is the Alfa Giulia. Different type of car of course, but as the owner of a 1972 GTV I will struggle not to find space for one.
Robert-nszl1 said:
I was pulling your leg a bit about shiny suits, so well spotted! I'm assuming you can get great deals on Maser GTs at the moment, it's such an old model now?
My sadness is that Jaguar don't make a big 4 seat coupe. I recognise they are probably short of funds to develop such a car, but a big (ok even bigger!) F type would be a great addition. I assume it could be built off the new XJ platform due out next year.
But the coupe I most want to see is the Alfa Giulia. Different type of car of course, but as the owner of a 1972 GTV I will struggle not to find space for one.
You'd be surprised on the Maserati. They continually refresh it, and it doesn't attract that much of a discount. I looked at a Ghibli S when I got the Alfa, lovely cars, but they are fairly resolute on pricing. Leasing on certain models was a little more financially incentivised, but not by a huge amount. Fair play to them, they are protecting their brand rather than selling out!My sadness is that Jaguar don't make a big 4 seat coupe. I recognise they are probably short of funds to develop such a car, but a big (ok even bigger!) F type would be a great addition. I assume it could be built off the new XJ platform due out next year.
But the coupe I most want to see is the Alfa Giulia. Different type of car of course, but as the owner of a 1972 GTV I will struggle not to find space for one.
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