RE: Toyota Supra production model leaks (again)
Discussion
vz-r_dave said:
Coming from a 1 series owner..... PH jokers
GingerPixel said:
The headlamps could do with being 10% smaller, as its eyes are a little close together but generally I like it. Should come with TE37s as standard.
It harks back to the MkIV to me with the big lights, I like it and hope that Toyota go on to release more interesting stuff. 
Stamford78 said:
Toyota not capable of building the engine?
It appears much of Toyota's most senior engineers behind the JZ platform have long retired, and replaced by personnel who either are hampered with a limited budget or they simply just cannot hold a candle to their predecessors.For a corporation that nets 20+ Billion USD, it's a mystery why Toyota developed the new Supra in such a measured and somewhat elusive way.
TwinExit said:
Stamford78 said:
Toyota not capable of building the engine?
It appears much of Toyota's most senior engineers behind the JZ platform have long retired, and replaced by personnel who either are hampered with a limited budget or they simply just cannot hold a candle to their predecessors.For a corporation that nets 20+ Billion USD, it's a mystery why Toyota developed the new Supra in such a measured and somewhat elusive way.
Chestrockwell said:
I actually really like this, I like the idea and would possibly buy one in the future however, I can’t help but think 340 bhp is too low, the most powerful Toyota you can buy today is the GT86 and the rest are FWD CVT Hybrids, I wish they went a bit mental and shook up the sports car sector like Nissan did with the GTR
if its anything like the bmw (x)40 then they will dyno closer to the 360 
Blah blah "BMW not Toyota". *cry moan whinge*
It looks exactly how I thought it would look under the crappy 'came' that actually camouflaged nothing at all. So not so bad! I think the design will be very wheel sensitive to ensure it doesn't look to lardy from the profile view, but then that's true of almost all cars.
With regards this being a BMW:
It looks exactly how I thought it would look under the crappy 'came' that actually camouflaged nothing at all. So not so bad! I think the design will be very wheel sensitive to ensure it doesn't look to lardy from the profile view, but then that's true of almost all cars.
With regards this being a BMW:
Toyota Engineer said:
...Kai said that his development team hasn't discussed the cars with anyone from BMW in four years. "We agreed on the packaging," Kai said at a Supra event in Madrid, "like where is the hip-point of the driver, what's the wheelbase, the width, where's the fuel tank, where's the A-pillar, this was around the middle of 2014. After that we completely separated our team. After that, no communication with each other."...Reportedly, Kai's team has little to no knowledge of the new Z4, apart from the platform. There are a host of shared components developed for both cars, but to the Toyota team, it's not that clear how many of those will actually have been used in the finished Z4.
The BMW B58 engine began series production in 2015, so by mid-2014 it could have been ready to be handed over to Toyota engineers in a crate labeled "Use This for Supra, This Side Up."
If it can be believed, the entire detached-development story reads like it's simply a positive thing. Instead of just shaping the BMW-related car with a Toyota design language, yet having everything under the skin act identically, Toyota has been able to take the agreed-upon hardware and work it into the direction it sees as the best fit for a car called a Toyota Supra. Masayuki Kai underlined that suspension tuning, throttle response and shifting action have been given as much a Toyota feel as possible — and as seen during our test drive with a prototype G20 3-series, which will share the BMW straight-six engine used the Supra, steering weight and suspension settings can be software adjusted to such a great extent even on the fly that it can feel like a different car for different drivers.
And given the result of this component sharing will be a vehicle that is '718 affordable' rather than '911 affordable', it hardly seems a big fricken deal, does it?The BMW B58 engine began series production in 2015, so by mid-2014 it could have been ready to be handed over to Toyota engineers in a crate labeled "Use This for Supra, This Side Up."
If it can be believed, the entire detached-development story reads like it's simply a positive thing. Instead of just shaping the BMW-related car with a Toyota design language, yet having everything under the skin act identically, Toyota has been able to take the agreed-upon hardware and work it into the direction it sees as the best fit for a car called a Toyota Supra. Masayuki Kai underlined that suspension tuning, throttle response and shifting action have been given as much a Toyota feel as possible — and as seen during our test drive with a prototype G20 3-series, which will share the BMW straight-six engine used the Supra, steering weight and suspension settings can be software adjusted to such a great extent even on the fly that it can feel like a different car for different drivers.
SonicShadow said:
A careful approach and not sinking many millions into the development of a brand new performance straight six that will only be used in the Supra, which is not going to be a huge volume seller, is one of the reasons they are netting so many dollaridoos.
That's great news if all you care about is maximum financial performance and your take home salary is augmented by those results, you can then afford to splash out on that Maybach Mercedes.A careful approach that produces a car that is already been dismissed on every aspect except for the prospect of an occasional trackday will just harm the Toyota sporting credentials even further, and would probably kill the Supra brand for life.
Edited by TwinExit on Wednesday 12th December 16:17
First look without camo..... still looks like the aspect ratios are all wrong. Car looks to high for its width - or should that be too thin for its height?
Bonnet length compared to the rest of the car still looks out of proportion.
Much wrong with the MkV in my opinion - in terms of its looks.
Bonnet length compared to the rest of the car still looks out of proportion.
Much wrong with the MkV in my opinion - in terms of its looks.
PhantomPH said:
Blah blah "BMW not Toyota". *cry moan whinge*
It looks exactly how I thought it would look under the crappy 'came' that actually camouflaged nothing at all. So not so bad! I think the design will be very wheel sensitive to ensure it doesn't look to lardy from the profile view, but then that's true of almost all cars.
With regards this being a BMW:
The location of the A pillar and fuel tank is not the issue here, it's the fundamental shortcomings of using a platform spec'd for moderate performance and limited seating capacity. This means it's unlikely it can support a suitable power train for high performance (i.e bigger motor, more durable transmission, 4WD) to compete with the big boys.It looks exactly how I thought it would look under the crappy 'came' that actually camouflaged nothing at all. So not so bad! I think the design will be very wheel sensitive to ensure it doesn't look to lardy from the profile view, but then that's true of almost all cars.
With regards this being a BMW:
Toyota Engineer said:
...Kai said that his development team hasn't discussed the cars with anyone from BMW in four years. "We agreed on the packaging," Kai said at a Supra event in Madrid, "like where is the hip-point of the driver, what's the wheelbase, the width, where's the fuel tank, where's the A-pillar, this was around the middle of 2014. After that we completely separated our team. After that, no communication with each other."...Reportedly, Kai's team has little to no knowledge of the new Z4, apart from the platform. There are a host of shared components developed for both cars, but to the Toyota team, it's not that clear how many of those will actually have been used in the finished Z4.
The BMW B58 engine began series production in 2015, so by mid-2014 it could have been ready to be handed over to Toyota engineers in a crate labeled "Use This for Supra, This Side Up."
If it can be believed, the entire detached-development story reads like it's simply a positive thing. Instead of just shaping the BMW-related car with a Toyota design language, yet having everything under the skin act identically, Toyota has been able to take the agreed-upon hardware and work it into the direction it sees as the best fit for a car called a Toyota Supra. Masayuki Kai underlined that suspension tuning, throttle response and shifting action have been given as much a Toyota feel as possible — and as seen during our test drive with a prototype G20 3-series, which will share the BMW straight-six engine used the Supra, steering weight and suspension settings can be software adjusted to such a great extent even on the fly that it can feel like a different car for different drivers.
And given the result of this component sharing will be a vehicle that is '718 affordable' rather than '911 affordable', it hardly seems a big fricken deal, does it?The BMW B58 engine began series production in 2015, so by mid-2014 it could have been ready to be handed over to Toyota engineers in a crate labeled "Use This for Supra, This Side Up."
If it can be believed, the entire detached-development story reads like it's simply a positive thing. Instead of just shaping the BMW-related car with a Toyota design language, yet having everything under the skin act identically, Toyota has been able to take the agreed-upon hardware and work it into the direction it sees as the best fit for a car called a Toyota Supra. Masayuki Kai underlined that suspension tuning, throttle response and shifting action have been given as much a Toyota feel as possible — and as seen during our test drive with a prototype G20 3-series, which will share the BMW straight-six engine used the Supra, steering weight and suspension settings can be software adjusted to such a great extent even on the fly that it can feel like a different car for different drivers.
Because of this, they have use the 'native' BMW 3 litre 6 pot, which is not sufficient today with a 1500+ kerb weight and pegs this car in the performance class of a modern hot hatch. In the cliche that is the real world, it actually falls short against the 4WD shopping carts.
TwinExit said:
Because of this, they have use the 'native' BMW 3 litre 6 pot, which is not sufficient today with a 1500+ kerb weight and pegs this car in the performance class of a modern hot hatch. In the cliche that is the real world, it actually falls short against the 4WD shopping carts.
First drive reviews that I've read are very positive, so I'll consider those opinions rather than your un-informed ramblings.The new Z4 M40i put in a nurburgring time quicker than the M2, so I'd expect a hard-top Supra to go faster still. So that's quicker than your average hot hatch.
Perhaps I'm the only one, but this Supra will offer far greater out the box performance than a Mk 4, which was a fat boulevard cruiser that only impressed fast and the furious fans.
Olivera said:
TwinExit said:
Because of this, they have use the 'native' BMW 3 litre 6 pot, which is not sufficient today with a 1500+ kerb weight and pegs this car in the performance class of a modern hot hatch. In the cliche that is the real world, it actually falls short against the 4WD shopping carts.
First drive reviews that I've read are very positive, so I'll consider those opinions rather than your un-informed ramblings.The new Z4 M40i put in a nurburgring time quicker than the M2, so I'd expect a hard-top Supra to go faster still. So that's quicker than your average hot hatch.
Perhaps I'm the only one, but this Supra will offer far greater out the box performance than a Mk 4, which was a fat boulevard cruiser that only impressed fast and the furious fans.
Olivera said:
First drive reviews that I've read are very positive, so I'll consider those opinions rather than your un-informed ramblings.
Reviews do not disprove the maths, a modern halo hot hatch will kill your theoretically owned Supra from standstill and during damp conditions, and evidence would be uploaded on youtube by the time you arrive home. Olivera said:
The new Z4 M40i put in a nurburgring time quicker than the M2, so I'd expect a hard-top Supra to go faster still. So that's quicker than your average hot hatch.
Nurburgring times are achieved by professional racing drivers under ideal conditions, none of this translates to how capable a car is 365 days a year on the road driven by magazine reading advocates like yourself. Olivera said:
Perhaps I'm the only one, but this Supra will offer far greater out the box performance than a Mk 4, which was a fat boulevard cruiser that only impressed fast and the furious fans.
Yes you are the only one. The MKIV pushed 300-350 HP standard back in 1993 and were a threat to Porsche and Ferrari, let alone the hot-hatch of the times.Edited by TwinExit on Wednesday 12th December 17:10
TwinExit said:
Olivera said:
First drive reviews that I've read are very positive, so I'll consider those opinions rather than your un-informed ramblings.
Reviews do not disprove the maths, a modern halo hot hatch will kill this Supra from standstill and during damp conditions, and evidence would be uploaded on youtube by the time you arrive home. Olivera said:
The new Z4 M40i put in a nurburgring time quicker than the M2, so I'd expect a hard-top Supra to go faster still. So that's quicker than your average hot hatch.
Nurburgring times are achieved by professional racing drivers under ideal conditions, none of this translates to how capable a car is 365 days a year on the road driven by magazine reading advocates like yourself. Olivera said:
Perhaps I'm the only one, but this Supra will offer far greater out the box performance than a Mk 4, which was a fat boulevard cruiser that only impressed fast and the furious fans.
Yes you are the only one. The MKIV pushed 300-350 HP standard back in 1993 and were a threat to Porsche and Ferrari, let alone the hot-hatch of the times.MK4 supra in 1993 was not competing with hot hatches as they rarely had over 150bhp or the ability to put that power down if they had more
proper supercar of the time
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