Smart motorway rollout to be stopped?
Discussion
ingenieur said:
BlackWidow13 said:
The (f
king) M4 smart motorway upgrade is anything but.
For a few years now, coming out of London one comes down off the two lane elevated section, past the last average speed cam, then hit the NSL three lane section. That lasted only a few miles before average speed cams and a 50mph limit took you all the way to J12 at Thatcham while a “smart” [sic] motorway was installed by way of “upgrade” [sic]. Very boring.
The first section has now been completed. There are gantries and hadecs 3 cameras mounted on some of them out at least as far as Windsor.
However.
You come off the elevated two lane section and hit the three lane derestricted sign, so 70mph.
Then within a couple of miles you come to a 50mph advisory. That’s been on for about a month now. With a 1/4 you pass an average speed cam. No signage to say “camera not in use”. Within another 1/4 you go under a large screen on an arm with a “60” in a red circle. So a 60 limit.
Thereafter the smart overhead gantries show 60. Some of them have hadecs 3 cameras on them. But there are also average speed cams along the side of the carriageway.
Those 60mph mandatory limits have been in place every time I’ve used the M4 in the last month.
So it appears that the M4 has been “upgraded” with a permanent temporary 60mph limit, irrespective of traffics conditions. And is policed by both hadecs 3 and average cams (something I’ve not seen anywhere else) over quite a considerable chunk of its length.
Smart upgrade my arse.
Yeah I did the M4 today. Nailed it coming out of London and then almost straight away you're into 'smart' territory and even at 8am it was set at 50mph. king) M4 smart motorway upgrade is anything but. For a few years now, coming out of London one comes down off the two lane elevated section, past the last average speed cam, then hit the NSL three lane section. That lasted only a few miles before average speed cams and a 50mph limit took you all the way to J12 at Thatcham while a “smart” [sic] motorway was installed by way of “upgrade” [sic]. Very boring.
The first section has now been completed. There are gantries and hadecs 3 cameras mounted on some of them out at least as far as Windsor.
However.
You come off the elevated two lane section and hit the three lane derestricted sign, so 70mph.
Then within a couple of miles you come to a 50mph advisory. That’s been on for about a month now. With a 1/4 you pass an average speed cam. No signage to say “camera not in use”. Within another 1/4 you go under a large screen on an arm with a “60” in a red circle. So a 60 limit.
Thereafter the smart overhead gantries show 60. Some of them have hadecs 3 cameras on them. But there are also average speed cams along the side of the carriageway.
Those 60mph mandatory limits have been in place every time I’ve used the M4 in the last month.
So it appears that the M4 has been “upgraded” with a permanent temporary 60mph limit, irrespective of traffics conditions. And is policed by both hadecs 3 and average cams (something I’ve not seen anywhere else) over quite a considerable chunk of its length.
Smart upgrade my arse.
I think if a political party were to stand promising an end to speed limit erosion they'd get a fair hearing. It's getting effing ridiculous.
M27 observations are that the traffic volume is never high enough that a 4th lane is warranted now. I find lane discipline to be worse, even when speed is not limited there are people sat in lane 3 well under the speed limit with empty lanes to their left.
Yesterday there was a broken down car stopped in in lane 1 within spitting distance of one of the gantry's, no speed restriction, lane clousre signs etc, que a bunch of traffic all braking and dropping 20mph in speed as they negioated lane changes and made space for each other stc. SO the exact scenario that the "smart" system is meant to handle, right under its nose appears not to work. And they spent how much on this ?
Yesterday there was a broken down car stopped in in lane 1 within spitting distance of one of the gantry's, no speed restriction, lane clousre signs etc, que a bunch of traffic all braking and dropping 20mph in speed as they negioated lane changes and made space for each other stc. SO the exact scenario that the "smart" system is meant to handle, right under its nose appears not to work. And they spent how much on this ?
Crafty_ said:
M27 observations are that the traffic volume is never high enough that a 4th lane is warranted now. I find lane discipline to be worse, even when speed is not limited there are people sat in lane 3 well under the speed limit with empty lanes to their left.
Yesterday there was a broken down car stopped in in lane 1 within spitting distance of one of the gantry's, no speed restriction, lane clousre signs etc, que a bunch of traffic all braking and dropping 20mph in speed as they negioated lane changes and made space for each other stc. SO the exact scenario that the "smart" system is meant to handle, right under its nose appears not to work. And they spent how much on this ?
I believe the time factor involved in the detection of a stranded vehicle and the subsequent displays being activated is one of the major arguments fielded by the anti-smart motorway brigade. There was a big thing on Watchdog (I think) a while back where a woman was killed due to being stranded on a smart motorway and getting hit from behind by a lorry. The system needs to be near instant, not a minute or even 30 second delay. Yesterday there was a broken down car stopped in in lane 1 within spitting distance of one of the gantry's, no speed restriction, lane clousre signs etc, que a bunch of traffic all braking and dropping 20mph in speed as they negioated lane changes and made space for each other stc. SO the exact scenario that the "smart" system is meant to handle, right under its nose appears not to work. And they spent how much on this ?
I'm not against Smart Motorways as such. I quite like the idea of the switchable hard shoulders and speed management for the greater good but the "ALR" (all lanes running) parts need changing. Having nowhere to go if you've got trouble is terrifying. I broke down on the M62 when it was in the building process, right on Jct 11 in mid rush hour. I s**t myself. I had no idea what to do or where to go. Do I pull over to lane 1 through 2 lanes of traffic and block them up, do I stop in lane 3, pull into what central reservation I can? I ended up pulling into lane 1 and managing to scurry into the relative safety of a works entrance but that's not an option now. I guess you'd just have to pray you could reach a junction or one of these infrequent laybys they have built. If you can't reach a layby, I suppose you pull your seatbelt tight, close your eyes and pray to whatever deity you believe in to keep you safe.
This morning on the way into work at 5:30am, NSL, then 60 (past the camera) then NSL after the junction, not a sign of a traffic incident, this is why people don't slow down.
Last night on the way home, random person walking down the same motorway towards the traffic, nothing, car stopped in lane 1, 60 / 50 / 40, multiple people going past at a minimum of 80 and braking hard as the traffic merged, then on the next part of the Motorway a random motorist using one of the only pieces of hard shoulder left on as a 5th lane at 70mph until they came off at the junction, that one was probably because that section of motorway used to be the exit slip road, for all I know they do it every night...
Last night on the way home, random person walking down the same motorway towards the traffic, nothing, car stopped in lane 1, 60 / 50 / 40, multiple people going past at a minimum of 80 and braking hard as the traffic merged, then on the next part of the Motorway a random motorist using one of the only pieces of hard shoulder left on as a 5th lane at 70mph until they came off at the junction, that one was probably because that section of motorway used to be the exit slip road, for all I know they do it every night...
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