RE: BMW E46 M3 CSL: Spotted
Discussion
Gameface said:
What was the problem?
All sorts. And I know this will be at odds with most reviews, but ....The car doesn’t feel “at one” or coherent. Eg, the steering is very quick, but the rest of the car feels lazy, as an example, in any mode other than race, gear changes were engaged too quickly (before allowing the car to be revved out).
In order to get the best from the engine, it had to be in race mode, and in that mode, traction control is off. There wasn’t an option to turn it on. So I never managed to feel it was in a spirited driving mode with traction on.
The brakes were truly awful. Especially at low speeds. Never knew if you’d engaged them or not, and were very slow to respond, which made you then stamp on them.
Damping wasn’t great.
And the rear end was very inconsistent. Quite difficult to get the arse out most of the time, and sometimes it would decide to make it easy, which meant I never quite knew where I was with it.
Nice noise, beautiful exterior, very average car.
Alpinestars said:
Gameface said:
What was the problem?
All sorts. And I know this will be at odds with most reviews, but ....The car doesn’t feel “at one” or coherent. Eg, the steering is very quick, but the rest of the car feels lazy, as an example, in any mode other than race, gear changes were engaged too quickly (before allowing the car to be revved out).
In order to get the best from the engine, it had to be in race mode, and in that mode, traction control is off. There wasn’t an option to turn it on. So I never managed to feel it was in a spirited driving mode with traction on.
The brakes were truly awful. Especially at low speeds. Never knew if you’d engaged them or not, and were very slow to respond, which made you then stamp on them.
Damping wasn’t great.
And the rear end was very inconsistent. Quite difficult to get the arse out most of the time, and sometimes it would decide to make it easy, which meant I never quite knew where I was with it.
Nice noise, beautiful exterior, very average car.
Alpinestars said:
All sorts. And I know this will be at odds with most reviews, but ....
The car doesn’t feel “at one” or coherent. Eg, the steering is very quick, but the rest of the car feels lazy, as an example, in any mode other than race, gear changes were engaged too quickly (before allowing the car to be revved out).
In order to get the best from the engine, it had to be in race mode, and in that mode, traction control is off. There wasn’t an option to turn it on. So I never managed to feel it was in a spirited driving mode with traction on.
The brakes were truly awful. Especially at low speeds. Never knew if you’d engaged them or not, and were very slow to respond, which made you then stamp on them.
Damping wasn’t great.
The shocks on these are Sachs units, a Euros budget unit, the same units as the M3, but re valved to suit the CSLs lighter weight. I fitted new Sachs shocks to my E46 M3 and @ just 12,000 miles, they were well past their best. I should have fitted Koni or Bilsteins. I know from driving other M3s that decent shocks ( And springs ) are a Must have on these cars.
And the rear end was very inconsistent. Quite difficult to get the arse out most of the time, and sometimes it would decide to make it easy, which meant I never quite knew where I was with it.
Nice noise, beautiful exterior, very average car.
The car doesn’t feel “at one” or coherent. Eg, the steering is very quick, but the rest of the car feels lazy, as an example, in any mode other than race, gear changes were engaged too quickly (before allowing the car to be revved out).
In order to get the best from the engine, it had to be in race mode, and in that mode, traction control is off. There wasn’t an option to turn it on. So I never managed to feel it was in a spirited driving mode with traction on.
The brakes were truly awful. Especially at low speeds. Never knew if you’d engaged them or not, and were very slow to respond, which made you then stamp on them.
Damping wasn’t great.
The shocks on these are Sachs units, a Euros budget unit, the same units as the M3, but re valved to suit the CSLs lighter weight. I fitted new Sachs shocks to my E46 M3 and @ just 12,000 miles, they were well past their best. I should have fitted Koni or Bilsteins. I know from driving other M3s that decent shocks ( And springs ) are a Must have on these cars.
And the rear end was very inconsistent. Quite difficult to get the arse out most of the time, and sometimes it would decide to make it easy, which meant I never quite knew where I was with it.
Nice noise, beautiful exterior, very average car.
Alpinestars said:
Gameface said:
What was the problem?
All sorts. And I know this will be at odds with most reviews, but ....The car doesn’t feel “at one” or coherent. Eg, the steering is very quick, but the rest of the car feels lazy, as an example, in any mode other than race, gear changes were engaged too quickly (before allowing the car to be revved out).
In order to get the best from the engine, it had to be in race mode, and in that mode, traction control is off. There wasn’t an option to turn it on. So I never managed to feel it was in a spirited driving mode with traction on.
The brakes were truly awful. Especially at low speeds. Never knew if you’d engaged them or not, and were very slow to respond, which made you then stamp on them.
Damping wasn’t great.
And the rear end was very inconsistent. Quite difficult to get the arse out most of the time, and sometimes it would decide to make it easy, which meant I never quite knew where I was with it.
Nice noise, beautiful exterior, very average car.
I agree about the brakes.
I always thought the M-Trac mode was perfect for road. I remember taking a mate to Newcastle in winter and booting it out of a roundabout on the A69 in said mode.
We went second through to fourth at (as I remember it) full throttle with the rear tyres ever so slightly over-rotating.
It held a very slight (but noticeable) sideways drift through the gears as my mate held on to edge of the seat.
We went second through to fourth at (as I remember it) full throttle with the rear tyres ever so slightly over-rotating.
It held a very slight (but noticeable) sideways drift through the gears as my mate held on to edge of the seat.
How soft and closed minded people have become! Not having a radio and aircon makes the car unusable? Sad. Open a window. This eliminates the heating issues and lack of radio.
This is a car bought for what it is-a drivers car. If you wanted comfort you wouldn't buy a stripped out version!
I am lucky enough to have driven both a CS, CSL and an E90 M3. The V8 was a lovely engine, but the rest of the car felt flabby and flat compared to either of the others. The CS was great all round, but the CSL was on another level. The engine was the best of the lot, the handling was superb when you drove it how the car needed to be driven, and the car felt 'right'. The only drawback was the gearbox. Why they didn't use a manual is a mystery to me, but i often wonder how much blame lies with the motoring press for the rise of the dsg horrors.
This is a car bought for what it is-a drivers car. If you wanted comfort you wouldn't buy a stripped out version!
I am lucky enough to have driven both a CS, CSL and an E90 M3. The V8 was a lovely engine, but the rest of the car felt flabby and flat compared to either of the others. The CS was great all round, but the CSL was on another level. The engine was the best of the lot, the handling was superb when you drove it how the car needed to be driven, and the car felt 'right'. The only drawback was the gearbox. Why they didn't use a manual is a mystery to me, but i often wonder how much blame lies with the motoring press for the rise of the dsg horrors.
R400TVR said:
How soft and closed minded people have become! Not having a radio and aircon makes the car unusable? Sad. Open a window. This eliminates the heating issues and lack of radio.
This is a car bought for what it is-a drivers car. If you wanted comfort you wouldn't buy a stripped out version!
I am lucky enough to have driven both a CS, CSL and an E90 M3. The V8 was a lovely engine, but the rest of the car felt flabby and flat compared to either of the others. The CS was great all round, but the CSL was on another level. The engine was the best of the lot, the handling was superb when you drove it how the car needed to be driven, and the car felt 'right'. The only drawback was the gearbox. Why they didn't use a manual is a mystery to me, but i often wonder how much blame lies with the motoring press for the rise of the dsg horrors.
no one ordered the car without a/c or radio anywayThis is a car bought for what it is-a drivers car. If you wanted comfort you wouldn't buy a stripped out version!
I am lucky enough to have driven both a CS, CSL and an E90 M3. The V8 was a lovely engine, but the rest of the car felt flabby and flat compared to either of the others. The CS was great all round, but the CSL was on another level. The engine was the best of the lot, the handling was superb when you drove it how the car needed to be driven, and the car felt 'right'. The only drawback was the gearbox. Why they didn't use a manual is a mystery to me, but i often wonder how much blame lies with the motoring press for the rise of the dsg horrors.
slipstream 1985 said:
Lol, couldn't get the rear end out but leaves the traction control on. M3 is a far better car to drive with the traction control off when you are on it but too many people nowadays are scared of turning it off.
I agree about the brakes.
5.45 onwards articulates the point well. It’s not about turning TC off (ie, race mode), it’s tne inconsistency - no doubt as a result of an e diff. I agree about the brakes.
The M3 is much more (ie, very), consistent.
https://youtu.be/DVxLgbMfL_k
artdealer said:
Only those taking a punt on a low miler going £100K plus in a few years.
Which you wouldn't really be able to drive anyway so what's the point? Like many cars that become "collectable", they stop being good value if you actually want them to drive rather than to look at.
neutral 3 said:
Easily !!
In Dec 12, I bought an immaculate, 2 owner, 149,000 mile manual, late 2003, E46M3 in carbon black / black.
I had already bought a red trim 4 weeks before, so I removed the black trim and just re fitted the front red ( boat anchor seats ) along with the red ( boat anchor ) door cards.
The difference was amazing, the OE E46 front and rear seats and the front and rear door cards are stupidly heavy. I also ran it for a few days without the front passengers seat and again the difference was incredible.
A pair of Recarro pole positions are a tad lighter than one OE E46 front seat.
I also took out some of the boot trim and ran it like this for nearly 5 years and 30,000 trouble free miles.
My car also had a CSL steering rack, which is the first mod I will do again, if I buy another.
No offense, but no one cares about any of that.In Dec 12, I bought an immaculate, 2 owner, 149,000 mile manual, late 2003, E46M3 in carbon black / black.
I had already bought a red trim 4 weeks before, so I removed the black trim and just re fitted the front red ( boat anchor seats ) along with the red ( boat anchor ) door cards.
The difference was amazing, the OE E46 front and rear seats and the front and rear door cards are stupidly heavy. I also ran it for a few days without the front passengers seat and again the difference was incredible.
A pair of Recarro pole positions are a tad lighter than one OE E46 front seat.
I also took out some of the boot trim and ran it like this for nearly 5 years and 30,000 trouble free miles.
My car also had a CSL steering rack, which is the first mod I will do again, if I buy another.
You’re missing the point..nothing worse than seeing a standard model with the flippers on bumper and all the other bits and bobs that makes all CSL parts obsolete..it’s getting boring and as time goes by buyers want originality and not replicated parts.
We can all spend thousands on modding but the CSL is not a fast GTR type car..it’s about the corners and having fun.
I’m sure your car is great but BHP figures is not what I’m chasing.
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