RE: Mercedes-AMG C63 S Coupe: UK drive
Discussion
Mosdef said:
I think some AMGs and M cars have very high list prices but it seems that big discounts/0% APR deals with reasonable contributions mitigate these.
My E63 was £72k new in 2013, if I’d paid cash I could have had the car for just over £60k. I see a ‘basic’ E63 now has a list price of c. £80k. That doesn’t strike me as that bad, no idea whether it can be discounted. An M5 on the other hand has gone from £73k to around £92k. That seems nuts!
My 100k E63s was invoiced at £80k a year ago, I imagine I could do better yet today.My E63 was £72k new in 2013, if I’d paid cash I could have had the car for just over £60k. I see a ‘basic’ E63 now has a list price of c. £80k. That doesn’t strike me as that bad, no idea whether it can be discounted. An M5 on the other hand has gone from £73k to around £92k. That seems nuts!
100k new M5s are today selling at £75k
You forget that the M5 has added significant specification not least of all switchable 4wd as part of that price increase.
st4 said:
Someone in the market for one of these would consider an RS5 or M4. In almost all cases these will be bought on tick.
I've got news for you - almost all new cars are bought "on tick".One of my best mates works in sales at a BMW main dealer - the cash buyer is vanishingly rare (and often dodgy).
Why on earth anyone would pay more to run a car - to the tune of many thousands - by buying it outright is a mystery to me. I guess people like you do it as it's worth those extra thousands to be able to sneer at those who leased them despite them often being just financially astute.
Brooking10 said:
My 100k E63s was invoiced at £80k a year ago, I imagine I could do better yet today.
100k new M5s are today selling at £75k
You forget that the M5 has added significant specification not least of all switchable 4wd as part of that price increase.
You’re absolutely right, the spec is much, much higher and list prices almost irrelevant given how most customers fund cars these days. It just makes me cringe when people (who I know are on finance, as am I, do not having a pop at anyone) tell me they have a ‘hundred grand’ Merc...without saying what the deposit was and what the monthly payments cost.100k new M5s are today selling at £75k
You forget that the M5 has added significant specification not least of all switchable 4wd as part of that price increase.
Dog Star said:
I've got news for you - almost all new cars are bought "on tick".
One of my best mates works in sales at a BMW main dealer - the cash buyer is vanishingly rare (and often dodgy).
Why on earth anyone would pay more to run a car - to the tune of many thousands - by buying it outright is a mystery to me. I guess people like you do it as it's worth those extra thousands to be able to sneer at those who leased them despite them often being just financially astute.
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.One of my best mates works in sales at a BMW main dealer - the cash buyer is vanishingly rare (and often dodgy).
Why on earth anyone would pay more to run a car - to the tune of many thousands - by buying it outright is a mystery to me. I guess people like you do it as it's worth those extra thousands to be able to sneer at those who leased them despite them often being just financially astute.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
Ares said:
Mosdef said:
Maybe it’s the just the ones I see in West London then. They’re mainly black, black wheels, always being driven bloody hard/badly so they attract more attention. They do look very good but I tend to think the RS6 and even the new M5 are a bit more subtle.
RS6 subtle....???? 
If you took all 3 (E63, M5, RS) in the same stock body and wheel colours, I think the E63 (sorry to take over a C63 thread) would stand out the least given the body shape/styling/'stance' of the M5 and RS6.
Obviously it's easy to make individual vehicles (of all 3) stand out more.
mikey k said:
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
+1 I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
I’m amazed so many people don’t get this.
Of course there is odd crazy lease deal exception to the rule but if you have the cash then it’s almost always cheaper to buy outright, plus there is the added bonus of flexibility.
Rawwr said:
Complains 520d is as dull as ditch water. Recommends a GS300h.
"Dog turds taste horrible, I'm switching to cat turds from now on."
The GS300h is quiet, smooth and technologically interesting. A 520d is an unreliable and unrefined eurobox devoid of interest or character inside or out. Unlike a GS. "Dog turds taste horrible, I'm switching to cat turds from now on."
mikey k said:
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
£420/mth for a 140i?? PLUS £13k?? I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
Jeez, they saw you coming. My colleagues wife got into one in Jan '17. She pays a fiver under £300/mth.
We got offered one by BMW over the weekend at £267/mth with £800 upfront - 140i Shadow Edition.
You were saying about paying inflated prices?
5050 said:
mikey k said:
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
+1 I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
I’m amazed so many people don’t get this.
Of course there is odd crazy lease deal exception to the rule but if you have the cash then it’s almost always cheaper to buy outright, plus there is the added bonus of flexibility.
And of course don't forget that for folk who are cash rich there are some real bargains to be had at the end of PCP/lease periods. A short while ago there were loads of Audi S8's on the market for what I consider silly money, although a lot were low spec cars due to monthly charges but there were a few with cooled seats,HUD etc to tempt you.
Speaking as someone who has owned two AMG's the C63 does seem to be gaining notoriety in the wrong way. Locally to me there is a young lad with a matt grey one and it is driven in a way through the local 30 limit that's going to get him in trouble before long.
Also 'hat's off' to AMG on the sound they make even with the turbos, I had a N/A SL63 and the sound was lovely and I was pleasantly surprised at the sound of the twin turbo model that replaced it, it actually sounded more guttural than the N/A and not all 'Farty' that quite a few cars sound like these days.
Speaking as someone who has owned two AMG's the C63 does seem to be gaining notoriety in the wrong way. Locally to me there is a young lad with a matt grey one and it is driven in a way through the local 30 limit that's going to get him in trouble before long.
Also 'hat's off' to AMG on the sound they make even with the turbos, I had a N/A SL63 and the sound was lovely and I was pleasantly surprised at the sound of the twin turbo model that replaced it, it actually sounded more guttural than the N/A and not all 'Farty' that quite a few cars sound like these days.
Ares said:
mikey k said:
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
£420/mth for a 140i?? PLUS £13k?? I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
Jeez, they saw you coming. My colleagues wife got into one in Jan '17. She pays a fiver under £300/mth.
We got offered one by BMW over the weekend at £267/mth with £800 upfront - 140i Shadow Edition.
You were saying about paying inflated prices?
1) I didn't go PCP
2) its business use, I doubt either of the above are
3) its high annual mileage, you don't mention that
4) your deal wasn't around 3 years ago
so not a great comparison
Also the deal you got offered at the weekend is on a pre reg stock car that is a run out model just ending production.
Beyond semantics my original point was there is ALWAYS a cost to borrowing money.
Each person should reconcile that to their own circumstances.
Many like a monthly payment for something they could never buy outright.
I personal hate debt for the above reason, but that's just me.
Never seen a PCP for my circumstances that I couldn't do cheaper with out right purchase.
mikey k said:
Ares said:
mikey k said:
Yes over 90% of new cars are PCP deals.
I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
£420/mth for a 140i?? PLUS £13k?? I and our business are one of the rare exceptions.
We don't because bank rates are crap for cash and it saves paying ANY interest, inflated purchase prices and being locked in to mileage, term and service.
We do bank transfers and haggle.
Doing the sums my M140i has cost me ~£325/month for 3 years and unlimited mileage (now done 41k miles) and that includes service and tyres.
I had PCP quotes at the time, they were all well over £420/month including a £13k "deposit" from the old car.
Age old moral - if you have cash use it and don't pay inflated prices or interest. Be it a car at TV or anything.
Jeez, they saw you coming. My colleagues wife got into one in Jan '17. She pays a fiver under £300/mth.
We got offered one by BMW over the weekend at £267/mth with £800 upfront - 140i Shadow Edition.
You were saying about paying inflated prices?
1) I didn't go PCP
2) its business use, I doubt either of the above are
3) its high annual mileage, you don't mention that
4) your deal wasn't around 3 years ago
so not a great comparison
Also the deal you got offered at the weekend is on a pre reg stock car that is a run out model just ending production.
Beyond semantics my original point was there is ALWAYS a cost to borrowing money.
Each person should reconcile that to their own circumstances.
Many like a monthly payment for something they could never buy outright.
I personal hate debt for the above reason, but that's just me.
Never seen a PCP for my circumstances that I couldn't do cheaper with out right purchase.
2) business use is cheaper
3) you've done 41k in 3 years. These were 12/year
4) 2yrs 2 months ago. Not far off.
And the deal we were offered was factory order, NOT pre-reg.
You need to look harder on PCP/lease deals then. I've never paid for a car as much as that car has depreciated. The reason you usually can't buy outright as cheaply as a finance deal is that it isn't a level playing field. Aside from the incentives given and bulk buying power of finance houses, finance providers offset the tax position to make it cheaper.
Take my current car as an example. I will pay £29,000 over 4 years and 60,000 miles, including £450/yr RFL. For it to be better off paying cash for the car, I would have get absolutely zero return for my £65,000 cash...AND see a 500bhp Alfa Romeo hold 60% of it's value after 4 years and 60,000.
Fat hippo said:
To balance things out, my dad has had a couple of Lexii from new, an IS250 and IS300 and they are nice cars and i’m pretty sure met paint was an option on those. I preferred them to my e90 325 and S4 (except for the engine in the S4). But, they don’t currently make a car that competes with the M4/RS4/C63 so I didn’t consider buying one.
The leather in a base 3/5 series and c/e class is the man made stuff. The Lexus leather is better, however the C63 has nappa leather which is better still imho. There are other features that the C63 has that a Lexus doesn’t but the main one is the below (for me). It’s what gives the car its character.
They did the ISF and GSF which were amazing cars. There’s talk of the ISF returning under 6 cylinder power so more an S4 alternative. The leather in my Lexus GS seems about the same grade as the nappa leather in the high end Mercedes. My S class had terrible leather. My Volvo has really nice nappa leather. The leather in a base 3/5 series and c/e class is the man made stuff. The Lexus leather is better, however the C63 has nappa leather which is better still imho. There are other features that the C63 has that a Lexus doesn’t but the main one is the below (for me). It’s what gives the car its character.
Ares said:
1) They saw you coming with the monthly rates
2) business use is cheaper
3) you've done 41k in 3 years. These were 12/year
4) 2yrs 2 months ago. Not far off.
And the deal we were offered was factory order, NOT pre-reg.
You need to look harder on PCP/lease deals then. I've never paid for a car as much as that car has depreciated. The reason you usually can't buy outright as cheaply as a finance deal is that it isn't a level playing field. Aside from the incentives given and bulk buying power of finance houses, finance providers offset the tax position to make it cheaper.
Take my current car as an example. I will pay £29,000 over 4 years and 60,000 miles, including £450/yr RFL. For it to be better off paying cash for the car, I would have get absolutely zero return for my £65,000 cash...AND see a 500bhp Alfa Romeo hold 60% of it's value after 4 years and 60,000.
Alfa Romeo Giulia Quadrifoglio2) business use is cheaper
3) you've done 41k in 3 years. These were 12/year
4) 2yrs 2 months ago. Not far off.
And the deal we were offered was factory order, NOT pre-reg.
You need to look harder on PCP/lease deals then. I've never paid for a car as much as that car has depreciated. The reason you usually can't buy outright as cheaply as a finance deal is that it isn't a level playing field. Aside from the incentives given and bulk buying power of finance houses, finance providers offset the tax position to make it cheaper.
Take my current car as an example. I will pay £29,000 over 4 years and 60,000 miles, including £450/yr RFL. For it to be better off paying cash for the car, I would have get absolutely zero return for my £65,000 cash...AND see a 500bhp Alfa Romeo hold 60% of it's value after 4 years and 60,000.
New Giulia Quadrifoglio 2.9 V6 BiTurbo Quadrifoglio 4dr Auto
Build 2
Offer received on 13 March 2019
Total RRP
£63,500
PCP Finance
carwow offer
£58,319
You save
£5,181 (8.2%)
Representative APR 3.9%
Cash
carwow offer
£53,701
You save
£9,799 (15.4%)
PCP is not always cheaper.
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