RE: BMW Z4 M40i: Driven

[mrclav]

Brian Fallon said:

This car is grossly overpriced at £50k+ with options. A low mileage second hand Boxter S or a new Audi TTS would make more sense and would certainly be a better drive (at least the Boxter).

Forget the overall price. No-one (or at least very, very few) will pay that all in one go. People need to snap out of this 'pay up front' mentality!

Thanks to the wonders of finance/credit, cars are now like mobile phones - we pay them off until a new model comes out then replace them. That works for the vast majority of the car buying population.

And since when was buying a 2-seater, convertible car like this ever about 'sense'??? Some people like their cars new and don't want to have to make do with someone else's leftovers... If you can, then why not? If people like me didn't exist, people like you couldn't enjoy anything secondhand...

Edited by mrclav on Thursday 21st March 15:46

[Ares]

mrclav said:

Brian Fallon said:

This car is grossly overpriced at £50k+ with options. A low mileage second hand Boxter S or a new Audi TTS would make more sense and would certainly be a better drive (at least the Boxter).

Forget the overall price. No-one (or at least very, very few) will pay that all in one go. People need to snap out of this 'pay up front' mentality!

Thanks to the wonders of finance/credit, cars are now like mobile phones - we pay them off until a new model comes out then replace them. That works for the vast majority of the car buying population.

And since when was buying a 2-seater, convertible car like this ever about 'sense'??? Some people like their cars new and don't want to have to make do with someone else's leftovers... If you can, then why not? If people like me didn't exist, people like you couldn't enjoy anything secondhand...

Edited by mrclav on Thursday 21st March 15:46

And when you step further away from 1995, £50k for a RWD 340bhp convertible with a good spec isn't overpriced, let alone grossly overpriced.

[HighwayStar]

Brian Fallon said:

This car is grossly overpriced at £50k+ with options. A low mileage second hand Boxter S or a new Audi TTS would make more sense and would certainly be a better drive (at least the Boxter).

I seriously doubt the TTS, basically a FWD car would be better to drive. I had the Mk2 and test drove the latest one... nice car, nice place to be and, if you really like/need it, great tech. Me, I could never get passed how detached it was to drive. Fast, yes. Fun, no. I would definitely expect more from the Z4. It's difficult for any company compete on price with the Boxster and Porsche has economy of scale on it's side, sharing a lot with the 911.
BMW have started putting more standard equipment in there care... Don't forget most Boxsters will be optioned up too. And I say this a Cayman owner.
And remember. Not everyone one wants a Porsche or an Audi. The Z4 will sell. Of course, amazingly, a second hand car cheaper than a new one... who'd have thought it

[nickfrog]

Ares said:

And when you step further away from 1995, £50k for a RWD 340bhp convertible with a good spec isn't overpriced, let alone grossly overpriced.

Indeed and particularly after the usual high discounts.

[nickfrog]

otolith said:

Not so much that as most people having no experience of anything that isn't heavy.

I have and I am gobsmacked how good heavy cars can be, a lot of it down to more rigid platforms, much better suspension kinematics, better brakes, better tyres etc than even 20 years ago. Probably not much steering feel anymore though !

[nickfrog]

J4CKO said:

There seems to be a persecution complex with petrolheads, soft or assuming that "the man" wants to take our toys away, and its been said year on year, from when I first appeared some years ago on PH, guess what we can still buy interesting cars !

I have noticed too and it usually comes from people who never buy new cars anyway. Quite bizarre.

[otolith]

nickfrog said:

otolith said:

Not so much that as most people having no experience of anything that isn't heavy.

I have and I am gobsmacked how good heavy cars can be, a lot of it down to more rigid platforms, much better suspension kinematics, better brakes, better tyres etc than even 20 years ago. Probably not much steering feel anymore though !

I've yet to find a 1500kg car that feels like an 850kg car. Certainly plenty that achieve the same longitudinal and lateral G, but that's not surprising.

[Brian Fallon]

While most people do not pay up front, some do so the up front price is very important in those cases.

[cerb4.5lee]

DoubleD said:

Thats rather heavy for a 2 seater.

My Z4M Roadster was 1485kg and that was when I realised that there isn't such a thing as a light BMW. Only two seats and a cheap looking roof and it still weighed that much!

BMW...the Ultimate Cruising Machine!

[mrbarnett]

neil1jnr said:

chow pan toon said:

Has there ever been a thread for a mainstream new car where some wag hasn't piped up with a moan about how heavy it is?

This

Nearly every thread. It's 2019 not 1999. What do people seriously expect? Unless it was a weekend/track car only, I personally couldn't care how much a car weighs, modern cars seem to do a pretty good job in disguising their mass anyway.

This would be a fair point were it not for the fact Mazda continue to manage to be able to make a car that weighs less than the competition. The MX5 obviously, but also the Mazda 2 weights around a tonne and is stuffed with equipment. It's clerly possible, with the right engineering mindset.

A good suit disguises a pot belly, but I'd still rather be slim...

[J4CKO]

Epiphany said:

Fire99 said:

Looks like a family member to the Fiat 124 Spider, at the front.

Every car has similarities to other cars, it's unavoidable by the restrictions to pedestrian safety and the airflow requirements to reduce drag and improve CO2 etc...

This is a great example of brand "conformity". Choose your favourite...

Its not though is it, I saw it used to justify why someone owns an older car, they have similar models granted, from a market segment and have them in all the same colour, in basic trim and have replaced the wheels with white disks, they arent exciting but as accurate as a UKIP poster.

Motoring is white goods to a lot of people, they have other interests of than cars which I wish I wasnt interested in, guess what folks a lot of people arent bothered and think we are as boring as st going on about cars, I sometimes start and feel like the really boring priest from Father Ted with the annoying voice.

A lot of older cars looked the same, three box saloons and a lot of modern ones dont look like a medium crossover, which people buy as its a pretty useful, cover all bases kind of configuration.

[mikey k]

Love my M140i, wouldn't mind one of these as a weekend car

[Luke.]

mikey k said:

Love my M140i, wouldn't mind one of these as a weekend car

I see your car sits in some esteemed company, so that's good to hear. Keen to jump on the M140i bandwagon once our Abarth 124 goes back.

[Ares]

J4CKO said:

Its not though is it, I saw it used to justify why someone owns an older car, they have similar models granted, from a market segment and have them in all the same colour, in basic trim and have replaced the wheels with white disks, they arent exciting but as accurate as a UKIP poster.

Motoring is white goods to a lot of people, they have other interests of than cars which I wish I wasnt interested in, guess what folks a lot of people arent bothered and think we are as boring as st going on about cars, I sometimes start and feel like the really boring priest from Father Ted with the annoying voice.

A lot of older cars looked the same, three box saloons and a lot of modern ones dont look like a medium crossover, which people buy as its a pretty useful, cover all bases kind of configuration.

I'd go as far as to say older cars look more alike. You only had three body styles (saloon, hatch & estate). Panels were largely flat, bumpers external. and technology prevented ambitious design being made...unless it was design by ruler.

[nickfrog]

otolith said:

nickfrog said:

otolith said:

Not so much that as most people having no experience of anything that isn't heavy.

I have and I am gobsmacked how good heavy cars can be, a lot of it down to more rigid platforms, much better suspension kinematics, better brakes, better tyres etc than even 20 years ago. Probably not much steering feel anymore though !

I've yet to find a 1500kg car that feels like an 850kg car

True, same here, but that doesn't prevent a heavier car from being good and have a breadth of ability. I can't see myself driving to the Ring in a 850kg car for instance, however good it will be there.

[Ares]

nickfrog said:

otolith said:

nickfrog said:

otolith said:

Not so much that as most people having no experience of anything that isn't heavy.

I have and I am gobsmacked how good heavy cars can be, a lot of it down to more rigid platforms, much better suspension kinematics, better brakes, better tyres etc than even 20 years ago. Probably not much steering feel anymore though !

I've yet to find a 1500kg car that feels like an 850kg car

True, same here, but that doesn't prevent a heavier car from being good and have a breadth of ability. I can't see myself driving to the Ring in a 850kg car for instance, however good it will be there.

And if I compare my 1600kg car with my old 1200kg STi, the newer car is infinitely better, has a broader breadth of ability and greater driving feel (and pleasure). And that before you factor in it's way quicker.

[borat52]

Ares said:

mrclav said:

Brian Fallon said:

This car is grossly overpriced at £50k+ with options. A low mileage second hand Boxter S or a new Audi TTS would make more sense and would certainly be a better drive (at least the Boxter).

Forget the overall price. No-one (or at least very, very few) will pay that all in one go. People need to snap out of this 'pay up front' mentality!

Thanks to the wonders of finance/credit, cars are now like mobile phones - we pay them off until a new model comes out then replace them. That works for the vast majority of the car buying population.

And since when was buying a 2-seater, convertible car like this ever about 'sense'??? Some people like their cars new and don't want to have to make do with someone else's leftovers... If you can, then why not? If people like me didn't exist, people like you couldn't enjoy anything secondhand...

Edited by mrclav on Thursday 21st March 15:46

And when you step further away from 1995, £50k for a RWD 340bhp convertible with a good spec isn't overpriced, let alone grossly overpriced.

It’s double the price of a MX5, I can’t quite get my head around that particularly as the MX5 is suject to import duty.

[otolith]

Really just comes down to what you find important in a car, I think. I do like big, heavy saloons and estates, for example, and I like them to have decent performance, but I'm not interested in any attempt to make them handle. I'm never going to chuck them around for fun, and I'd rather the manufacture prioritised making them comfortable and refined over pseudo-sporty. So I'd rather have a 540i SE than an M5.

[nickfrog]

Ares said:

And if I compare my 1600kg car with my old 1200kg STi

You had bought the wrong Subaru, try a Legacy.

[va1o]

Collecting mine next week, cannot wait