RE: TRD goes to town on new Supra

[300bhp/ton]

Scootersp said:

Mike335i said:

Hot Knife said:

But when will there be an engine that lives up to the Legend of Supra?

3.0 twin turbo straight six with 340hp? Already got one sunshine.

1993 Mkiii 232bhp
1993 Mkiv 326bhp
2019 Mkv 340bhp (370 say if understated)

So 25 years and less of a leap than the immediate follow up back in 1993.

I know there is a big 0-whatever gain, and advanced diff and gearbox, so a better car, better engine, accepted but it should be easy to see why some feel it's a little disappointing and could have been so much more?

That is such a stupid stance to take. If you don’t like the car. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. But quite crying like a 4 year old on every Supra thread.

[The Vambo]

300bhp/ton said:

That is such a stupid stance to take. If you don’t like the car. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. But quite crying like a 4 year old on every Supra thread.

(ctrl+c then sets ambush in Landrover Defender thread)

[J4CKO]

300bhp/ton said:

Scootersp said:

Mike335i said:

Hot Knife said:

But when will there be an engine that lives up to the Legend of Supra?

3.0 twin turbo straight six with 340hp? Already got one sunshine.

1993 Mkiii 232bhp
1993 Mkiv 326bhp
2019 Mkv 340bhp (370 say if understated)

So 25 years and less of a leap than the immediate follow up back in 1993.

I know there is a big 0-whatever gain, and advanced diff and gearbox, so a better car, better engine, accepted but it should be easy to see why some feel it's a little disappointing and could have been so much more?

That is such a stupid stance to take. If you don’t like the car. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. But quite crying like a 4 year old on every Supra thread.

I hear its going to be the new car for the female Ghostbusters next movie...

[300bhp/ton]

The Vambo said:

(ctrl+c then sets ambush in Landrover Defender thread)

Never said I don’t like the vehicle. Only that it currently appears to be a Discovery and shares nothing with the heritage line of vehicles. Which is somewhat different to crying over how this Supra isn’t something the previous version never was anyway.

[The Vambo]

300bhp/ton said:

The Vambo said:

(ctrl+c then sets ambush in Landrover Defender thread)

Never said I don’t like the vehicle. Only that it currently appears to be a Discovery and shares nothing with the heritage line of vehicles. Which is somewhat different to crying over how this Supra isn’t something the previous version never was anyway.

Are you sure that's all you've ever said about the Defender?

Everything's in the archives and it would be pretty awkward if there were multiple examples of you complaining about a car rather than just leaving the thread.

You post a lot, it must be difficult to remember all of it.

Maybe you should check before replying...

[cerb4.5lee]

J4CKO said:

GT86 was hailed as the ultimate drivers car, not enough power despite everyone declaring that is what was needed.

Car enthusiasts are a bit like cats that stand miaowing by the door until you open it and they look at you like you like you are mental.

I love this!

I was genuinely excited that Toyota were making the GT86...but when it eventually came to fruition it was a massive let down(for me) in terms of performance.

Then I got my hopes up again because the Supra was being made(great...more performance I thought) yet much to my frustration they decided to only offer it with an auto gearbox!

What I have now learnt is that Toyota need to stick to what they are good at(the Prius and boring cars) for me. Toyota used to make very desirable cars for sure, but their focus has changed now too much hence why car enthusiasts are so frustrated IMO.

[vsonix]

Bob Dong said:

Jalopnik had a little look at the "just pop the vents out" story and yeah it's not true. Toyota even walked it back when asked on it themselves.

https://jalopnik.com/i-just-dont-believe-what-the-...

OK, this is indeed a direct contradiction to what matey from Toyota was saying in the link I posted up, which makes him a fairly convincing liar, if indeed Jalopnik is correct on this. Obviously I've no access to a Z4 or a Supra to poke around for myself. Shame really as the way he explains it makes everything seem a) perfectly logical and b) a fairly good idea.

[Scootersp]

300bhp/ton said:

That is such a stupid stance to take. If you don’t like the car. Don’t let the door hit you on the way out. But quite crying like a 4 year old on every Supra thread.

You do make me laugh, the stance is a reasonable one you know it but like every other thread were you are a bit off the mark you dig in and will not admit it.

I have a passion for cars and mkiv supra's are my specific thing, owned loads and still have 2 hence why I'm more inclined to post in threads about them!?

I don't think you can refute that Toyota put more effort into the production of the mkiv, or that it was higher up the performance chart in its time.

If you can, go for it but you can't can you? so I think I will stick around a while longer.

Jacko is right about people being fickle / never happy and I'm not really in the market for a new one, so my opinion doesn't matter but it's a forum so hey what the hell I'll voice it.

Btw I am unflappable mate, besides you aren't even very good at antagonising even after all these years and hundreds of posts of practice.

[A1VDY]

TuRD..

[Big Robbo]

sutts said:

This made me wince. You’ll be ‘reaching out’ to someone next.

Regards,

V. Meldrew

They have probably been on a journey.....

[Ahonen]

RemyMartin81D said:

sutts said:

ZX10R NIN said:

the stance is on point.

This made me wince. You’ll be ‘reaching out’ to someone next.

Regards,

V. Meldrew

No no no he'll be 'pulling the trigger' on one.

Dammit, I was going to add the 'pulling the trigger' one! Or I was going to run it up the flagpole. Or something.

[Pommy]

mrclav said:

poo at Paul's said:

fake air ducts?

Does look a bit crap

If you watch Doug Demuro's review on youtube, he mentions that, interestingly, he was told by Toyota that the engineers have made those ducts so that when the tuners get their hands on them, they can be made 'real', ie all the plastic bits can be removed so that airflow can be improved, the brakes can be cooled better etc.

Essentially, the car is designed to be sold then modified - they've even left out things like strut bracing in the engine bay but you can see the holes where bracing can be attached. One must remember that the Supra is possibly one of the most modified Japanese exports (besides the GTR) so I guess Toyota is supplying a 'blank slate' to let people go crazy on.

Also interesting in that video is the mention that the engine was taken into Toyota and checked against their own standards of performance and they approved it; this isn't a small deal as I'm aware that their testing regime is one of the reasons their cars are known to be so reliable so in a way it's a testament to BMW's engine boffins original design that Toyota didn't feel they needed to mess with it too much...

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

[anonymous-user]

Pommy said:

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

I'm not sure about that.

Remember, Toyota enter NASCAR, WRC, WEC/Le Mans, NHRA drag, F-drift, and a few other things.

[Pittsy98]

Unfortunately, the most exciting thing about the new Supra is the badge...

[TwinExit]

Pommy said:

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

Actually it is in some cases the other way round if you compare the like-for-like efforts over the years.

But we all know you wear BMW blinkers, you have been repeatedly trolling these MKV Supra threads to express your brand driven delusions on people who have no interest in the German car maker.

[TwinExit]

J4CKO said:

"90k for a bloody Toyota"

The individuals who would say such a thing would never break from the Porsche / Ferrari axis, or aspire to be trapped there one day.

In other words, a non-prestige car maker builds a halo car which gets shot down for not having the badge that befits the millionaire playboys of today.

The difference is Toyota were willing to take the hit back in the day to elevate the brand somewhat, those who run Toyota now basically just want to turn a profit on everything they build.

I just question whether it is really worth exploiting the Supra to win sales away from the Audi TT Tdi or remapped VW Golf buyers, only to damage the Supra brand and any prospect of future generations of the car...

Edited by TwinExit on Wednesday 22 May 16:17

[chow pan toon]

TwinExit said:

Pommy said:

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

Actually it is in some cases the other way round if you compare the like-for-like efforts over the years.

But we all know you wear BMW blinkers, you have been repeatedly trolling these MKV Supra threads to express your brand driven delusions on people who have no interest in the German car maker.

The BMW interior is the worst part about it IMO.

[Mike335i]

chow pan toon said:

he BMW interior is the worst part about it IMO.

Maybe for some, but the iDrive system is still the best for usability and the dials that Toyota have created are pretty decent looking (certainly better than BMW's own efforts.

[blasos]

Pommy said:

mrclav said:

poo at Paul's said:

fake air ducts?

Does look a bit crap

If you watch Doug Demuro's review on youtube, he mentions that, interestingly, he was told by Toyota that the engineers have made those ducts so that when the tuners get their hands on them, they can be made 'real', ie all the plastic bits can be removed so that airflow can be improved, the brakes can be cooled better etc.

Essentially, the car is designed to be sold then modified - they've even left out things like strut bracing in the engine bay but you can see the holes where bracing can be attached. One must remember that the Supra is possibly one of the most modified Japanese exports (besides the GTR) so I guess Toyota is supplying a 'blank slate' to let people go crazy on.

Also interesting in that video is the mention that the engine was taken into Toyota and checked against their own standards of performance and they approved it; this isn't a small deal as I'm aware that their testing regime is one of the reasons their cars are known to be so reliable so in a way it's a testament to BMW's engine boffins original design that Toyota didn't feel they needed to mess with it too much...

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

Yes, its performance in terms of reliability. The area where Toyota is King, and BMW is far from it.

[Pommy]

TwinExit said:

Pommy said:

So Toyota checked that BMW's performance standards were up to scratch?

I think people seem to be overlooking that it should be Toyota that needs to be up to BMW's standards.

BMW are a much more renowned performance car and engine builder than Toyota - theyve made many more proper, better and quicker road and race cars than Toyota and if people dont like this now imagine if it had a BMW exterior but with a Toyota engine and interior.

Bloody glad BMW made the engine and interior rather than Toyota.

Actually it is in some cases the other way round if you compare the like-for-like efforts over the years.

But we all know you wear BMW blinkers, you have been repeatedly trolling these MKV Supra threads to express your brand driven delusions on people who have no interest in the German car maker.

Im not on a wind up, merely expressing my opinion much like everyone else. Give over.

My point is quite valid and as you say, over the years, please do confirm which road cars Toyota has produced that are 'performance'? On a like for like basis as you say.

Im struggling to see this assertion that Toyota are a performance or sports csr manufacturer. They had a crack in the 80's and 90's but for over 20 years they've been invisible in this market (bar the 86 which is, much like the Supra, a collaboration not of their own making)

BMW have made year after year a multitude of different performance road cars that have been lauded for their abilities, engines and chassis.

What have Toyota done, and certainly what have they done in the last 20 years, that makes them a valid adjudicator of BMWs to the point that a BMW needs to meet Toyotas 'performance standards'?

I dont doubt they are more reliable but that wasnt the supposition proposed.

To clarify i dont mind the new Supra so im not exactly driving a pro BMW anti Toyota agenda.

Im just not as horrifed as some with the BMW aspects.

The interior is perfectly decent whereas most Toyota really arent very good.

The engine is a stormer, its not a 2JZ as nothing really is, but at this price and segment its spot on

The looks are entirely subjective - i dont love, dont hate, just meh

It drives pretty well by all accounts

I just dont think its a true Supra which is what almost all the fanbois are saying so im not really trolling there.

I just think its the new Celica - it plays on the same segment as the original Celicas, itll be road tested against the same peers and whilst a fine effort its just a bit meh

To stay on point for this topic it appears Toyota are doing what they did with the 86 and thats lots of new styling bits but id be surprised if they ever change the enginge, gearbox or strip it clean - theyre probably a bit hamstrung in launching anything other than BMW engine choices given how BMW this car is.

Its the 86 all over again - itll never become more than the sum of its parts as when launched. I hope im wrong.

Edited by Pommy on Thursday 23 May 01:46