RE: New Mercedes-AMG A45 and CLA45 - official!
Discussion
wab172uk said:
Once the options are ticked (if similar options to the A35) then were looking at a £60k+ Hot Hatch.
We’re already there, albeit second-hand wise in the PH ClassifiedsInflation taken into account, the Delta Integrale and Escort Cosworth would’ve been 50-55k nowadays
Power has doubled in the Mercedes though
EyeHeartSpellin said:
Without getting internet angry that seems a really stupid comment. If they called it a Z45s Special Projects AMG Drift Edition would you be ok with that staggering performance for that price? It's not a 1999 A class is it!
In fairness my initial thoughts were the same (£60k for an A-Class?!) but I suppose it is great performance for the price and on the average A or B road, it wouldn't be that much slower than an AMG GTR at less than half the priceChestrockwell said:
Spotted on Facebook, it appears the Merc also has fake vents and a wing only for aesthetics and fake (!) exhausts yet the Civic’s childish?
Badge snobbery, nothing more to it
Onehp said:
Not only that, the chassis should something else altogether... the last proper transverse 4wd car was the Evo. The latest Focus RS was good but not great, this, with a good whack of more (real) power, could be something..
Why wasn't the Focus great, out of interest? Many motoring journos would disagree with you and, when I drove one, I thought it offered something really unique in the segment. So much so that Mercedes appear to have copied it?Chestrockwell said:
Because they’re some fake exhausts and an over used grille away from a 180 pm model which will have 3 cylinders.
A bespoke model would be an A45 that is an A45 and nothing else.
Couldn't basically the same be said for a C63? Or an M3? Unless it's a bespoke sports car, it's based on a cooking family car. If it was a bespoke model, it wouldn't be £50+k, it would probably be £200+k. The fact they shift thousands of diesel/small petrol ones allows them to produce examples like this?A bespoke model would be an A45 that is an A45 and nothing else.
The Vambo said:
How joyless does a person have to be to look at a 400+hp hatchback and the first thing they think about is false exhaust tips ?
Indeed. Especially when a huge chunk of cars, fast or slow, have them. It's hardly the worst thing happening in the world right now 
Cups Renault said:
No price. Will be interesting.
Amazing engineering achievements here and elsewhere in this class. Amazing progress.
But.....in gear acceleration. Bored of rampant 4wd 0-60 times. But paints only part of the picture.
So too the stressed out 4 pots as a post warranty purchase.
Then again as the lover of the maverick m140i option, crying at BMW joining the fart box four club I would say all of this.....
I'll stick with the unique and visit Litchfield in 6 months at the end of the warranty.
I'm not sure I'd be too worried about the engines in these modern hot hatches. Plenty of EA888 engines pushing out 450-500bhp and plenty of 1.6 EcoBoost pushing out over 300bhp. If they can take that and last, then most of them should be absolutely fine at standard levels of tune. Certainly no worse than the bigger engines, which have their own problems - ask M3 and M5 owners!Amazing engineering achievements here and elsewhere in this class. Amazing progress.
But.....in gear acceleration. Bored of rampant 4wd 0-60 times. But paints only part of the picture.
So too the stressed out 4 pots as a post warranty purchase.
Then again as the lover of the maverick m140i option, crying at BMW joining the fart box four club I would say all of this.....
I'll stick with the unique and visit Litchfield in 6 months at the end of the warranty.
BlackPrince said:
Chestrockwell said:
mate - the Civic is VERY overstyled for something with "only" 300 hp (my Subaru only has 305 hp but is styled more conservatively than yours). I actually like the Civic type-R a lot and think it looks sort of bad-ass (though a teensy bit try-hard in certain colours), and I'm happy that a manual hot hatch exists, but lets not pretend its somewhat cartoonish lookingCertain specs of the last A45 weren't entirely subtle but minus the wing (which used to be optional) in the right colour it was actually a decent enough looking car and pretty subtle.
je777 said:
Instead of the typical 'phone glued to dashboard' Mercedes effect, they've gone for 'giant phone glued to dashboard'.
How are they getting away with this?
(Is it just badge snobbery? If Peugeot do this, all and sundry would - rightly - cry 'Halfords'.)
What do you want instead? Let me guess, analogue dials and no radio?How are they getting away with this?
(Is it just badge snobbery? If Peugeot do this, all and sundry would - rightly - cry 'Halfords'.)
Panjy said:
I like it, particularly the dash.
Makes everything else look very "last year".
Impressive that they can get this level of performance out of a 2 litre hot hatch, should have reasonable running costs too.
cheaper than the RS3 but still very much AMG taxed (£300 for an oil change service ...)Makes everything else look very "last year".
Impressive that they can get this level of performance out of a 2 litre hot hatch, should have reasonable running costs too.
my worry is new 6 pot brakes are going to cost the the same as my RS3's (£1200 for the front disc and pads ...), current A45 is around £580ish. Made worse that i knocked the front discs out in 10k miles on my RS3 ... (current 45s died at 20k).
Edited by Dave Hedgehog on Friday 5th July 10:17
Cups Renault said:
No price. Will be interesting.
Amazing engineering achievements here and elsewhere in this class. Amazing progress.
But.....in gear acceleration. Bored of rampant 4wd 0-60 times. But paints only part of the picture.
So too the stressed out 4 pots as a post warranty purchase.
Then again as the lover of the maverick m140i option, crying at BMW joining the fart box four club I would say all of this.....
I'll stick with the unique and visit Litchfield in 6 months at the end of the warranty.
carwow vid says S model only to the UK and starting at 50k (matches RS3) Amazing engineering achievements here and elsewhere in this class. Amazing progress.
But.....in gear acceleration. Bored of rampant 4wd 0-60 times. But paints only part of the picture.
So too the stressed out 4 pots as a post warranty purchase.
Then again as the lover of the maverick m140i option, crying at BMW joining the fart box four club I would say all of this.....
I'll stick with the unique and visit Litchfield in 6 months at the end of the warranty.
the 500nm of torque should be interesting for normal driving depending where it is in the rev range
Deep Thought said:
Chestrockwell said:
Spotted on Facebook, it appears the Merc also has fake vents and a wing only for aesthetics and fake (!) exhausts yet the Civic’s childish?
Badge snobbery, nothing more to it
k me that thing is ugly".The Civic looks like it was styled by a blind monkey with a grudge against humanity.
BUT, on the plus side, its not £50K+, which is frankly ludicrous for an A45 S.
You're a car fan, surely you should care about driving pleasure and interaction more than superficial toys and traffic light drag races.
Don't you ever wonder why the "ugly" cheapo japanese car (Built in Swindon though! ) keeps handing the uber hatches their a...es
Should be a pretty impress car to drive. I’d be wary of buying one in a few years after it’s been thrashed mercilessly. That’s a big output for a fairly small engine.
I’d like a halfway house between no aero kit and aero kit; without it the A class looks a bit weak but it’s a bit OTT.
The price with options will I doubt be mental, but it’s a properly quick car. They sold loads of the previous one locally, so I’m sure it’ll sell.
I’d like a halfway house between no aero kit and aero kit; without it the A class looks a bit weak but it’s a bit OTT.
The price with options will I doubt be mental, but it’s a properly quick car. They sold loads of the previous one locally, so I’m sure it’ll sell.
Thornaby said:
Imagine being Mercedes and going to all this trouble to build a car that isnt as good as an RS3.
swings and roundabouts, having owned both the 45 is much much better to drive, the turn in makes the RS3 feel like its got 10 tonnes ahead of the front axelthe 5 pot is to die for (although the 45 engine is witchcraft for a 4 pot) but at a cost I avg'd 18.8mpg in my 3 against 27.6 in the 45 driving exactly the same route every day
the audi interior quality is on a different planet to the previous gen A series which is no better than my OHs kia, not driven the new A class yet
Dave Hedgehog said:
Thornaby said:
Imagine being Mercedes and going to all this trouble to build a car that isnt as good as an RS3.
swings and roundabouts, having owned both the 45 is much much better to drive, the turn in makes the RS3 feel like its got 10 tonnes ahead of the front axelthe 5 pot is to die for (although the 45 engine is witchcraft for a 4 pot) but at a cost I avg'd 18.8mpg in my 3 against 27.6 in the 45 driving exactly the same route every day
the audi interior quality is on a different planet to the previous gen A series which is no better than my OHs kia, not driven the new A class yet
Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 5th July 12:25
Jon_S_Rally said:
I'm not sure I'd be too worried about the engines in these modern hot hatches. Plenty of EA888 engines pushing out 450-500bhp and plenty of 1.6 EcoBoost pushing out over 300bhp. If they can take that and last, then most of them should be absolutely fine at standard levels of tune. Certainly no worse than the bigger engines, which have their own problems - ask M3 and M5 owners!
But they don't "last" , they will eventually all suffer big problems much earlier than they should. If you run a regular EA888 at over 400bhp without major upgrading of the internals it will fail in due course.AMG to their credit have specced these to be warrantied and to have regular length of life
Dblue said:
You are entitled to your opinion about aesthetics - it's subjective after all but the AMG Mercs and other Germans look very much like their bottom of the range siblings to most.
Agreed. Its one of the things we didnt like about our A45. Even on 19s it looked like an A180 AMG Line.However the Honda is a horrible looking thing, its all LOOK AT ME ME ME! which maybe appeals if you're 20 something, but i'm (quite) a bit past that. Plus even the standard Civic is way over styled.
Dblue said:
I have honestly never had a bad word said to me about my Civic, and the enthusiasm for it has taken me completely by surprise. It's because it looks like its a special car, not an expensive wall flower. For fellow car nuts , and I assume that includes you as you're on here after all, the fact it does the most important bits quite a bit better than the others should matter. But all i see and hear is acceleration figures or specific outputs or tuning potential being quoted by fans of those marques whilst deriding the Civic for it's styling.
You're a car fan, surely you should care about driving pleasure and interaction more than superficial toys and traffic light drag races.
Maybe its the company you keep that are impressed by the Civics styling, but lets be honest, it makes a Subaru look pretty. You're a car fan, surely you should care about driving pleasure and interaction more than superficial toys and traffic light drag races.
Theres room in the market for both cars (& people) with absolute performance and being outright drivers cars. Sadly, noone has yet built an absolute performance drivers car - maybe the two are mutually exclusive?
If i was looking for a balanced drivers car though, i'd walk past a Civic and go for a Megane RS or a i30N Performance, purely because of the Civic looks.
Dblue said:
Don't you ever wonder why the "ugly" cheapo japanese car (Built in Swindon though! ) keeps handing the uber hatches their a...es
No. I've never wondered why because it doesnt happen.
Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 5th July 12:28
Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 5th July 13:24
J4CKO said:
Which is the significantly cheaper competitor to the A35, which has 302 bhp.
A45 AMG is a full M/Audi RS competitor, as it should be at 50k and up, 15 or so grand over the new M135i.
As for the horsepower war, it will be interesting to see where BMW go, they now have the 4wd platform but have lost 2 cylinders, the new M3/4 is 500 bhp ish, so there is a gap that the M2 Comp doesnt really fill as its similar power and price but RWD only, they dont have a 4wd A45/RS3 type answer at the moment.
This looks ace but its sooo much money, wont see many as you cant get the cost effective leases and deals on the A45 like you can/did on the Golf R/M140i etc, will be a rare sight I expect.
Indeed, my point was not that BMW will be upping the power on the 135i, just that they'll be trying to work out, as you say, the configuration they can squeeze into the new AWD set up to compete, sticking a 6 in will devalue the new 4 pot 135i I'd have thought, so ramping up the 2.0 unit to 400+ may be the way they go? A45 AMG is a full M/Audi RS competitor, as it should be at 50k and up, 15 or so grand over the new M135i.
As for the horsepower war, it will be interesting to see where BMW go, they now have the 4wd platform but have lost 2 cylinders, the new M3/4 is 500 bhp ish, so there is a gap that the M2 Comp doesnt really fill as its similar power and price but RWD only, they dont have a 4wd A45/RS3 type answer at the moment.
This looks ace but its sooo much money, wont see many as you cant get the cost effective leases and deals on the A45 like you can/did on the Golf R/M140i etc, will be a rare sight I expect.
Electronicpants said:
Indeed, my point was not that BMW will be upping the power on the 135i, just that they'll be trying to work out, as you say, the configuration they can squeeze into the new AWD set up to compete, sticking a 6 in will devalue the new 4 pot 135i I'd have thought, so ramping up the 2.0 unit to 400+ may be the way they go?
i am really hoping they release a M1 version on the new platform, 400bhp 4wd would be perfect for me, never owned a BMW would be a logical move for meRS3 - A45 - M1
Deep Thought said:
:rotfl:
No. I've never wondered why because it doesnt happen.
Really, you don't read or watch any motoring sites or magazines at all then?? Probably rolling around on the floor I expect. There's far too many to reference but lets not go too far back - be especially painful for the A45 or M140i, have a look at CAR's verdict on the brand new A35 against the Civic this month for example. No. I've never wondered why because it doesnt happen.
Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 5th July 12:28
But if badge snobbery and soft touch plastics, switch like DSGs and headline power figures are your thing, that's fine.
Maybe AMG will see if they can haul one around the ring in less than 8mins this time eh?
Dave Hedgehog said:
Electronicpants said:
Indeed, my point was not that BMW will be upping the power on the 135i, just that they'll be trying to work out, as you say, the configuration they can squeeze into the new AWD set up to compete, sticking a 6 in will devalue the new 4 pot 135i I'd have thought, so ramping up the 2.0 unit to 400+ may be the way they go?
i am really hoping they release a M1 version on the new platform, 400bhp 4wd would be perfect for me, never owned a BMW would be a logical move for meRS3 - A45 - M1
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