RE: Why the Lotus Elise still matters | PH Footnote
Discussion
Tickle said:
gofasterrosssco said:
otolith said:
Doesn't the VX need a few modifications in order to drive like an Elise?
Depends on which Elise..! With Lotus spec wheels, dampers and a different geo, not much in it..otolith said:
gofasterrosssco said:
otolith said:
Doesn't the VX need a few modifications in order to drive like an Elise?
Depends on which Elise..! With Lotus spec wheels, dampers and a different geo, not much in it..Just to be clear, its 'not a Lotus' but performs very similarly to Toyota Elises with the above changes.
gofasterrosssco said:
otolith said:
gofasterrosssco said:
otolith said:
Doesn't the VX need a few modifications in order to drive like an Elise?
Depends on which Elise..! With Lotus spec wheels, dampers and a different geo, not much in it..Just to be clear, its 'not a Lotus' but performs very similarly to Toyota Elises with the above changes.
I guess I'd answer the question by asking myself what I'd be willing to swap mine for. I think really only a supercharged S2 or S3. I do like the unassisted brakes on the Rover cars, though I think ABS is worth having on a road car. I didn't think the Rover K-series was anything to write home about, though I haven't driven a VVC one.
gofasterrosssco said:
SidewaysSi said:
gofasterrosssco said:
Mr E said:
Julian Thompson said:
Has any consensus been reached about which is the “best” Elise? Old or new?
Usually whichever the respondent owns. So, clearly an early S2 111S with a short roof and no aircon. In black.
But that's because it offers the Elise / Exige S2 driving experience, and best performance / £ ratio (now that I've added a SC kit). In turn meaning I don't feel guilty leaving it outside 365 as its half the price of an equivalent performance Exige, but wears a boring Vauxhall badge..
If it was "best value" Elise then maybe the VX would be in with a shout. But absolute "best" which I presume means from a driving PoV, I think not.
SidewaysSi said:
gofasterrosssco said:
SidewaysSi said:
gofasterrosssco said:
Mr E said:
Julian Thompson said:
Has any consensus been reached about which is the “best” Elise? Old or new?
Usually whichever the respondent owns. So, clearly an early S2 111S with a short roof and no aircon. In black.
But that's because it offers the Elise / Exige S2 driving experience, and best performance / £ ratio (now that I've added a SC kit). In turn meaning I don't feel guilty leaving it outside 365 as its half the price of an equivalent performance Exige, but wears a boring Vauxhall badge..
If it was "best value" Elise then maybe the VX would be in with a shout. But absolute "best" which I presume means from a driving PoV, I think not.
Can't say I'm not envious of a Sport 160, but S1 is too raw for me as a partial daily!
Kubevoid said:
I never connected with my Elise 111R. The sketchy rearward balance felt like a builders four pound hammer in the wet. Zero mass up front, like an empty biscuit tin didn't help balance much either.
I wish Lotus would make something front engined, such as the Caterham 21 or a Ginetta G4. Something where you can throw it about, hang it's arse out and hold it there just for the fun of it.
You mean like an Lotus 7 then... believe that's still made by a few companies I wish Lotus would make something front engined, such as the Caterham 21 or a Ginetta G4. Something where you can throw it about, hang it's arse out and hold it there just for the fun of it.
The Elise requires skill to drive at high speed, but as I alluded to in my post, that's what gives depth to the ownership experience - you can drive it for years and still learn something as a driver.
It depends where and how you drive your car. My partner's Abarth Spider (basically an MX5) is great fun at road speeds; I can slide it around easily. I know on track however it would offer little challenge after a few laps and I'd get bored.
Julian Thompson said:
Thanks for those opinions - still can’t make my mind up!
If you have your mind set on an Elise it's a niche choice, picking the right variant for what you would use it for is a niche within a niche!Luckily there are plenty of models and upgrades to incorporate into a base car to make a your own bespoke spec.
As a side note, you should know the Elise better than anyone Julian!
Since all of the suspension parts are interchangeable, you can make any Elise based car handle pretty much like any other Elise based car and few of the older cars are standard anymore anyway. Yes there's some difference in weight but they still all feel pretty similar... so it mostly just comes down to which engine, interior and styling you prefer.
For me, the K-series is king of the OEM engines - the VHPD is most entertaining, but overall I prefer the VVC for daily use. However, if I was buying again now I'd probably go for an early S2 with a Honda K20 conversion.
For me, the K-series is king of the OEM engines - the VHPD is most entertaining, but overall I prefer the VVC for daily use. However, if I was buying again now I'd probably go for an early S2 with a Honda K20 conversion.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 14th August 17:13
Tickle said:
Julian Thompson said:
Thanks for those opinions - still can’t make my mind up!
If you have your mind set on an Elise it's a niche choice, picking the right variant for what you would use it for is a niche within a niche!Luckily there are plenty of models and upgrades to incorporate into a base car to make a your own bespoke spec.
As a side note, you should know the Elise better than anyone Julian!
Yes I would certainly consider a Caterham 7 over the rear engined feel of an elise. However I specifically listed the Caterham 21 and Ginetta for specific reasons. Both...
1. Look sexy as hell.
2. Keep you dry.
3. Have good aero, unlike a 7.
4. Have front to rear balance, unlike an elise.
If you like putting in a sensible tidy lap and love the elise feel, fine. Just not for me.
I have fully adjustable dampers, H&R anti rolls bars, you name it on mine. I can set it up any way I like. But none of this will change where the hundreds of kg sit.
1. Look sexy as hell.
2. Keep you dry.
3. Have good aero, unlike a 7.
4. Have front to rear balance, unlike an elise.
If you like putting in a sensible tidy lap and love the elise feel, fine. Just not for me.
I have fully adjustable dampers, H&R anti rolls bars, you name it on mine. I can set it up any way I like. But none of this will change where the hundreds of kg sit.
Kubevoid said:
Yes I would certainly consider a Caterham 7 over the rear engined feel of an elise. However I specifically listed the Caterham 21 and Ginetta for specific reasons. Both...
1. Look sexy as hell.
2. Keep you dry.
3. Have good aero, unlike a 7.
4. Have front to rear balance, unlike an elise.
If you like putting in a sensible tidy lap and love the elise feel, fine. Just not for me.
I have fully adjustable dampers, H&R anti rolls bars, you name it on mine. I can set it up any way I like. But none of this will change where the hundreds of kg sit.
1. Look sexy as hell.
2. Keep you dry.
3. Have good aero, unlike a 7.
4. Have front to rear balance, unlike an elise.
If you like putting in a sensible tidy lap and love the elise feel, fine. Just not for me.
I have fully adjustable dampers, H&R anti rolls bars, you name it on mine. I can set it up any way I like. But none of this will change where the hundreds of kg sit.
I hope you are interested in driving and therefore can forget the sexy as hell bit.
The G27 and C21 weren't commercially successful for a reason - and you'll find them vanishing thin on the ground The Elise was, taken all round, a much better car than either. If you really want a less rear biased weight distribution you are really only looking at a Caterham and will have to suffer the privations that come with them. A Caterham makes financial sense, expensive as they are to buy - they hardly depreciate (unllike the many clones) - and there are lots of options to choose from, For me on the right day on the right road a Caterham trumps older Elises - but then on similar days an Elise - especially a more recent one - would be preferable to anything else I have driven (including my Alpine).
These days - where I live - those days are rare. That wasn't the case 20 years ago.
kambites said:
Since all of the suspension parts are interchangeable, you can make any Elise based car handle pretty much like any other Elise based car and few of the older cars are standard anymore anyway. Yes there's some difference in weight but they still all feel pretty similar... so it mostly just comes down to which engine, interior and styling you prefer.
For me, the K-series is king of the OEM engines - the VHPD is most entertaining, but overall I prefer the VVC for daily use. However, if I was buying again now I'd probably go for an early S2 with a Honda K20 conversion.
Yes I know a fair bit about the K series from my Superlight R days.For me, the K-series is king of the OEM engines - the VHPD is most entertaining, but overall I prefer the VVC for daily use. However, if I was buying again now I'd probably go for an early S2 with a Honda K20 conversion.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 14th August 17:13
What makes you say you’d prefer the Honda motor? Surely that’s a right heavy lump compared?
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