RE: Mazda MX-5 BBR Super 220 | Driven
Discussion
V8 FOU said:
ben5575 said:
Yes, it's the stock PH journalist joke for every article.
.
That and "twist".... it's torque you dummy..
And Yawn, another MX5 article. PH MX5 matters......
And there's plenty more on the site to read beyond MX-5. What did you expect to be written? ;-)
redroadster said:
Drove on Sunday really disappointed vibration through gear lever was irritating ,scuttle shake and felt too harsh a ride and before everyone jumps in there's no need for a sports car to rattle about just good dampers and set up would sort .
See it's funny, I like to be able to feel the engine through the gearstick (I don't have an MX5 though...) and would have assumed that these little bits of 'connection' that you don't get in some limp wristed German box where everything is suppressed through dampers etc. is exactly why people would want an MX5. Jeez I mean after changing the gearstick to one with a metal shaft the fact that that gets warm is appealing to me, as it just makes one feel more connected to the car
Shows what a tough job it is trying to please the car buying public!
I'd love an ND MX5, especially with the BBR kit, as a daily, but I just can't come to terms with how much a new car costs, so I shall likely forever get my kicks elsewhere
fido said:
Yes. But another thing to note is peak power is produced lower in the rev range (7800 for this BBR). The Integra Mk1 produced peak at 8700 rpm using lumpy cams whereas this SkyActive has dual valve-timing throught the rev range. So whilst headline bhp/litre figures haven't changed that much - you're getting a cleaner, more robust / cheaper-to-produce N/A engine. I'm sure they could deliver 125bhp/litre but then it will be Ferrari money instead of MX-5 small change.
ITR didn't produce peak power at 8700, that's above its redline!Edited by fido on Tuesday 20th August 11:34
Matt Bird said:
You won't believe me, but Nic put 'twist' in - it was torque when it was sent to him!
And there's plenty more on the site to read beyond MX-5. What did you expect to be written? ;-)
You’re right, I don’t believe you. And there's plenty more on the site to read beyond MX-5. What did you expect to be written? ;-)
Personally I thought it was a well written article. I have no problem with journalists trying to make their pros more than a dry description of the facts. And I’m perfectly happy for articles to mention Hethel, Stuttgart, or even Brackley.
I can’t see why anyone would complain about an MX-5 article. It’s not like print media where it might be stealing space from stories about other cars. And this is a lot more interesting than another 400bhp 4 wheel drive German hatchback.
Yes yeeees. Keep the ND threads running.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:27
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:30
Matt Bird said:
You won't believe me, but Nic put 'twist' in - it was torque when it was sent to him!
And there's plenty more on the site to read beyond MX-5. What did you expect to be written? ;-)
And I was so close to adding that NC must have added his magic touch to it...!And there's plenty more on the site to read beyond MX-5. What did you expect to be written? ;-)
Please note I was only partially quoted above. In my OP I went on to say that I enjoyed the article. Great car and looking forward to seeing a video of it in action.
Niffty951 said:
Yes yeeees. Keep the ND threads running.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Nice reading this post and feeling your anticipation for when it finally arrives! Must confess I'm more of a glutton for punishment by keeping my mk2.5 in good nick, with some minor tweaks to make it more fun. But I do know where you're coming from! The ND is a really compelling car.... even the simplicity and speed of lowering and raising the hood is a breath of fresh air (no pun intended, but kind of feeling smug that I did!) compared to the complexity of motorised systems, which can be a nightmare when they break..... as it did half way through its cycle when I had a TT convertible. As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:27
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:30
fido said:
Yes. But another thing to note is peak power is produced lower in the rev range (7800 for this BBR). The Integra Mk1 produced peak at 8700 rpm using lumpy cams whereas this SkyActive has dual valve-timing throught the rev range. So whilst headline bhp/litre figures haven't changed that much - you're getting a cleaner, more robust / cheaper-to-produce N/A engine. I'm sure they could deliver 125bhp/litre but then it will be Ferrari money instead of MX-5 small change.
If you are talking Integra R B18C your figures are somewhat out.Edited by fido on Tuesday 20th August 11:34
Peak power for the JDM models was made at ~8000rpm with rev limiter at 8500- despite what might have been seen on the Rev counter or what Wikipedia says.
Oh & all made from under 1800cc too...
humphra said:
Niffty951 said:
Yes yeeees. Keep the ND threads running.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Nice reading this post and feeling your anticipation for when it finally arrives! Must confess I'm more of a glutton for punishment by keeping my mk2.5 in good nick, with some minor tweaks to make it more fun. But I do know where you're coming from! The ND is a really compelling car.... even the simplicity and speed of lowering and raising the hood is a breath of fresh air (no pun intended, but kind of feeling smug that I did!) compared to the complexity of motorised systems, which can be a nightmare when they break..... as it did half way through its cycle when I had a TT convertible. As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:27
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:30
Glad you enjoyed the ND so much - I really must try one!
Niffty951 said:
Yes yeeees. Keep the ND threads running.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Do you have your car yet or are you still waiting?As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:27
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:30
greenarrow said:
humphra said:
Niffty951 said:
Yes yeeees. Keep the ND threads running.
As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Nice reading this post and feeling your anticipation for when it finally arrives! Must confess I'm more of a glutton for punishment by keeping my mk2.5 in good nick, with some minor tweaks to make it more fun. But I do know where you're coming from! The ND is a really compelling car.... even the simplicity and speed of lowering and raising the hood is a breath of fresh air (no pun intended, but kind of feeling smug that I did!) compared to the complexity of motorised systems, which can be a nightmare when they break..... as it did half way through its cycle when I had a TT convertible. As a long term MX-5 hater, annoyed by the gap between public opinion and my own driving experiences. I've never understood why a soggy chassis, open diff, unimpressive brakes and wheezy underwhelming engine in the NA and NB cars excited so much driving love? I typically consider drivers cars to be things like the Cayman S and Z4MC. Or if it must be low powered a 924s.
Slowly though the MX-5 seems to have been getting better and better. Like the frog in the pan being slowly boiled or the many tiny changes that make the most special 911s it seems no one has really made enough fuss about the latest MX-5. The interior now feels not like a Christmas cracker toy but feels screwed together like a mk6 golf. The body looks not only better than ever before, but like a baby Aston and with soo much or it's own character. The chassis is now stiffer, an LSD has been added, the sound proofing is bearable and the 2.0 engine at 7500rpm is strong. Almost too strong for the character of the car. It can now break traction in a turn, even at regular revs like a 3.0 Z4 and it picks up speed like a proper sports car. It is a totally different character and that comes totally unexpectedly in an MX-5 body.
I only came to drive the latest Mazda because it was around the corner from VW and I was curious, I quite enjoyed the NC. However, the ND Gen2 completely exceeded my expectations from the moment I dropped into the surprisingly comfortable drivers seat, to the moment I put my hands and feet on the controls realising how perfectly the driver slotted into the cockpit. Then finally when I opened up the throttle on the slip road and wound out to the limiter finding comfortable levels of low rpm torque extended out into real rev happy enthusiasm. The car felt a thousand miles from my memories of older MX-5s.
Now I understand this is not popular reading for old mx-5 owners and I apologise for the offense but I feel there are probably a lot of people out there who will read the media praise bestowed on the ND (as I did) through a filter of previous mx-5 experiences. That means they may very well miss out on what may well be one of the best fun track toys ever released as a factory model.
Perhaps it is exaggerated (as mentioned in your life test) by the change in the cars available around it but I recently found myself left cold by the universally loved Cayman GT4 on the road. Sure, it was of course superbly capable and on a track you wouldn't catch it in much this side of a GTR or 911 turbo but with the feeling of that experience fresh in my mind. The little Mazda just felt so much more connected, it asked for more input from the driver and gave more in return. Not only that but the chassis could be explored at speeds that actually allowed you to chase the limits of the tyres without feeling intimidated or reaching 3 figure speeds out of roundabouts.
In fact, the turn around in my opinions were so complete that I bought one! I've been waiting so long I've now sucked dry the internet of every review and track video I can find and I can't bloody wait!
If you need further convincing, don't take it from me. Watch these reviews:
https://youtu.be/TSymwd3FY-A
https://youtu.be/IxMUwhJisgg
Especially the second one just captures my feelings perfectly. Damn good driver too.
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:27
Edited by Niffty951 on Tuesday 20th August 22:30
Glad you enjoyed the ND so much - I really must try one!
low power and open diff are fine on the public road, especially in a low powered, light communicative car. the real reason why many sneered at the early versions was more to do with girly proportions and hairdresser comments.
once on track it needed modifying. chassis bracing, suspension and maybe more power. and because so many did, the mods became plentiful, reliable and relatively cheap. It was the car that introduced me to modding, something i'd previously thought of as either expensive, unreliable, difficult or very much the realm of spotty teenagers and slamming. A well sorted NA (from 1.5k of mods upwards) is a weapon when away from long straights.
And then the ND. Mazda persist with jinba ittai sloppiness. this model still needs mods to make it fly, not that a few k extra is unreasonable for the performance you get at the end.
stickleback123 said:
PATTERNPART said:
Can you get one without the dashboard info screen? Looks wrong to me, on a convertible.
Yes, the base spec car doesn't have the screen. £17k new with a deposit contribution from the finance company too!chrismc1977 said:
If you are talking Integra R B18C your figures are somewhat out.
Peak power for the JDM models was made at ~8000rpm with rev limiter at 8500- despite what might have been seen on the Rev counter or what Wikipedia says.
Oh & all made from under 1800cc too...
It was a great engine no doubt, but even allowing for the 200cc advantange, just compare the torque curve with a 2.0 Skyactiv which is much flatter and peaks earlier (151 lb-ft of torque at 4,000 rpm). I never got 40mpg from my DC2 but it's very repeatable in an MX-5, no doubt helped by the 6th gear.Peak power for the JDM models was made at ~8000rpm with rev limiter at 8500- despite what might have been seen on the Rev counter or what Wikipedia says.
Oh & all made from under 1800cc too...
fido said:
It was a great engine no doubt, but even allowing for the 200cc advantange, just compare the torque curve with a 2.0 Skyactiv which is much flatter and peaks earlier (151 lb-ft of torque at 4,000 rpm). I never got 40mpg from my DC2 but it's very repeatable in an MX-5, no doubt helped by the 6th gear.
150lbs/ft from a 2L is hardly spectacular in my book however.The B18C was designed as a rev-happy motor. Not a mega amount of torque granted at 135lbs/ft - but hauling a slippery ~1100kgs & revving to 8.5k it was & remains a brilliant engine considering it was designed in the early 90’s....
If I ever worried about getting close to 40mpg I’d sell it tbh.
The Integra type R engine was indeed brilliant and an example of Honda in its prime...however its now 2019 and even Honda don't produce high revving n/a engines any more for its cars. So we have to appreciate the fact that Mazda still give us this n/a engine, even if it doesn't reach the heights of those old V Tec engines.
Quickmoose said:
shantybeater said:
Can't help but think this is a perfect modern day upgrade to an s2000. Just need to wait for prices to drop a bit!
not sure why you would though?build quality?
There'd have to be a large upgrade in a lot of areas for me to consider changing mine. I don't care that mine is 13 years older. This is not 13 years better imo….
Bloody lovely, jut not better enough
The ND is about the only modern roadster that interests me. OK, there is the Elise, but it might be a bit too hair shirt by comparison.
greenarrow said:
The Integra type R engine was indeed brilliant and an example of Honda in its prime...however its now 2019 and even Honda don't produce high revving n/a engines any more for its cars. So we have to appreciate the fact that Mazda still give us this n/a engine, even if it doesn't reach the heights of those old V Tec engines.
Yes indeed. Thumbs up for Mazda not selling their soul & staying N/A.There is no better thrill than driving a fun car with a sweet n/a motor that begs to be revved. The modern point & squirt turbo/dsg brigade have no idea what they missed out on whilst crowing about how fast their latest Euro-hatch happens to be.
Lightweight, revs & a great chassis absolutely trumps the driving experience
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