RE: Lamborghini Sian introduces 819hp hybrid V12
Discussion
Maldini35 said:
CharlieAlphaMike said:
This has gone completely off topic now but I dated a Sian and she was born in the 70's and moved down to London sometime in the 90's to study at University 
We need to get to the bottom on this! jet_noise said:
Very techie query this on the "supercapacitor" (that the obligatory 30s internet search does not answer).
Supercaps tend to be low voltage and really suffer at high temperatures.
Does anyone know who makes vehicle traction capable parts and/or how the tech has improved?
Capacitors store charge directly, unlike a chemical battery, where the electrical energy is transferred and stored via a chemical process. And the charge on a capacitor is proportional to the electrode area available for the charge, and inversely proportional to the distance between the charge storing electrodes. As such, the thinner that gap, the more energy you can store. But the thinner the gap, the lower the potential difference (voltage) that can overcome the insulation of that gap and jumpa cross, effectively shorting the capacitor out. As a result, supercapacitors have a low voltage per capacitor, typically between 1 and 3 volts. In order to be useful therefore many such capacitors must be connected in series to boost the voltage. And then, those modules or capacitors will also be connected in series with other modules. The other issue is that the voltage on a capacitor is directly proportional to the charge and hence, energy, held. So to be useful, for example to be connected to an electric motor, the capacitor bank must pass it's power via a suitable voltage convertor, that outputs a more constant voltage no matter what the actual capacitor bank voltage actually is.Supercaps tend to be low voltage and really suffer at high temperatures.
Does anyone know who makes vehicle traction capable parts and/or how the tech has improved?
At high temperatures, all capacitors with liquid electrolytes suffer from evaporation and leakage, leading to reduced capacity and eventually, failure.
Companies like Maxwell have successfully pushed their supercap tech into less aggressive environments for things like UPS and back up supplies, but the automotive environment is extremely challenging. I don't know who's supercaps are in this new system, but i suspect they are supplied via an existing Tier1 like Valeo, Magnettit Marelli or Pankl etc
Thanks MT.
I'm in auto electronics so understand the basics. It's the specifics of supercaps for traction and the automotive environment that is novel.
A colleague was with McLaren a couple of years ago and at that time KERS was batteries so if F1 use it (as blurb says) it's very new.
Magnetti Marelli copy the press release on their website but it doesn't say which bits they do.
I found an automotive supercap product guide
I'm in auto electronics so understand the basics. It's the specifics of supercaps for traction and the automotive environment that is novel.
A colleague was with McLaren a couple of years ago and at that time KERS was batteries so if F1 use it (as blurb says) it's very new.
Magnetti Marelli copy the press release on their website but it doesn't say which bits they do.
I found an automotive supercap product guide
Capxx product guide said:
17. Response to Over-Temperature Events CAP-XX supercapacitors are heat-sensitive. Over-heating of the supercapacitor may result in a degradation of performance and useful life. Note that the thermal mass of CAP-XX supercapacitors is very small, so the temperature of the device will equalize to its environment very quickly. G series devices are rated to a maximum temperature of 70°C, whilst the H series is rated to 85°C. CAP-XX does not recommend operating supercapacitors at or near their maximum temperature rating constantly, as they will age rapidly (i.e. ESR will rise and capacitance will fall). Exceeding the rated maximum temperature will cause even more accelerated ageing, and may cause immediate failure depending on the temperature reached and the time exposed. At temperatures between 85°C and 100°C, there will be a progressive change in the dimensions of the package (puffing). Usually, this is reversible, and electrical performance is retained. As the temperature approaches 100°C, the probability of non-reversible change increases. This will occasionally cause immediate failure, and degraded electrical performance due to physical damage to the internal structure of the device. At temperatures greater than 100°C, electrical performance will degrade rapidly, and permanent electrical failure becomes increasingly likely. At 150°C or higher, the seals will melt and the device will fail both physically and electrically.
Striple said:
Article said this...
"active cooling vanes that move through material reaction when things get hot."
...So as the temperature rises the material the vanes are made of react causing the vanes to open? This sounds amazing if I'm reading that correctly
Isn't that just a Bimetallic strip ?"active cooling vanes that move through material reaction when things get hot."
...So as the temperature rises the material the vanes are made of react causing the vanes to open? This sounds amazing if I'm reading that correctly
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff