RE: Alfa Romeo 145 Cloverleaf | Spotted

[Jon_S_Rally]

Greg the Fish said:

Ever driven one? They're a hoot.

No I haven't actually, but would happily give one a go. My point was more that, at that money, it's up against some stiff competition, so it's not going to appeal to many given the gauky looks and questionable reliability.

Poppiecock said:

They were the last of the proper 'old school' hot hatches. Light weight, revvy N/A engine, stiff suspension, pointy handling and nothing that wasn't needed to make them go like a scolded cat. Really raucous and noisy things, too.

I love them, but circumstances never allowed me to have one, as they were always just a bit too raw as an only car.

Various Renault Sport Clios might have something to say about that...

[effkay]

Love these, but I'm biased





Pics of all the work, trips and track days I've done: http://s922.photobucket.com/user/effkay84/library/...

Lots of videos on my youtube page: https://www.youtube.com/user/effkay84/videos

[Poppiecock]

Jon_S_Rally said:

Various Renault Sport Clios might have something to say about that...

Until you've driven one, you wouldn't understand.

Renault Sport Clios are sanitised shopping trolleys in comparison.

[Krikkit]

Poppiecock said:

Jon_S_Rally said:

Various Renault Sport Clios might have something to say about that...

Until you've driven one, you wouldn't understand.

Renault Sport Clios are sanitised shopping trolleys in comparison.

I suspect that's a gross over-exaggeration, but regardless there are some brilliant hatches around from this era.

[dickon]

Had a couple of 145s, a 1.7 boxer which sounded great but was gutless and needed 4k rpm and a lot of clutch to get away with any haste (it eventually burnt a valve on the way to Denmark), then a 2.0 ts...

That was a great fun car, engine was the best bit - linear power curve to 7k rpm but still torquey enough from 2k to make it really flexible - sharp steering and idiot proof handling (just choose how much understeer with the right pedal...) Think that was why journos didn't rate them too much, that and the body roll, which didn't detract in my opinion.

Well reliable for 20k miles too.

I'd enjoy a run in one again for a trip down memory lane 👍😁

[mrpenks]

I really liked my 146ti.

It was zingy and felt fast. Chassis was excellent too. Electrics were a bit part time though and got fed up being locked out or without wipers.

Weirdly, I replaced it with a 98 Spider TS which was bulletproof with no electrical gremlins.

[s m]

In the dying days of the original PERFORMANCE CAR magazine, they did a big back to back test of a fair few of the hot hatches if the time (1998)

Alfa 145 Cloverleaf was one of the cars featured and put through all the tests etc

[Poppiecock]

That doesn't tell the full story - there was something special in how the Alfa made you feel, you felt like you were in something special.

The Bravo HGT is also more than the sum of its parts. That 20v engine is a cracker. Looked great in 'broom yellow', too.

[callahan]

I had a 146ti as my first new car (well, ex demo) that was sold to me by a crazy test drive with the sales guy at JCT2000 in Leeds. Apparently he also raced Ferraris and that's how he drove the Alfa. I had to buy it after that drive.
Many happy memories of driving home to York from various parts of the country and always taking the fun route home. One of my favourite cars.

Edited by callahan on Monday 16th September 21:37

[daithi28]

I couldn't afford the insurance back in the day for the 145 Cloverleaf. Or the 1.8. Or the Junior for that matter.

Ended up with the 1.4 Twinspark 🙁

It was not fast, I ragged the life out of the 104bhp engine, but in it's defence, it never died, even though there was always the awful smell of leaking gearbox oil dripping on the exhaust downpipe. Good times......

[AC43]

Poppiecock said:

Greg the Fish said:

Jon_S_Rally said:

Love how people are slating the wheels, even though they are no doubt lighter and stronger than whatever it had from the factory

I could never get on with the looks of these cars myself and, for this money, you could be in a 306 of some kind. If you want something odd ball, for about 60% less, you could have a Xsara VTS. This has to be one for the Alfa fans only.

Ever driven one? They're a hoot.

They were the last of the proper 'old school' hot hatches. Light weight, revvy N/A engine, stiff suspension, pointy handling and nothing that wasn't needed to make them go like a scolded cat. Really raucous and noisy things, too.

I love them.

After the glory years of Suds and Sprints then the relative disappointment of 33's (I had them all) I thought the 145 2.0 Cloverleaf was a massive return to form.

A friend of mine had one and I loved blatting around in it.

[Poppiecock]

The 33 16v was a bit of a cracker, to be fair. Mind you, even the standard 1.7iE could outrun an XR3i and wasn't far off Golf GTI 8v performance.

[AC43]

Poppiecock said:

The 33 16v was a bit of a cracker, to be fair. Mind you, even the standard 1.7iE could outrun an XR3i and wasn't far off Golf GTI 8v performance.

I really liked the look of the pre-facelift 1.5 Green Cloverleaf that I had but it was crying out for a bit more grunt. Plus the brakes were a major step back from the Sud as was the rear suspension and steering. All attempts at cost cutting I guess.

The later 1.7's were a whole lot better in terms of power an torque but looking back on it development budgets must have been pretty modest for the the 33.

The 145, in GC form at last, meant that Alfa were right back in the game.

[4F6]

I had one. a '99 145 QV in Red. Spent ages finding a good one, you know the score, one owner, FSH and all that.

In the two years I owned it, I can honestly say I got the full Alfa experience. When it worked, on the right day and the right road, it was brilliant. But when it didn't... oh my the breakdowns.

In the two years I had it, it was ruinoiusly expensive. If it could go wrong, it generally did.

[Digga]

AC43 said:

Poppiecock said:

The 33 16v was a bit of a cracker, to be fair. Mind you, even the standard 1.7iE could outrun an XR3i and wasn't far off Golf GTI 8v performance.

I really liked the look of the pre-facelift 1.5 Green Cloverleaf that I had but it was crying out for a bit more grunt. Plus the brakes were a major step back from the Sud as was the rear suspension and steering. All attempts at cost cutting I guess.

The later 1.7's were a whole lot better in terms of power an torque but looking back on it development budgets must have been pretty modest for the the 33.

The 145, in GC form at last, meant that Alfa were right back in the game.

Mrs Digga had 1.5 145. This was, I believe, the vary last car to run the flat-four boxer engine, as seen in the 33 and Alfasud. She loved the car - almost had to prize the keys out of her hands once it just got too old and leggy to be reliable, but it did sterling service for at least 70k miles.

The boxer was a really revvy engine. It liked to rev and there was little torque or power, until you were at top end. You always felt you had to keep it on the boil. Changing into a new 325i M Sport coupe took a bit of right foot re-calibration for her.

Love the 145 though and how well has it aged? Well, on the outside, at least.

[Jon_S_Rally]

Poppiecock said:

Until you've driven one, you wouldn't understand.

Renault Sport Clios are sanitised shopping trolleys in comparison.

Ah yes, the usual Alfa enthusiast's line of, "you wouldn't understand". It can cover all manner of sins

I'd be more than happy to do a back-to-back comparison, but I suspect there is a little rose-tinted spectacle influence going on here.

[Mike1990]

Looking back now, how great was the 90’s the for the hot-hatch, especially that segment, near all of them had highly strung 2.0 N/A’s with about 150bhp being the ball-park figure, small wheels, ‘sporty’ suspension, it must have been a joy.

[velocemitch]

Jon_S_Rally said:

Poppiecock said:

Until you've driven one, you wouldn't understand.

Renault Sport Clios are sanitised shopping trolleys in comparison.

Ah yes, the usual Alfa enthusiast's line of, "you wouldn't understand". It can cover all manner of sins

I'd be more than happy to do a back-to-back comparison, but I suspect there is a little rose-tinted spectacle influence going on here.

I can offer an Interesting comparison between a 145QV and a Renault Clio 172. A couple of years back I regularly navigate for my brother on night road rallies, a few years back we used a Clio 172, standard Car with just a cage and spot lights. One of our regular sparring partners was a guy with a 145QV, we tended to be seeded at about the same so had a number of interesting runs. It was mostly Lancashire events and they were locals and knew the roads really well, my brother mostly relied on me and my map reading skills... (he was at a disadvantage!!! ) on normal fast B and C roads we found we could never quite keep up with the Alfa, either on pure performance or on the bends. On the rougher 'whites' we had no chance.
The conclusion I would draw from this is that there really isn't much difference in the abilitiy of a 145QV and a Clio 172 on a typical UK back road.

Incidentally the Alfa is still out being used and is faster than ever, our Clio has gone to that great Rally Selective in the sky following a roll.

[Digga]

velocemitch said:

The conclusion I would draw from this is that there really isn't much difference in the abilitiy of a 145QV and a Clio 172 on a typical UK back road.

High praise indeed. In contemporary terms, there's no much better it could be compared with and road rallying is certainly a very real test of all aspects of performance. Interesting to know - I did always wonder what was possible with the 145 QV, but never drove one.

[kiseca]

Fast Lane tested one of these against whatever the equivalent Civic hot hatch was of the time.

I remember their conclusion almost word for word because it reminded me what I liked so much about my even older Alfa: To enjoy the Civic you need a smooth road with fast, sweeping and well sighted corners. To enjoy the Alfa, you just need a road.