RE: From Roma with love | PH Footnote

RE: From Roma with love | PH Footnote

Saturday 16th November

From Roma with love | PH Footnote

Ferrari's new '2+' GT couldn't have come at a worse time for Aston Martin...



Thanks to the relentlessness of modern life cycles, launches like this week's Ferrari Roma are years in the planning. Denied the day-to-day flexibility to react to their rivals like a supermarket chain pricing petrol, car manufacturers place their bets well in advance and then cross their corporate fingers. Back when the Roma entered its initial design and development stages, Ferrari would likely have guessed at where it would rivals would be upon completion. But few would have foreseen the scale of the challenge currently facing Aston Martin.

By virtue of miraculous strategic vision or fortuitous good luck (for the Italians, at least) Ferrari now finds itself launching a model which strikes right at the heart of Aston's core market, just at the British brand endures one of its most tumultuous periods in recent times.


The company's share price has fallen by nearly 75 per cent since it floated on the stock market last year; it has seen a Β£20.8 million profit in the first half of 2018 turn into a Β£78.8 million pre-tax loss in the same period this year. More than Β£3 billion has been wiped off its overall value and, with Brexit uncertainty continuing to dent its forecasts, the company has found itself taking out a Β£120 million loan just to help see its now-make-or-break DBX SUV across the line.

The Roma is by no means alone in encroaching on Aston's territory. But while McLaren's recent foray into GT cars won't necessarily have set alarm bells ringing in Gaydon, Ferrari's certainly will. Aston, of course, is planning its own land-grab with a forthcoming series of mid-engined super and hypercars. - although at the current rate of progress, the introduction of the Valkyrie, Vanquish and Valhalla seems very far away indeed.

Things will appear even more perilous if Ferrari manages to coax significant portion of DB11 (and perhaps even Vanquish) customers into the Roma. Certainly that is the plan, with Maranello freely admitting that the new model was designed with new customers in mind.


Its styling is either classically beautiful or generically inoffensive depending on how you look at it; either way the heavy overtones of Aston and Jaguar are hard to miss. Combine that with a front-mid-mounted V8 that has won International Engine of the Year a record four times running and the best power to weight ratio in its class - not to mention the generous three-year unlimited mileage warranty and seven-year servicing package that Ferrari throws in with the purchase of every new car - and it looks a formidable prospect.

Moreover, as Ferrari bides its time over the launch of its 'FUV' crossover, and Aston scrambles to bring the DBX to market, it's hard to see how this week's developments in Rome could have been better timed to torment the decision makers in Gaydon. Aston's Second Century plan, once a vision of excitement and positivity, is only five years old - but it will require increasingly careful navigation to see the brand prosper in all its intended markets.


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Author
Discussion

Snozzer

Original Poster:

50 posts

89 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Have to agree. Better looking than anything in the current Aston stable. If the new Vantage was 40% cheaper and 80% better looking they might have had a chance. The DBX is late to an already full party and won't save them.

wab172uk

1,471 posts

175 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Apart from the engines (Thanks to Mercedes) everything about Aston Martin feels one step behind it's rivals. Their cars are always heavier than their rivals. The technology always last generation compared to their rivals, and now once things of Beauty, the design is fussy.

At the same price point I'd take a Roma over and Aston any day of the week. But Astons only trump card will be you can have one quickly compared to the Roma, which will no doubt have a waiting list?

It's a real shame for Aston Martin. I really wish they could just hit the sweet spot it's rivals always seem to do.

Now if Porsche brought out a re-imagined 928GT, that would probably be the end of Aston Martin, as that and the Roma would just eat most of the sales.

smilo996

1,512 posts

118 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
With JLR looking for a partner and Aston running into stormy water. Joining the two would seem the most logical proposition.
It is a real shame Aston is running into trouble. Palmer has worked wonders and been bold. But it would seem there is a lot to support a tie up. Their ranges do not overlap, JLR has the capacity and engines. Aston can bring hairdryers to the Jag range, the DBX could have been plonked on a Land Rover platform, without needing to build a new factory. Aston brings class to JLR and JLR brings economies of scale and capacity.
I really hope that Aston and JLR see their current problems through rather thsn being consumed by zee Germans. They do their thing well but consumers need diversity and range of innovation and independent thinking rather than badges stemming from BMW or VW.

mwebster1

1 posts

1 month

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Dull, uninspiring and uncool.

I would rather take an Aston any day. (Esp the Vanquish)

Gandahar

7,734 posts

76 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Aston need to swap over to the DBX and Valhalla asap.

The Vantage was a huge blunder. This Ferrari shows why. Styling.

And improve your interiors for the old fashioned clientele.

It's not fecking rocket science

the current Vantage looks like a pigs abortion.


Sorry but it's true., and beng so ugly you can no longer ask for more money than the Porsche

Who signed off the Vantage? They need to to be put out for farrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPOzQzk9Qo



Edited by Gandahar on Saturday 16th November 14:30

spikyone

393 posts

48 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
Aston need to swap over to the DBX and Valhalla asap.

The Vantage was a huge blunder. This Ferrari shows why. Styling.

And improve your interiors for the old fashioned clientele.

It's not fecking rocket science

the current Vantage looks like a pigs abortion.


Sorry but it's true., and beng so ugly you can no longer ask for more money than the Porsche

Who signed off the Vantage? They need to to be put out for farrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPOzQzk9Qo



Edited by Gandahar on Saturday 16th November 14:30
This Ferrari is bland and Aston-like - hard to see why you'd criticise an Aston yet praise a car that borrows heavily from its styling. The front of the Roma looks particularly goofy.

And why the obsession (generally, on this thread and previous ones) with mentioning the Vantage alongside the Roma? The Roma is likely to be £180k; about 50% more than a Vantage. You could have a very well specced DB11 for £180k, if anything that is Aston's closest competitor. If you're buying at £100k+ it's probably neither here nor there, but the Vantage is not a Roma competitor.

BigChiefmuffinAgain

200 posts

46 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Although the Vantage is a lot cheaper, it still depreciates horribly whereas this probably won't, so cost over 3 years or so ( which is how long these cars tend to be owned ) will be similar. In which case, if you can get one, most would take the Ferrari.

The only issue, and the reason I say probably, is that the California, which was a sort of similar everyday Ferrari concept, was not well received critically and this seems to have hit residuals.

C.MW

185 posts

17 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Yea, admit this looks better than others in their line up. But elegance is still not exactly the word to describe its styling. The DB11, while far from perfect, still has that in spades. Considering the target audience of these cars, I do not think DB11 sales will suffer as much as the author fears they will.

hammo19

2,062 posts

144 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Beautiful - reminds me a little of one of my other favourites the 456.

Goofnik

207 posts

88 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Genuinely curious as to how much boot space it’ll have. Not a ton of good looking GT coupes coming out any more, as it’s been a long dying segment (despite recent efforts to prop it up).

I agree that it’s a very restrained look, but it means it’ll age very gracefully. That matters if you actually want to keep something forever.

Shame the Bentley EXP10 Speed Six concept will never see the light of day. If they dared to shove a W12 in it I would’ve been all over it.

Cold

7,788 posts

38 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Let's not forget that the DB11 is available with a V12 unlike the Roma and some people like that.


(Stop comparing the Roma with the Vantage - they're in a completely different market segment. Vantage is £120k plus the bits and is a two seater. The Roma is £170k plus options and is a 2+2)

chelme

695 posts

118 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
Aston need to swap over to the DBX and Valhalla asap.

The Vantage was a huge blunder. This Ferrari shows why. Styling.

And improve your interiors for the old fashioned clientele.

It's not fecking rocket science

the current Vantage looks like a pigs abortion.


Sorry but it's true., and beng so ugly you can no longer ask for more money than the Porsche

Who signed off the Vantage? They need to to be put out for farrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPOzQzk9Qo



Edited by Gandahar on Saturday 16th November 14:30
I have to agree. Walked alongside a Vantage today, as it was creeping along Bond Street...had a good moment to look at this car closely...and it's a mess.

The concept showed potential, only for idiotic fussy design details to ruin the shape of the car.

And let's not start on the interior and the C Class engine...

Such a faux pas, no wonder the share price fell through the floor.

Lt. Coulomb

104 posts

2 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Dark clouds over Gaydon

eftiem64

39 posts

27 months

Saturday 16th November
quotequote all
Ferrari hasn’t produced a great looking car since the f355.

Aston may be old school, Jag a poor man’s Aston (and still guaranteed to strand you at the side of the road on occasion) and Porsche build some God-ugly motors (Cayenne, Macan, especially Panamera) but this is a good looking Fezza from the rear, OK from the side and horrific from the front.

Ferrari used to build elegant fast sports cars, now it seems to have lost the plot.

rare6499

312 posts

87 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
The DB11 / Vanquish look like Aston Martins.

The Roma doesn’t look like a Ferrari, it looks like some kind of amalgamation of at least three other brands. Take the badge off it and there’s no way you would know it was a Ferrari other than say the wheels.

I would take the AM equivalent all day long.

I wish AM the best - too many people are way too negative about a brand we should be proud of. They’ve made some fantastic cars over the years, I for one hope the DBX sells well.

dukebox9reg

1,282 posts

96 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
chelme said:
Gandahar said:
Aston need to swap over to the DBX and Valhalla asap.

The Vantage was a huge blunder. This Ferrari shows why. Styling.

And improve your interiors for the old fashioned clientele.

It's not fecking rocket science

the current Vantage looks like a pigs abortion.


Sorry but it's true., and beng so ugly you can no longer ask for more money than the Porsche

Who signed off the Vantage? They need to to be put out for farrow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHPOzQzk9Qo



Edited by Gandahar on Saturday 16th November 14:30
I have to agree. Walked alongside a Vantage today, as it was creeping along Bond Street...had a good moment to look at this car closely...and it's a mess.

The concept showed potential, only for idiotic fussy design details to ruin the shape of the car.

And let's not start on the interior and the C Class engine...

Such a faux pas, no wonder the share price fell through the floor.
I disagree. Iive near Gaydon so see quite a few of them about. Saw a burnt orange one in Gaydon on Friday and it looked stunning. The front end, with the narrow lights and clean lines I think looks great. Rear maybe a little fussy and the exhausts look oddly small. Interior is not an AM interior. I think the interior is the weakest area on this new one by far

Pothole

27,780 posts

230 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
Who signed off the Vantage? They need to to be put out for farrow.
Huh?

Niffty951

1,828 posts

176 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
Let's not get too negative. The DB11 might be the best Aston ever made as an all round prospect and the twin turbo V12 is not only a USP in the market but a ferocious, apocalyptic sounding thing. The first time I heard it at flat chat I thought. Now that's something special.. and fast!

dunebuggy

48 posts

63 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
That Ferrari is hardly pretty...
The Vantage is ugly too but at least the DB11 is beautiful.

CoolHands

10,107 posts

143 months

Sunday 17th November
quotequote all
But anyone is allowed to buy an Aston. With this do you have to have proved your worth first?