Road Rage - have you ever got out of your car?
Discussion
Hats off to Austin for being rather too honest about his road rage. Even if half of it were true he definately needs to take a step back and reconsider.
Amusing to see on a thread about road rage someone who is argueing with everyone. It seems they could start an arguement in an empty room.
Amusing to see on a thread about road rage someone who is argueing with everyone. It seems they could start an arguement in an empty room.
Firstly from a 'self defence' point of view, you need to remove moral judgement and emotion from the equation.
Once you've done that, it becomes a very simple choice; do I respond and run the risk of escalating the situation and all of the consequences that that entails (as happened in your case with the Clio driver), or do nothing and let it go?
It is of course ultimately up to the individual to weigh up the consequences; but my central point is that you need to understand that there will, potentially, be consequences. Just because you are morally right (and you obviously were in this case), doesn't mean that that somehow protects you from the consequences of your actions - it is not a magic shield as you found out at the traffic lights.
Your question is a reframing of popeyewhite's question from a few pages back and indeed the OP. At what point do you decide that something needs to be said? At what point do you get out of the car? That line is different for different people and is a personal choice. Removing the emotion from a situation as I've suggested is easy for me to type on the internet, a lot harder to do in the real world.
See also thread about being stopped by a shop security guard and asked to produce your receipt. That OP's moral indignation has landed him in court. It's the same argument.
Once you've done that, it becomes a very simple choice; do I respond and run the risk of escalating the situation and all of the consequences that that entails (as happened in your case with the Clio driver), or do nothing and let it go?
It is of course ultimately up to the individual to weigh up the consequences; but my central point is that you need to understand that there will, potentially, be consequences. Just because you are morally right (and you obviously were in this case), doesn't mean that that somehow protects you from the consequences of your actions - it is not a magic shield as you found out at the traffic lights.
Your question is a reframing of popeyewhite's question from a few pages back and indeed the OP. At what point do you decide that something needs to be said? At what point do you get out of the car? That line is different for different people and is a personal choice. Removing the emotion from a situation as I've suggested is easy for me to type on the internet, a lot harder to do in the real world.
See also thread about being stopped by a shop security guard and asked to produce your receipt. That OP's moral indignation has landed him in court. It's the same argument.
Bottom line in my opinion is just don't get out, you could be built like a tank and the other guy raging at you could be built like a rake, but who's to say the smaller guy isn't carrying a knife?
It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
James_33 said:
Bottom line in my opinion is just don't get out, you could be built like a tank and the other guy raging at you could be built like a rake, but who's to say the smaller guy isn't carrying a knife?
It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
Except if we follow your logic we'd never leave the house !It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
The last time I got out was to an off duty cop (he produced his warrant card) who seemed to think the law didn't apply to him, wrong lane at island then went berserk when I was faster than him and he couldn't push in.
If you let scum / idiots / bullies get away with it, they become a bigger and bigger problem.
Yes. 1989, stationary in traffic, someone ran into the back of my brand-new Corolla GTI. Very angry, but not intending to come to blows. Must have looked like thunder, because the other driver locked himself in his car and refused to come out until I promised that I wasn't going to hit him.
Had another occasion where I someone came up on the OS and cut across my bows as I was turning left on a roundabout. Only just missed me because I managed to brake in time. When the traffic stopped I got out, tapped on his window, and invited him to discuss the matter further, which he declined to do. Stupid - but you don't tend to think things through when you're younger.
These days, older and wiser, and much more relaxed about such things, I just let it go.
Had another occasion where I someone came up on the OS and cut across my bows as I was turning left on a roundabout. Only just missed me because I managed to brake in time. When the traffic stopped I got out, tapped on his window, and invited him to discuss the matter further, which he declined to do. Stupid - but you don't tend to think things through when you're younger.
These days, older and wiser, and much more relaxed about such things, I just let it go.
V8RX7 said:
James_33 said:
Bottom line in my opinion is just don't get out, you could be built like a tank and the other guy raging at you could be built like a rake, but who's to say the smaller guy isn't carrying a knife?
It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
Except if we follow your logic we'd never leave the house !It doesn't matter how big you are, if you want to chance been stabbed by someone or any other method of causing injury, whether that's of high or of low likelihood all for a few moments of getting your opinion across to the other driver then go ahead, but be very prepared for the worst, it does happen and this thread proves it.
The last time I got out was to an off duty cop (he produced his warrant card) who seemed to think the law didn't apply to him, wrong lane at island then went berserk when I was faster than him and he couldn't push in.
If you let scum / idiots / bullies get away with it, they become a bigger and bigger problem.
I've been in situations where people have cut me up dangerously and worse, and many times i have had the opportunity to get out but where's it going to get me in the end?
I may come across successful in my approach and go home later that night basking in how i have got my point across, at the same time I may end up in a morgue.
Again just my opinion and i understand everyone has one but i won't actively go looking for trouble anymore, as there's plenty of mentalists on the road now that it's just not worth it.
popeyewhite said:
Zetec-S said:
At the risk of stirring up another hornets nest, but on this thread you've argued quite strongly in favour of getting out the car (depending on the situation). You've made a strong argument for standing up and defending yourself when required, yet in this situation it wasn't required, yet you got out the car and ended up with someone running over your foot.
Surely a perfect example of not being able to predict how the other party is going to act? And another argument to stay in your car?
You can certainly look at it that way. and you're right - it wasn't required. But I wasn't looking to go to war with this driver - I really was simply going to ask him to dip his lights. And you are quite right, I could have stayed in my car and just carried the irritation with me but when the opportunity presented itself (the temporary lights) it was too much for me to live with, ie me sat there like a lemon while this chump enjoys dazzling me. I guess this is the much lighter end of the road rage scenario but my judgement was this wouldn't kick off. I was a bit wrong. I think we are all different in terms of risk/reward, courage/recklessness etc but sometimes events occur that some people just cannot sit by doing nothing, and a lot of times people react out of anger/moral duty/outrage. I didn't go charging after the guy, or actually bear him any malice of thought. Some you win, and some....Surely a perfect example of not being able to predict how the other party is going to act? And another argument to stay in your car?
Look at it from their view, someone overtakes them in a manner they rightly or wrongly consider dangerous and/or inconsiderate. They express their opinion (as you seem to advocate doing) via the medium of high beam. Said nutter (in their eyes) who is younger, probably bigger and definitely angrier gets out and comes towards them in a confrontational mood whilst their path is blocked by his car. You claim you just wanted a polite chat, I suspect that wasn't how the situation came across from their point of view. It's basically what lots of other posters describe happening to them and the general tone of responses suggests you were lucky to just get your foot run over.
nonsequitur said:
Rubins4 said:
Out of interest, where do you think the moral high ground is in this situation? Should we all let the Clio driver go without any recognition, dob him in to the police, be the powerfully built director type and show him the error of his way on the side of the road...?
At the moment, I can’t see what your suggesting the right to do might be.
Take a deep breath. Ignore it. Carry on with your life.At the moment, I can’t see what your suggesting the right to do might be.
I think a lot depends on your upbringing and what sort of life you have had.
If you were bullied or beaten then it can be very hatd to turn the other cheek especially if someone has endangered your life.
It isnt wise to get out and the more i think about it the more luck i realise i have been in the past.
I definitely wanted to hurt the lorry driver who tried to ram me and if his door was open or he had got out then i would probably be inside regretting a moments madness.
As a lot of posters have said it really isnt worth it but the emotions/anger/adrenaline really can mess with logical thinking.
Im going to stay in my vehicle and ignore as much as i possibly can as have way more to lose than most of these angry Zafira drivers!
If you were bullied or beaten then it can be very hatd to turn the other cheek especially if someone has endangered your life.
It isnt wise to get out and the more i think about it the more luck i realise i have been in the past.
I definitely wanted to hurt the lorry driver who tried to ram me and if his door was open or he had got out then i would probably be inside regretting a moments madness.
As a lot of posters have said it really isnt worth it but the emotions/anger/adrenaline really can mess with logical thinking.
Im going to stay in my vehicle and ignore as much as i possibly can as have way more to lose than most of these angry Zafira drivers!
Burwood said:
Where I live there are some very narrow A roads which go on for miles (you can't overtake). Now and again I've been stuck behind some ditherer who won't pull in but wants to crawl down the road at 20mph (40 and 60 limit) constantly varying speed, braking and generally driving like they shouldn't be on the road. I don't have a problem giving them a flash and or a toot. It's far too simplistic to say just chill out and be patient. Sometimes you need to get to where you're going and the lack of self awareness by some drivers is astonishing.
Slow drivers are a fact of modern motoring life. It's annoying, it's frustrating, but still worth a deep breath and a little patience.
And what is wrong with something being simplistic? With all the horror driving highlighted on this thread, the simpler the better.Road Rage - always reminds me of this, when brake testing goes badly wrong....
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is a merge (Rage) in turn off the M23 and notorious for people getting very very upset as if merging is somewhat a personal loss to them.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is a merge (Rage) in turn off the M23 and notorious for people getting very very upset as if merging is somewhat a personal loss to them.
Nope but have had someone get out of theirs at me briefly and then all fun and games ensured as i have posted on here previously.
someone tailgating me so closely i couldn't even see their lights because i was doing under and around the limit for less than a mile in a built up area. said person (unbeknownst to me as i couldn't see what car they were driving behind) then as we approach 3 lanes at traffic lights swerves into my lane and out again causing me to have to brake fairly hard and thus i toot briefly at them. thinking it was a mistake on their part i think nothing more of it given the way they drive, trying to swerve and overtake traffic ahead, however at the next set of traffic lights they are a couple of cars ahead and the young chap opens the door of his crapbox and makes to get out but the lights change and he gets back in. he then slows down so alongside me and then proceeds to wave a screwdriver out of his window alongside me and try to block me off at next roundabout. he then shouts hes going to find where i live and nick my car as well as other threats, leaving my 5 yr old nephew in the back terrified.
all i did was a brief hoot as he swerved into my lane causing me to take avoiding action. when i posted we went through all the conspiracy theories that i had done other things to annoy him, gesture, sit on horn etc, but i didn't.
i find it astounding how someone being tooted is taken as such offense to trigger someone to do that.
but this thread shows otherwise. lots of very angry people here and on the roads who take offense at anything and react disproportionately, as well as a couple of 'hardnuts' mentioning honor or pride or words to that effect to knock those who don't get out of their cars (and instead cower in fear) when someone gets out on them. i imagine those folks are the very same on another day as those they say you should front up.
i will still use my horn appropriately but don't gesture and wouldn't mouth off at someone unless they gave me verbals that were completely unjustified (as they were in fact in the wrong) and id judged it to be a safe scenario to respond, but again would do so calmly, as some folks as people have hair triggers and its not worth the aggro. if i saw someone less able to look after themselves being set upon by some road rage nut then i would probably get out and try to do something.
if i do something wrong on the road and know it and get made aware of it by another car i acknowedge it with a hand or hazard flash...if i get hooted for doing something i dont know then i am just baffled. i dont get angry or riled by it.
im also a cyclist and dont have the same situations as the nut job guy on this thread. he must either go looking for it or ride very poorly to face it, and his anger will get im in trouble.
someone tailgating me so closely i couldn't even see their lights because i was doing under and around the limit for less than a mile in a built up area. said person (unbeknownst to me as i couldn't see what car they were driving behind) then as we approach 3 lanes at traffic lights swerves into my lane and out again causing me to have to brake fairly hard and thus i toot briefly at them. thinking it was a mistake on their part i think nothing more of it given the way they drive, trying to swerve and overtake traffic ahead, however at the next set of traffic lights they are a couple of cars ahead and the young chap opens the door of his crapbox and makes to get out but the lights change and he gets back in. he then slows down so alongside me and then proceeds to wave a screwdriver out of his window alongside me and try to block me off at next roundabout. he then shouts hes going to find where i live and nick my car as well as other threats, leaving my 5 yr old nephew in the back terrified.
all i did was a brief hoot as he swerved into my lane causing me to take avoiding action. when i posted we went through all the conspiracy theories that i had done other things to annoy him, gesture, sit on horn etc, but i didn't.
i find it astounding how someone being tooted is taken as such offense to trigger someone to do that.
but this thread shows otherwise. lots of very angry people here and on the roads who take offense at anything and react disproportionately, as well as a couple of 'hardnuts' mentioning honor or pride or words to that effect to knock those who don't get out of their cars (and instead cower in fear) when someone gets out on them. i imagine those folks are the very same on another day as those they say you should front up.
i will still use my horn appropriately but don't gesture and wouldn't mouth off at someone unless they gave me verbals that were completely unjustified (as they were in fact in the wrong) and id judged it to be a safe scenario to respond, but again would do so calmly, as some folks as people have hair triggers and its not worth the aggro. if i saw someone less able to look after themselves being set upon by some road rage nut then i would probably get out and try to do something.
if i do something wrong on the road and know it and get made aware of it by another car i acknowedge it with a hand or hazard flash...if i get hooted for doing something i dont know then i am just baffled. i dont get angry or riled by it.
im also a cyclist and dont have the same situations as the nut job guy on this thread. he must either go looking for it or ride very poorly to face it, and his anger will get im in trouble.
theplayingmantis said:
someone tailgating me so closely i couldn't even see their lights because i was doing under and around the limit for less than a mile in a built up area. said person (unbeknownst to me as i couldn't see what car they were driving behind) then as we approach 3 lanes at traffic lights swerves into my lane and out again causing me to have to brake fairly hard and thus i toot briefly at them.
I have had that at least twice before (both when I had hot hatchbacks) - aggressive following and then some sort of weird manoevrure to indicate displeasure at my lack of progress. Both times I just slowed the car down and stopped outside someone's house and got on the phone.Funny thing was the second time the car stopped behind me for at least a minute. At the time I had burn injuries on some fingers of my right hand so had a white glove (ala Michael Jackson or Freddy Krueger). I wound down the window and signalled him to 'move on' with my white glove and he reversed sharpish and screamed down the road - not sure what he made of that.
Just this weekend had a weird experience of an utterly impatient driver. Approaching my house is a long-ish road where you have to give way at various points to oncoming traffic as people park on one side. I did this, diligently as always, but noticed on my first stop that a white Fiesta was right up my back. I continued, gave way again, then got to my house. I slowed down (as I don’t tend to enter my drive at 30 mph) and pulled on the drive. I was greeted by a sound of the horn. I turned and saw him shouting his head off. I sounded my horn (on my drive, yes, I know, pointless) and he sounded his again as he sped off.
Silly things like this bug me as I didn’t do anything wrong. His car was a base model so he wasn’t trying to win a race. I spent way too long pondering why he was so mad. All I could conclude was he thought I slowed too much before pulling on my drive but I find it better to check if the wife’s car is already there to save ploughing into it!
I did also ponder what would have happened if he'd objected to me 'horning him back'. I'd have struggled to get angry as I don't know what was wrong with him.
Silly things like this bug me as I didn’t do anything wrong. His car was a base model so he wasn’t trying to win a race. I spent way too long pondering why he was so mad. All I could conclude was he thought I slowed too much before pulling on my drive but I find it better to check if the wife’s car is already there to save ploughing into it!
I did also ponder what would have happened if he'd objected to me 'horning him back'. I'd have struggled to get angry as I don't know what was wrong with him.
I was following a an 5 series with its lights off near home years ago when I lived in Worthing, flashed him a few times - then beeped the horn.
Slammed his brakes on, flew out of the car at me and screamed "what is your problem, do you want filling in?!"... I got out of my, (PH, this matters) Mk1 Mx5 and told him his lights were off.
His response, word for word:
"Oh goodness, how silly! Thank you!" Before scuttling back to his shed...
As above though.... people are nutters, all of them.
Slammed his brakes on, flew out of the car at me and screamed "what is your problem, do you want filling in?!"... I got out of my, (PH, this matters) Mk1 Mx5 and told him his lights were off.
His response, word for word:
"Oh goodness, how silly! Thank you!" Before scuttling back to his shed...
As above though.... people are nutters, all of them.
nonsequitur said:
Burwood said:
Where I live there are some very narrow A roads which go on for miles (you can't overtake). Now and again I've been stuck behind some ditherer who won't pull in but wants to crawl down the road at 20mph (40 and 60 limit) constantly varying speed, braking and generally driving like they shouldn't be on the road. I don't have a problem giving them a flash and or a toot. It's far too simplistic to say just chill out and be patient. Sometimes you need to get to where you're going and the lack of self awareness by some drivers is astonishing.
Slow drivers are a fact of modern motoring life. It's annoying, it's frustrating, but still worth a deep breath and a little patience. And what is wrong with something being simplistic? With all the horror driving highlighted on this thread, the simpler the better.
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