Garages - are they all just a bit crap?
Discussion
One of the reasons why I started doing as much of my own work as possible from my early 20's.
Thankfully, as I consider cars a passion and a serious hobby (along with a few friends) we began renting an industrial unit so we could carry out our own work.
Done all my own mechanical work for the past 15 years which has probably saved me a fortune, look after family and close friends cars too.
I do hear a lot of bad stories in the workplace from garages colleagues have used, usually, they head to me for advice - "my cars making this noise".
If I wasn't clued up with the spanners then I'd more than likely be driving round in a financed Corsa.
Thankfully, as I consider cars a passion and a serious hobby (along with a few friends) we began renting an industrial unit so we could carry out our own work.
Done all my own mechanical work for the past 15 years which has probably saved me a fortune, look after family and close friends cars too.
I do hear a lot of bad stories in the workplace from garages colleagues have used, usually, they head to me for advice - "my cars making this noise".
If I wasn't clued up with the spanners then I'd more than likely be driving round in a financed Corsa.
I always use my best mates garage for stuff usually. Proper old school mechanic who can fix anything, and takes massive pride in his work..
For my Land Rover I used an Indy in Peterborough (by the prison) brilliant bloke, great workmanship, very reasonable prices, honest service and knows the cars inside out and upside down…
For my Land Rover I used an Indy in Peterborough (by the prison) brilliant bloke, great workmanship, very reasonable prices, honest service and knows the cars inside out and upside down…
I have been using the same garage for 25 years + most of the staff have remained the same in that period, which I would imagine is quite unusual in itself.
I took my 1991 Golf GTI in there having broken down on the way back from the Southend Cruise (back in the day) and the RAC had told me it was an alternator failure. I took it into this garage near my work and it was back outside my work within an hour fixed. The alternator was fine, but the cable from the alternator to the battery was broken = no charge.
100% trustworthy, top up my power steering fluid bottle for my 1981 Mercedes 500 SEL for free as and when needed and my oil can for the same car.
We looked to move out of the area some years ago and one of the first things that occurred to me was that I would have to find a new garage.
DS Motors in Stacey Bushes, Milton Keynes is the place and I can't recommend them highly enough. VAG specialists but have worked on my classic Mercedes for my 8.5 years of ownership and are proper old school mechanics; not technicians, who if the machine doesn't tell them what's wrong they haven't a clue.
I took my 1991 Golf GTI in there having broken down on the way back from the Southend Cruise (back in the day) and the RAC had told me it was an alternator failure. I took it into this garage near my work and it was back outside my work within an hour fixed. The alternator was fine, but the cable from the alternator to the battery was broken = no charge.
100% trustworthy, top up my power steering fluid bottle for my 1981 Mercedes 500 SEL for free as and when needed and my oil can for the same car.
We looked to move out of the area some years ago and one of the first things that occurred to me was that I would have to find a new garage.
DS Motors in Stacey Bushes, Milton Keynes is the place and I can't recommend them highly enough. VAG specialists but have worked on my classic Mercedes for my 8.5 years of ownership and are proper old school mechanics; not technicians, who if the machine doesn't tell them what's wrong they haven't a clue.
I’d started using a specialist for my old defender.
Some months after a service they did I decided to do an additional oil change…
Only to find they’d stolen my quick drain adaptor from the sump and replaced it with a crap plug from something else.
I’d left the quick drain tube and fitting on the seat so there was no reason for them to remove the plug anyway…
Of course, this being months later there was nothing I could do except never use them again.
Some months after a service they did I decided to do an additional oil change…
Only to find they’d stolen my quick drain adaptor from the sump and replaced it with a crap plug from something else.
I’d left the quick drain tube and fitting on the seat so there was no reason for them to remove the plug anyway…
Of course, this being months later there was nothing I could do except never use them again.
Wow, blast from the past with this thread.
Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
dhutch said:
Wow, blast from the past with this thread.
Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
Yes. Only last year a garage took 11 days to fix the rear calipers on my car. 11 days! I have also noticed a lot of independent garages going bust since 2017.Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
dhutch said:
Wow, blast from the past with this thread.
Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
Agreed, I am in the same area and Seat in Wallasey couldn't see my car for 2 weeks when the thermostat failed and no car to use while I had no car. No big deal just a inconvenience but I had to chase them every other day and then when it was done I had to call them to find out. Got it back - losing coolant still and had to wait another week or so to get it in. In the mean while I fixed it myself because I can and had a email last week to say they are now shutting down and I have to go to Crewe or Liverpool.Wasn't the case in 2019 but my current rub with garages, all the ones I use for the various cars and issues, is an absolutely huge lead time. Appears to be across the board, but places round her are 6 weeks to get an appointment be that a service, mot, or repair and or fault finding.
They are obviously also running the bookings much tighter because there have been a few times the cars bit been ready till gone 6pm in the evening, or where it's a fault finding type experience or a part of needed that's in next day rather than same day delivery, they can't fit you in again for another 4-6 weeks to fit the part they have decided it needs. If that doesn't cure it, your in for another 4-6 weeks wait.
Never seen anything like it. Various suggestions as the cause, but mainly seems to be out down to a backlog from not fixing cars for two years over lockdown, and a significant minority of garages which when bump over lockdown and haven't come back.
Has anyone else see the same?
We're in the northwest, Merseyside area, but it seem to stretch round Deeside to my MIL in N.wales.
So unless its warranty work I'll be going to the Audi / Seat specialist 4 minutes from my house then. Cheaper and better service.
I used to own and run a small indy, it was mainly me doing everything, plus a bookkeeper and helper, developed a good reputation,never needed to advertise. and was busy, more than i could really handle, so employed others, all great people, but still very small, used to do alot of high end and rare stuff, aswell as run of the mill cars.
I sold it about 25 odd years ago, as it just wasnt really worth the hours, hassle, and went off to do something else, for alot more money and less stress.
the costs were starting to spiral even then, special tools/equipment etc, and most prople dont want to pay for that, that and the huge overheads involved, my rates were more than the rent on the unit! Add in various insurance etc its very hard to make money. This country really doesnt encorage small buisiness.
I would never open another, this dispite many people bemoning me closing, the reward-hassle just isnt worth it.
I sold it about 25 odd years ago, as it just wasnt really worth the hours, hassle, and went off to do something else, for alot more money and less stress.
the costs were starting to spiral even then, special tools/equipment etc, and most prople dont want to pay for that, that and the huge overheads involved, my rates were more than the rent on the unit! Add in various insurance etc its very hard to make money. This country really doesnt encorage small buisiness.
I would never open another, this dispite many people bemoning me closing, the reward-hassle just isnt worth it.
I own and run a small workshop. On a good day, there's 5 of us in the workshop, and it's very busy. Has been for years.
I don't know what to make of this thread. On the one hand, I can see why people want a detailed service, with the car fully considered, all parts replaced with good units, and all the work done by dedicated professionals with time to spare, and an interest in the customers car. But in reality, it doesn't work like that. Cars are designed by idiots, nothing comes apart, plastic clips break, and in fact plastic parts break, leave alone the clips. Work is detailed and fiddly, and time constrained.
This week for example I went to change the lower arm on a Transit - I mean how hard can it be? Bolt was seized in the arm, needed to cut the bolt out, but it was seized in the nut, so the subframe needed to be slacked off, and the chassis rail cut to access the nut. How in god's name can you schedule time for that, and price effectively. You simply can't. And then you play catch up all week, and usually end up working weekends to recover.
My business partner is very pedantic on the level of fit and finish he wants to provide. But no-one wants to pay the hours for the quality of the work that that entails. His head is such that he can't let things go, and the result is that we are typically running at a loss.
And customers don't exactly help the cause. A mini this week. Can you change the back spring. when it get's here, please do the spring, it needs an oil change, and can you sort out the A/C. The spring is the smallest of those issues, and A/C runs into hundreds, maybe thousands of £.
But I do accept that not all garages are paragons of virtue.
I don't know what to make of this thread. On the one hand, I can see why people want a detailed service, with the car fully considered, all parts replaced with good units, and all the work done by dedicated professionals with time to spare, and an interest in the customers car. But in reality, it doesn't work like that. Cars are designed by idiots, nothing comes apart, plastic clips break, and in fact plastic parts break, leave alone the clips. Work is detailed and fiddly, and time constrained.
This week for example I went to change the lower arm on a Transit - I mean how hard can it be? Bolt was seized in the arm, needed to cut the bolt out, but it was seized in the nut, so the subframe needed to be slacked off, and the chassis rail cut to access the nut. How in god's name can you schedule time for that, and price effectively. You simply can't. And then you play catch up all week, and usually end up working weekends to recover.
My business partner is very pedantic on the level of fit and finish he wants to provide. But no-one wants to pay the hours for the quality of the work that that entails. His head is such that he can't let things go, and the result is that we are typically running at a loss.
And customers don't exactly help the cause. A mini this week. Can you change the back spring. when it get's here, please do the spring, it needs an oil change, and can you sort out the A/C. The spring is the smallest of those issues, and A/C runs into hundreds, maybe thousands of £.
But I do accept that not all garages are paragons of virtue.
fridaypassion said:
This year I've discovered that nobody knows how to build an engine.
Pretty much that was all that you needed to say. Even many engine building companies aren't all that cop - although many are also great.But a full nut and bolt rebuild, with I assume numerous new parts, into the inner workings of a modern ending with tiny clearances - no chance!
The time & effort to properly rebuild and engine is, IMVHO, quite large and a garage is really only equiped to install the engine, not rebuild it.
Arnold Cunningham said:
Pretty much that was all that you needed to say. Even many engine building companies aren't all that cop - although many are also great.
But a full nut and bolt rebuild, with I assume numerous new parts, into the inner workings of a modern ending with tiny clearances - no chance!
The time & effort to properly rebuild and engine is, IMVHO, quite large and a garage is really only equiped to install the engine, not rebuild it.
Why would a garage want to rebuild an engine? I don't even want to do a head gasket. Expensive, risky, time consuming, and you don't make any money at the end of it. But a full nut and bolt rebuild, with I assume numerous new parts, into the inner workings of a modern ending with tiny clearances - no chance!
The time & effort to properly rebuild and engine is, IMVHO, quite large and a garage is really only equiped to install the engine, not rebuild it.
bearman68 said:
My business partner is very pedantic on the level of fit and finish he wants to provide. But no-one wants to pay the hours for the quality of the work that that entails. His head is such that he can't let things go, and the result is that we are typically running at a loss.
On the other hand, I have been one of those customers on a few occasions now where I have taken a car to 'specialists' with an open cheque book. Told them my requirements, explained that they could keep the car as long as needed and charge as necessary. I've nearly almost always received a call saying the car is ready much sooner than expected, with only half of my requirements met, being fobbed off with a load of BS. This invariably forcing me to take the DIY approach and finding that they are clearly either just crap at their job or couldn't be bothered.
Real shame as I am one that is genuinely happy to pay for a quality job for my pride and joy motors.
I have found one that seems to be pretty good, although the are 130 miles away so only go for work beyond my skill and equipment limitations.
In terms of my daily drive, local independents have been pretty rubbish too, not being able to diagnose a starting issue with a 20 year old diesel. Changing the rear brakes, but not adjusting the handbrake and then just leaving my car in gear on the slop hoping I wouldn't notice! Changing a cam belt for it to break only a few weeks later and blaming it on some random part failure rather than a failing on their part.
It's a total minefield.
bearman68 said:
But in reality, it doesn't work like that. Cars are designed by idiots, nothing comes apart, plastic clips break, and in fact plastic parts break, leave alone the clips. Work is detailed and fiddly, and time constrained.
This week for example I went to change the lower arm on a Transit - I mean how hard can it be...
I observed a (mechanic) colleague of mine doing another workmate a favour by replacing a front wheel bearing unit on his 15-ish year old Kia. The job started fine right up until the point that the bolt in bearing unit wouldn't come out of the hub. A large amount of force did eventually persuade it to part company but there was a question mark over whether the ABS sensor had taken a hit in the process. This week for example I went to change the lower arm on a Transit - I mean how hard can it be...
Upon reassembly it turned it that indeed the ABS was no longer working on that sensor. This led to trying to remove and drill out a 15 year old sensor from the hub unit whilst it was all mounted on the car.
Unfortunately during this process the ABS ring got caught by the tip of the drill bit and lo and behold, you can't just replace the ABS ring, you can only replace the entire CV joint.
Cue the purchase of a new outer CV joint. Would the original outer CV then come off the driveshaft even with the special tool, would it heck. In order to remove the CV joint he ended up carefully cutting it up into pieces to save the rest of the driveshaft. With this achieved the car did get reassembled and was all good to go again.
The point is, the simplest job can very quickly get away from an experienced mechanic through no real fault of their own. They have got to charge for the parts used and time taken or there is no point in running a workshop. The customer doesn't see this though and often fails to understand how one job or component can lead to an escalation of parts and labour.
Personally I wouldn't try and run an independent workshop in this day and age, too much hassle for too little reward.
Lincsls1 said:
In terms of my daily drive, local independents have been pretty rubbish too, not being able to diagnose a starting issue with a 20 year old diesel. Changing the rear brakes, but not adjusting the handbrake and then just leaving my car in gear on the slop hoping I wouldn't notice! Changing a cam belt for it to break only a few weeks later and blaming it on some random part failure rather than a failing on their part.
It's a total minefield.
There are exceptions to all rules. In 20 years, I've had one cam belt failure from a belt that I've changed - bearings collapsed in the (new) idler pulley. And I fitted one wrong one day, and damaged the engine (early days when I was learning).It's a total minefield.
These days I would be mortified if I had a cam belt failure. However, sooner or later, if you do enough of them, one day it WILL happen.
But I try and do things the right way. If I have to bodge something, it doesn't feel right. But I still make plenty of mistakes, take longer than the book says I should, occasionally break things that I shouldn't break. If you work with your hands, in a time pressured environment, these things will happen. To think differently is to be mistaken.
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