Best Hot Hatch of the 21st Century – nominations

[Bagzie88]

daytonavrs said:

Well seeing as folk are happily quoting non hot hatches like Suzuki Swift sport, aren't they a warm hatch ? here's my turn:

1/ Octavia mk3 vRS 245/petrol, because affordable/ pratical someone mentioned earlier?
2/ Fabia mk1 vRS - because even more practical lol.
3/ Superb 280 sportline hatchback lol.
(tuned one on here was up with the supercars, prob Skodas closest car to the Golf R whilst remaining imminently practical and refined....perhaps a little too much so for my liking though).

Not the best, so won't win this award, In reality its going to be an RS280, Golf R or i30N obviously

I own 3 Cars at the moment , BMW M140i , Civic Type R ep3 and a swift sport 1.6.

I have owned in the past a 205 GTi and a Golf GTI mk1.

Out of the three I own two comes close to the other 2 in terms of fun factor and it's not the 330hp German.

I've driven a Golf R and it's boring as sin to hustle , 1.6 ton and 4wd... What a boring attempt at top trumps by VW.

The problem you have is you think power defines a cars classification as a hot hatch when it's about a multitude of different things , your Golf R is certainly quicker than a swift sport on a track but no one who drives a swift sport cares as they go for the 7200rpm gear change whilst throwing there 1 ton car around a nice twisty road.

Edited by Bagzie88 on Saturday 30th November 16:40

[DoubleD]

Bagzie88 said:

Just pointless willy waving by you.

Edited by Bagzie88 on Saturday 30th November 16:35

This phrase is best left for idiots to use.

[Bagzie88]

DoubleD said:

Bagzie88 said:

Just pointless willy waving by you.

Edited by Bagzie88 on Saturday 30th November 16:35

This phrase is best left for idiots to use.

Edited it out because it was a bit too far but you know exactly what he was trying to do just as much as me.

[Wolf13]

Renaultsport Twingo 133.

This car really surprised me. I rate it higher than the e46 M3, Lotus Elise S and Abarth 595c I came from for real world, usable fun especially if you live in a city environment. You can fling it about in a way I never felt confident with to do with the others.The car has no real kudos other than with those in the know but, boy is it fun.

[anonymous-user]

DoubleD said:

This phrase is best left for idiots to use.

Go on then

[Bagzie88]

Wolf13 said:

Renaultsport Twingo 133.

This car really surprised me. I rate it higher than the e46 M3, Lotus Elise S and Abarth 595c I came from for real world, usable fun especially if you live in a city environment. You can fling it about in a way I never felt confident with to do with the others.The car has no real kudos other than with those in the know but, boy is it fun.

I suspect that's because of the low weight , it's going to be a nippy little thing.

[robbo_64]

Golf R 7.5
Golf GTi 7.5
Renault Megan Cup

[DoubleD]

Bagzie88 said:

Wolf13 said:

Renaultsport Twingo 133.

This car really surprised me. I rate it higher than the e46 M3, Lotus Elise S and Abarth 595c I came from for real world, usable fun especially if you live in a city environment. You can fling it about in a way I never felt confident with to do with the others.The car has no real kudos other than with those in the know but, boy is it fun.

I suspect that's because of the low weight , it's going to be a nippy little thing.

The twingos are fun little things to chuck about

[Niffty951]

Marchutch said:

My favourite is the GP1. Mine has been turbo converted with 440hp on tap, which makes it quite a potent machine - not only in a straight line as it still retains its brilliant handling characteristics.

I think I'm in love. Not sure it's going to be faster than a 300hp car though? Can you get your foot all the way down under 70mph?

[Niffty951]

kentheribs said:

Clio 182 trophy, small, light, just the right power to weight ratio to maximise the fun factor

The Clio has the mk1 Elise problem for me. Great chassis but not enough power to exploit it. To be fair I've only been in the 197 and 200 but I assume what applies to those applies to this. Also and more importantly for a shot on the podium. It's just not a place I want to spend time when I'm not driving like a demon.

Surely an all time great is defined my its depth of ability, the interior is about as comforting as a van. It's just not a place I want to come back to or spend a lot of time in. When driving on track, hunting a lap time I don't care about those things but the rest of the time I do. A great hatch should be more.

Edited by Niffty951 on Saturday 30th November 17:55

[coded2112]

Mini GP1 has to be, had mine since new and never wanted to change it!

100k miles of pure driving fun!

[Zarco]

Niffty951 said:

kentheribs said:

Clio 182 trophy, small, light, just the right power to weight ratio to maximise the fun factor

The Clio has the mk1 Elise problem for me. Great chassis but not enough power to exploit it. To be fair I've only been in the 197 and 200 but a assume what applies to those applies to this. Also it's just not a place I want to spend time when I'm not driving like a demon.

Surely an all time great is defined my its depth of ability but the interior is about as comforting as a van.

The 172/182 don't suffer from a lack of power in my experience. Definite big engine in little car feel with them. Think you may be a bit off with that assumption.

[Gad-Westy]

Zarco said:

Niffty951 said:

kentheribs said:

Clio 182 trophy, small, light, just the right power to weight ratio to maximise the fun factor

The Clio has the mk1 Elise problem for me. Great chassis but not enough power to exploit it. To be fair I've only been in the 197 and 200 but a assume what applies to those applies to this. Also it's just not a place I want to spend time when I'm not driving like a demon.

Surely an all time great is defined my its depth of ability but the interior is about as comforting as a van.

The 172/182 don't suffer from a lack of power in my experience. Definite big engine in little car feel with them. Think you may be a bit off with that assumption.

Was thinking the same. If anything, they maybe felt ever so slightly over-engined. I've never felt that they need more power. To be honest, I'd say the same with the Elise too.

I guess maybe on track, things are different but I've always seen hot hatches as being at home on fiddly little roads rather than big wide expanses of tarmac.

[Malcolm-qa3yq]

Fiesta ST200 hands down, 215ps on overboost, shorter gearing than the standard one makes for much faster in gear acceleration, and the suspension changes made it a more comfortable place to rack up the miles.
50+mpg capable on long runs, every option you could get on a fiesta as standard and awesome fun on road and track. There's faster hot hatches but this feels like one of the least compromised for any given scenario to me. And it's still got more power than the mk8 that replaced it!

The residual values speak volumes as well, 3yr old cars are still selling for £15k from ~£23k new price, so about 60%!

[anthonysjb]

Having owned a Clio 182 FF, Mk7 Fiesta ST and currently a Mk5 GTI, my ideal hot hatch recipe is the ST with a few modifications.

The car is economical, comfortable and extremely easy to live with. From stock the chassis is very playful, no understeer and capable enough for any British road.

However, it is improved with some modifications. Running an aftermarket induction kit, exhaust, intercooler to remove the heat soak they experience in the summer and a remap transforms the car. With 240bhp and a load of torque it is so easy to adjust the line of the car on the throttle, persuade lift off oversteer etc. With the exhaust on there and the induction kit it adds some aural drama too that is needed.

Having experienced one with a big turbo on (X47R 330bhp) with an LSD, that is the ideal hot hatch in my opinion. Blisteringly fast, comfortable enough, planted on the motorway and still great to go to Tesco in.

The 182 is too compromised as a daily. It feels like a tin can, isn't renowned to be reliable, and is too noisy. The Mk5 GTI is great round. It does feel a bit big and heavy, but very comfortable and fast with a few mods. Crap on fuel though.

[VR6 Matt]

Mk5 GTI Edition 30

[172]

Best value: Clio 182 Trophy
Best all rounder: Mk5 GTI
Best drive: R26.r

[rslewis73]

An unmodified Fiesta ST180. Fantastic fun at sensible speeds. Reminds me of my old (unmodified) Saxo VTS in some ways. Both make you work to get the best out of them and both quite plasticky but importantly very light with superb feedback. Much much better seats in the ST though!

[NGK210]

1. SEAT Leon Cupra R Mk1
2. Ford Fiesta ST M225 Mk8
3. VW Golf R Mk7.5

[Niffty951]

Gad-Westy said:

Zarco said:

Niffty951 said:

kentheribs said:

Clio 182 trophy, small, light, just the right power to weight ratio to maximise the fun factor

The Clio has the mk1 Elise problem for me. Great chassis but not enough power to exploit it. To be fair I've only been in the 197 and 200 but a assume what applies to those applies to this. Also it's just not a place I want to spend time when I'm not driving like a demon.

Surely an all time great is defined my its depth of ability but the interior is about as comforting as a van.

The 172/182 don't suffer from a lack of power in my experience. Definite big engine in little car feel with them. Think you may be a bit off with that assumption.

Was thinking the same. If anything, they maybe felt ever so slightly over-engined. I've never felt that they need more power. To be honest, I'd say the same with the Elise too.

I guess power is subjective. At one time my Mk2 Golf 8v was fast enough. Once you've experienced more power it's hard to go back. Delivery can do a lot but the Clio200 is quite flat, linear.

As for the Elise, I drove a 112R at Silverstone for an hour. It probably wasn't the right place, it's a power hungry track but it annoyed me how you could stand on the throttle and it just gently built speed from the apex. It felt like a 1990s computer game. Repeat that in something like a Cerbera 4.2 and you have to gently ballance the steering and the throttle as you straighten the wheel. Both controls are used as one to manoeuvre the car. It feels more 3 dimensional.

You also absolutely know the only thing limiting the cars progress out of the bend is your ability. I like that. It has flow

Edited by Niffty951 on Saturday 30th November 18:40