Left turns accross Cycle Lanes

Left turns accross Cycle Lanes

Author
Discussion

Newdriver2019

Original Poster:

2 posts

Monday 2nd December
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Hi

A real quick question as I am unsure about this but a couple of years back there was talk of giving cyclists priority when in a cycle lane so as motor vehicles should give way when turning left and so crossing the cycle lane. Is this now law or not?

2gins

1,712 posts

110 months

Monday 2nd December
quotequote all
Newdriver2019 said:
Hi

A real quick question as I am unsure about this but a couple of years back there was talk of giving cyclists priority when in a cycle lane so as motor vehicles should give way when turning left and so crossing the cycle lane. Is this now law or not?
Not as far as I'm aware but it should be, imo.

deckster

4,647 posts

203 months

Monday 2nd December
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Legally, it will depend on the road markings.

Morally, it's beyond fking obvious that if there's a bike there then you wait until they're clear.

rockin

7,053 posts

193 months

Monday 2nd December
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deckster said:
Morally, it's beyond fking obvious that if there's a bike there then you wait until they're clear.
Or perhaps if the cyclist sees a left indicator he/she might have the sense to identify a vehicle turning left. After all, buses in bus lanes seem able to manage exactly the same thing without getting all uppity about it.

PF62

1,256 posts

121 months

Monday 2nd December
quotequote all
Newdriver2019 said:
Hi

A real quick question as I am unsure about this but a couple of years back there was talk of giving cyclists priority when in a cycle lane so as motor vehicles should give way when turning left and so crossing the cycle lane. Is this now law or not?
Highway Code rule 183 -

Highway Code said:
When turning

- keep as close to the left as is safe and practicable
- give way to any vehicles using a bus lane, cycle lane or tramway from either direction.
So don't give way to the cyclist and get done for driving without due care (and obviously if you cause an accident, you are to blame).

vonhosen

36,249 posts

165 months

Monday 2nd December
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You shouldn't alter your course (pull across the path of others) without checking it is safe to do so, whether they be bikes, cars, buses, pedestrians etc etc.

kharma45

40 posts

21 months

Monday 2nd December
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Would you cut across if there was a car on the lane on the inside? What a stupid question.

Demelitia

86 posts

4 months

Monday 2nd December
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kharma45 said:
Would you cut across if there was a car on the lane on the inside? What a stupid question.
They’re not asking if doing it is ok or not, they’re asking if it is now law. I don’t see how it’s a stupid question.

chow pan toon

11,656 posts

185 months

Monday 2nd December
quotequote all
rockin said:
Or perhaps if the cyclist sees a left indicator he/she might have the sense to identify a vehicle turning left. After all, buses in bus lanes seem able to manage exactly the same thing without getting all uppity about it.
Somebody exhibiting the fact they can't drive on a motor enthusiasts website?! Never!

snoopy25

995 posts

68 months

Monday 2nd December
quotequote all
rockin said:
After all, buses in bus lanes seem able to manage exactly the same thing without getting all uppity about it.
Not in London they dont, its every man for themselves hehe

samoht

1,047 posts

94 months

Monday 2nd December
quotequote all

Beyond the (obvious) answer to the question already given, there's something else to consider. We can see confusion and different opinions here.

In reality this is a common cause of car-cyclist collisions.

As a result, many cyclists will be apprehensive in this situation, and will either slow down/stop, or pull out to go around the car on the right. You therefore get the classic stand-off of both sides saying 'after you', or the driver doesn't see that the cyclist has gone round, which ends up slowing down everyone else down far more than necessary.

The cyclist cannot safely make use of their legal right of way to continue in their lane, because of the relatively high probability of a collision, and their relative vulnerability. The driver, 9 times out of 10, correctly and courteously waits for the cyclist. So the end result is wasting everyone's time.

Bottom line: in order for the roads to flow efficiently, everyone needs to be able to trust that everyone else will reliably follow the rules, and this is a case where that's unfortunately not so.

ArnageWRC

996 posts

107 months

Tuesday
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samoht said:
Bottom line: in order for the roads to flow efficiently, everyone needs to be able to trust that everyone else will reliably follow the rules, and this is a case where that's unfortunately not so.
I think this the most salient point. As a cyclist & motorist, I don't have much trust in others....

Furthermore, whenever I see The Highway Code quoted on various websites/ forums, I often wonder how many people actually look/read it regularly after passing their test. I suspect very few.

BMWBen

4,687 posts

149 months

Tuesday
quotequote all
samoht said:
Beyond the (obvious) answer to the question already given, there's something else to consider. We can see confusion and different opinions here.

In reality this is a common cause of car-cyclist collisions.

As a result, many cyclists will be apprehensive in this situation, and will either slow down/stop, or pull out to go around the car on the right. You therefore get the classic stand-off of both sides saying 'after you', or the driver doesn't see that the cyclist has gone round, which ends up slowing down everyone else down far more than necessary.

The cyclist cannot safely make use of their legal right of way to continue in their lane, because of the relatively high probability of a collision, and their relative vulnerability. The driver, 9 times out of 10, correctly and courteously waits for the cyclist. So the end result is wasting everyone's time.

Bottom line: in order for the roads to flow efficiently, everyone needs to be able to trust that everyone else will reliably follow the rules, and this is a case where that's unfortunately not so.
beer Exactly right. Although I would disagree with your 9 times out of ten. It's more like 50/50 in my experience, with at least half of those who don't manage it correctly being the kind of idiot that tries to speed past the cyclist just before they need to make the left turn and then cause them to brake and go round the outside of them to avoid being killed smile


DaveH23

2,570 posts

118 months

Tuesday
quotequote all
deckster said:
Legally, it will depend on the road markings.

Morally, it's beyond fking obvious that if there's a bike there then you wait until they're clear.
This.

See the video in the following article. Previously traffic had right if way but they changed it earlier this year to give cyclists right of way.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chroniclelive.co....

S100HP

10,395 posts

115 months

Tuesday
quotequote all
DaveH23 said:
deckster said:
Legally, it will depend on the road markings.

Morally, it's beyond fking obvious that if there's a bike there then you wait until they're clear.
This.

See the video in the following article. Previously traffic had right if way but they changed it earlier this year to give cyclists right of way.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chroniclelive.co....
Southampton has quite a few bits of infrastructure like this now. It's shocking how many people seem to struggle with it.

jamei303

2,046 posts

104 months

Tuesday
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You don't see many cars T-boned by buses when turning left, so I'm sure the concept is quite easy to understand where personal safety is at risk.

GOATever

1,691 posts

15 months

Tuesday
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S100HP said:
Southampton has quite a few bits of infrastructure like this now. It's shocking how many people seem to struggle with it.
Out towards Millbrook train station, and first and second avenues, near dock gate 20 are good examples. I expect drivers to not get it now, I’m pleasantly surprised when a motorist does stop at the new give way to cyclists bit, and doesn’t just lean on their horn and drive straight at me.

2gins

1,712 posts

110 months

Tuesday
quotequote all
There's 2 situations here which depend on the road markings:

1) Cycle lanes painted onto the main carriageway with white dividing line and maybe red/green/blue anti-skid surface
Cycle lane is normal part of road and cycle has priority just as any other vehicle would do in any other lane be it a running lane, bus lane or anything else

2) Cycle lane is segregated from the carriageway by a kerbed area or other physical division
Normally the cycle lane will be marked with a give way, in which the cycle must give way to entering/emerging traffic.

(2) is very common because they are cheap and stupid councils and TfL don't seem to understand the reality of riding a bike. In reality the cyclist can't see approaching traffic indicating from behind or often see very deep into the junction either, so the sensible thing is to slow right down and check properly; but this entails losing momentum and if the road layout is like it is round my way where there are 25-30 such side turnings in 2 miles (A316 Chalker's Corner to St Margarets), that's a lot of stop start and expended time and energy. The cars have a much better opportunity to see cycles than vice versa and the priority should be different.

S100HP

10,395 posts

115 months

Tuesday
quotequote all
GOATever said:
S100HP said:
Southampton has quite a few bits of infrastructure like this now. It's shocking how many people seem to struggle with it.
Out towards Millbrook train station, and first and second avenues, near dock gate 20 are good examples. I expect drivers to not get it now, I’m pleasantly surprised when a motorist does stop at the new give way to cyclists bit, and doesn’t just lean on their horn and drive straight at me.
Same. That is my commute, from Hythe into central Southampton.

Newdriver2019

Original Poster:

2 posts

Tuesday
quotequote all
kharma45 said:
Would you cut across if there was a car on the lane on the inside? What a stupid question.
Thanks for taking the time out to replt, but to say "What a stupid question." is nonsense. If it was a stupid question I would have a stream of replies saying either yes the law has changed or no the law didnt change. There seems to be a mixed selection of replies.

So what was your answer, motor vehicles have priority over cycles (so cyclists should slow and wait if a motorist is turning turn across a cycle lane or as you seem to suggest, motor vehicles should wait and as you say, not cut across?