RE: Land Rover Defender | Pic of the Week
Discussion
lyonspride said:
Because it would take a serious mechanically minded enthusiast to keep a 20, 30, 40, 50 year old vehicle going, this new Defender simply won't be friendly to that, in fact I doubt there's much you could do it at home or at the side of the road in the middle of nowhere. The simplicity of the original is the reason why you still see them today, so unless someone figures out how to rip out all trendy stuff that's bound to go wrong, the new one will never have the same following.
It's very amusing reading all these posts, but ya'll know i'm talking sense.
There are plenty of people who own old Defenders who don't do the work on them (I'm one of them), so that part is irrelevant in certain circumstances. Owning a car can cross many levels, fixing it is only one of those. You never know, as technology develops, you may be able to diagnose problems at home and 3D parts at home! It's very amusing reading all these posts, but ya'll know i'm talking sense.
A.J.M said:
Lyonspride is right.
No self respecting enthusiast buys anything post 98.
Cause, air bags are awful, as is air con, heated seats, headed windscreen, working door seals, a heater that doesn’t feel like an afterthought and the ability to hold a conversation or listen to a radio above 40.
But then, defenders have plastic dashboards, door cards and windows that can be moved up/down and can have a turbo on them. A turbo!
Heathens the lot of them!
Us series 1 80” owners are the only enthusiasts.
The rest of you are just unwashed riff raff that are trying to pretend you have something.
This really did make me laugh, and you're right of course No self respecting enthusiast buys anything post 98.
Cause, air bags are awful, as is air con, heated seats, headed windscreen, working door seals, a heater that doesn’t feel like an afterthought and the ability to hold a conversation or listen to a radio above 40.
But then, defenders have plastic dashboards, door cards and windows that can be moved up/down and can have a turbo on them. A turbo!
Heathens the lot of them!
Us series 1 80” owners are the only enthusiasts.
The rest of you are just unwashed riff raff that are trying to pretend you have something.
I did like your point about heated seats etc, because I've often seen old Defender owners moaning about the new Defender, without considering the fact they've upgraded their own Defender to be more luxurious than when it left the factory. Be it better seats, audio, heating etc.
lukeharding said:
A.J.M said:
Lyonspride is right.
No self respecting enthusiast buys anything post 98.
Cause, air bags are awful, as is air con, heated seats, headed windscreen, working door seals, a heater that doesn’t feel like an afterthought and the ability to hold a conversation or listen to a radio above 40.
But then, defenders have plastic dashboards, door cards and windows that can be moved up/down and can have a turbo on them. A turbo!
Heathens the lot of them!
Us series 1 80” owners are the only enthusiasts.
The rest of you are just unwashed riff raff that are trying to pretend you have something.
This really did make me laugh, and you're right of course No self respecting enthusiast buys anything post 98.
Cause, air bags are awful, as is air con, heated seats, headed windscreen, working door seals, a heater that doesn’t feel like an afterthought and the ability to hold a conversation or listen to a radio above 40.
But then, defenders have plastic dashboards, door cards and windows that can be moved up/down and can have a turbo on them. A turbo!
Heathens the lot of them!
Us series 1 80” owners are the only enthusiasts.
The rest of you are just unwashed riff raff that are trying to pretend you have something.
I did like your point about heated seats etc, because I've often seen old Defender owners moaning about the new Defender, without considering the fact they've upgraded their own Defender to be more luxurious than when it left the factory. Be it better seats, audio, heating etc.
Everything gets modded. It’s merely a function of when the car becomes cheap enough down the line for that particular enthusiast.
Or is this actually a religious argument and it’s Enthusiast with a capital E and there is only one true Enthusiast and all false enthusiasts must be smited?
High viz Jedi’s with ‘go bags’ and the ability to drive at 5mph in unnecessary discomfort.
Or is this actually a religious argument and it’s Enthusiast with a capital E and there is only one true Enthusiast and all false enthusiasts must be smited?
High viz Jedi’s with ‘go bags’ and the ability to drive at 5mph in unnecessary discomfort.
I don’t care Lyonspride I want one. I would also quite like an older agricultural Defender. When I can justify the outlay there will be one on my driveway. It doesn’t matter if I can’t fix it myself there will be someone to pay to repair it. If it’s not your cup of Chai then don’t worry about it.
lyonspride said:
Yes, after-market stereo would be a doddle of course.......
So if you're quick you can pop round as there's still plenty of straw there for you clutch at.
lyonspride said:
Yes, after-market stereo would be a doddle of course.......
Anyway, this isn’t new, even the Disco 3 was pretty limited by what you could do to upgrade the stereo and it was only the very bottom of the range model where you could change the head unit.
On topic....cool photo!
You can do a lot with the modern stuff.
However, I’m pretty sure the 13 speakers, Amp and subwoofer fitted as standard is more than enough sound system over a £50 Halfords job.
I could change brakes from tdv6 to v8s, or the 4 or 6 pot brembos. So I did. Nice 4 pots up front and v8s at the back.
Then the air suspension can be tweaked.
I’ve an easy lift control module.
I have 2 lower and 3 higher settings above the ones LR gave it from the factory. Controlled by either a dial on the dash.
Or externally with an app on my phone.
Then you have all the snorkels, various roof racks, rear ladders, light guards, auxiliary fuel tanks, 2nd battery kits, boot drawer systems, extra wheel carriers, rock and tree sliders, under body protection armour, front and rear bumpers and various wheel and tyre packages.
Plus you can have performance upgrades if wanted. I have a Ford Sierra RS500 intercooler fitted to my Disco 3 along with remap and exhaust work.
The new ones can be modified to quite a high standard. Just because you are too ignorant to realise that doesn’t make it not true.
However, I’m pretty sure the 13 speakers, Amp and subwoofer fitted as standard is more than enough sound system over a £50 Halfords job.
I could change brakes from tdv6 to v8s, or the 4 or 6 pot brembos. So I did. Nice 4 pots up front and v8s at the back.
Then the air suspension can be tweaked.
I’ve an easy lift control module.
I have 2 lower and 3 higher settings above the ones LR gave it from the factory. Controlled by either a dial on the dash.
Or externally with an app on my phone.
Then you have all the snorkels, various roof racks, rear ladders, light guards, auxiliary fuel tanks, 2nd battery kits, boot drawer systems, extra wheel carriers, rock and tree sliders, under body protection armour, front and rear bumpers and various wheel and tyre packages.
Plus you can have performance upgrades if wanted. I have a Ford Sierra RS500 intercooler fitted to my Disco 3 along with remap and exhaust work.
The new ones can be modified to quite a high standard. Just because you are too ignorant to realise that doesn’t make it not true.
A.J.M said:
You can do a lot with the modern stuff.
However, I’m pretty sure the 13 speakers, Amp and subwoofer fitted as standard is more than enough sound system over a £50 Halfords job.
I could change brakes from tdv6 to v8s, or the 4 or 6 pot brembos. So I did. Nice 4 pots up front and v8s at the back.
Then the air suspension can be tweaked.
I’ve an easy lift control module.
I have 2 lower and 3 higher settings above the ones LR gave it from the factory. Controlled by either a dial on the dash.
Or externally with an app on my phone.
Then you have all the snorkels, various roof racks, rear ladders, light guards, auxiliary fuel tanks, 2nd battery kits, boot drawer systems, extra wheel carriers, rock and tree sliders, under body protection armour, front and rear bumpers and various wheel and tyre packages.
Plus you can have performance upgrades if wanted. I have a Ford Sierra RS500 intercooler fitted to my Disco 3 along with remap and exhaust work.
The new ones can be modified to quite a high standard. Just because you are too ignorant to realise that doesn’t make it not true.
That’s really the aspect that completely disproves the arguement. Modern Discos can be modded and when they fall enough in price that is exactly what that particular enthusiast is doing. However, I’m pretty sure the 13 speakers, Amp and subwoofer fitted as standard is more than enough sound system over a £50 Halfords job.
I could change brakes from tdv6 to v8s, or the 4 or 6 pot brembos. So I did. Nice 4 pots up front and v8s at the back.
Then the air suspension can be tweaked.
I’ve an easy lift control module.
I have 2 lower and 3 higher settings above the ones LR gave it from the factory. Controlled by either a dial on the dash.
Or externally with an app on my phone.
Then you have all the snorkels, various roof racks, rear ladders, light guards, auxiliary fuel tanks, 2nd battery kits, boot drawer systems, extra wheel carriers, rock and tree sliders, under body protection armour, front and rear bumpers and various wheel and tyre packages.
Plus you can have performance upgrades if wanted. I have a Ford Sierra RS500 intercooler fitted to my Disco 3 along with remap and exhaust work.
The new ones can be modified to quite a high standard. Just because you are too ignorant to realise that doesn’t make it not true.
A lot of the resentment is that while the new Defender will be vastly more reliable than the old one, when things do break they will tend to be things that a lot of people cannot understand how to fix themselves or have the equipment to do so. Welcome to the 21st century and the shock discovery that societies move forward.
My local LR chap is a very smart chap. While his general outlook is very akin to that of Fred Dibner he also fully understands electricity and as such he looks after the local enthusiasts’ old Land Rover product’s and their new JLR ones. He can restore a Series 1 or a Suffix A to the degree that JLR will use him for reference for their own restorations yet at the same time the owners of these classics will drop in their L322, old Sports etc for fixing and the L405s are now beginning to appear as their prices drop below the level that justifies main dealer servicing costs.
The simple truth is that the old Defender is simply one of the most iconic motor vehicles of all time. It’s an all time great and just a magical bit of kit and tremendous fun. That’s why we invest so much in keeping them going. The new Defender is simply a better motor vehicle that is designed for the 21st century. Despite the reputation of JLR it will be far more reliable than any previous Defender. The reason why more will be scrapped than the old one is firstly that they will be selling far more of them than they ever soldnof the old one and secondly that we are a consumer, throw away society so goods need to be made to fit what the consumer wants.
Sure, it’ll be a few years before the specialist enthusiasts ram raid Halfords with them and glue loads of paraphernalia onto them and they aren’t going to be as good at ploughing a field or as easy to modify to randomly climb over rocks that you could chose to drive around. But that is extremely niche stuff like sofa fettishes. What this new Defender will do that the old Defender can’t do and never could is be superior for 99.99% of the miles it will ever travel in the 21st century. Safer, faster, more reliable, comfortable, quiet, more practical.
Of course the true enthusiast doesn’t ever think that there is only the one type of enthusiast and that all others are wrong. The true enthusiast is the person who can equally appreciate both old and new for their individual merits and even own both.
I would argue that the type of person who has such an extremely narrow mind as to believe that there is only one type of enthusiast is not in really an enthusiast at all but a fanatic.
I wanted an old Defender but didn't want the discomort so bought a Discovery instead. The great thing is that unlike the old Defender, teh Disco really is truly classless.
What a turnaround eh?
I'm looking forward to seeing the new Bond flick. I can't afford a New Defender so I'll probably buy an old Aston instead.
What a turnaround eh?
I'm looking forward to seeing the new Bond flick. I can't afford a New Defender so I'll probably buy an old Aston instead.
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