RE: BMW M4 CS | Spotted
Discussion
llcoolmac said:
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
llcoolmac said:
nickfrog said:
rbozza said:
No one pays cash for these cars, always done on finance and based on what seems affordable out of disposable income. Mega depreciation is irrelevant to the first owner as it’s already been accepted by the monthly contribution.
No one at all? 
t with money most people are. The vast majority of people who finance cars like this are actually crippling themselves financially without even realising it. £700 a month out of perhaps £3000 monthly income plus deposit and at the end you have nothing...is one of the most incredible stupid decisions one can make. But alas, I won't go on about it. I just don't understand the mentality. If that is your income then you should be buying your dream car that you will keep for 7-10 years. These cars are all amazing enough that you should want to do that. (I have no idea if those figures are anywhere near correct for one of these but I know people pay that % of their income on cars they won't own)But the average person isn't buying for their own pleasure of course...just to impress the neighbours.
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:09
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:10
How someone spends their money is up to them. Yes, it's £700/month or whatever. But some people spend £150 on stuff like Sky movies and Sky Sports, which may be a waste of money to someone else and they haven't got anything left at the end of their Sky Sports contract....
People are so judgemental when it comes to PCP/PCH on here it's utterly crazy. Pray tell, what car do you drive?
I haven't bought my house outright, I have it on a mortgage. Is that also a stupid thing to do? Should I live with my parents until I can save up enough to buy a house outright?
It’s a shame it has to to look so angry, the E46 CSL looks as good now as it did then, as does the 1M, the e93 M3 still looks fanstastic but this is just a over styled mess.
I know all cars are like it now, but when the C63 which I always thought was the chintziest of all look better kimmo, plus you can have a V8.
I know all cars are like it now, but when the C63 which I always thought was the chintziest of all look better kimmo, plus you can have a V8.
I 100% agree with this, although in most cases the money going into a mortgage is investing instead of losing money (bar market fluctuations) and therefore deemed more sensible. Ultimately it comes down to affordability. A colleague of mine pays £1,500 a month for a full fat RR with full maintenance, I think he’s mental but it doesn’t really dent overall living standards.
Truth be told if someone wants to be crap with money and put desirable cars on the road for me to enjoy further down the line- that’s cool by me!!
Truth be told if someone wants to be crap with money and put desirable cars on the road for me to enjoy further down the line- that’s cool by me!!
llcoolmac said:
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
llcoolmac said:
nickfrog said:
rbozza said:
No one pays cash for these cars, always done on finance and based on what seems affordable out of disposable income. Mega depreciation is irrelevant to the first owner as it’s already been accepted by the monthly contribution.
No one at all? t with money most people are. The vast majority of people who finance cars like this are actually crippling themselves financially without even realising it. £700 a month out of perhaps £3000 monthly income plus deposit and at the end you have nothing...is one of the most incredible stupid decisions one can make. But alas, I won't go on about it. I just don't understand the mentality. If that is your income then you should be buying your dream car that you will keep for 7-10 years. These cars are all amazing enough that you should want to do that. (I have no idea if those figures are anywhere near correct for one of these but I know people pay that % of their income on cars they won't own)But the average person isn't buying for their own pleasure of course...just to impress the neighbours.
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:09
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:10
How someone spends their money is up to them. Yes, it's £700/month or whatever. But some people spend £150 on stuff like Sky movies and Sky Sports, which may be a waste of money to someone else and they haven't got anything left at the end of their Sky Sports contract....
People are so judgemental when it comes to PCP/PCH on here it's utterly crazy. Pray tell, what car do you drive?
t when you are spending the same amount on a car that you won't even own.The traditional logic about buying a new car was that you would take a depreciation hit in the first three years but would then level out and you would have relatively hassle free motoring for the next 5-10 years. Now it seems to be "well I can just keep paying depreciation endlessly because I get a nice shiny toy every 2-3 years". People are judgemental about it because it is one of the financial world's greatest tricks and a sure sign of not thinking clearly. If your income is high and you get low APR then fine but the vast majority of people aren't earning enough for these to be anything other than a case of spending money you can't afford.
Also please point me to one person taking home 3000 pm, leasing something for 700 pm and complaining they cannot afford to buy a house.
llcoolmac said:
Because it is an absolutely idiotic waste of money they don't have. It's like all rational thought has gone out the window with PCP. At the same time we are listening to these same people saying how hard it is to buy a house nowadays. Well...no st when you are spending the same amount on a car that you won't even own.
The traditional logic about buying a new car was that you would take a depreciation hit in the first three years but would then level out and you would have relatively hassle free motoring for the next 5-10 years. Now it seems to be "well I can just keep paying depreciation endlessly because I get a nice shiny toy every 2-3 years". People are judgemental about it because it is one of the financial world's greatest tricks and a sure sign of not thinking clearly. If your income is high and you get low APR then fine but the vast majority of people aren't earning enough for these to be anything other than a case of spending money you can't afford.
But if you can make the monthly payments, insure it, fuel it etc then surely you can afford it? I’d imagine most people buying one of these isn’t living at home with mum and dad...t when you are spending the same amount on a car that you won't even own.The traditional logic about buying a new car was that you would take a depreciation hit in the first three years but would then level out and you would have relatively hassle free motoring for the next 5-10 years. Now it seems to be "well I can just keep paying depreciation endlessly because I get a nice shiny toy every 2-3 years". People are judgemental about it because it is one of the financial world's greatest tricks and a sure sign of not thinking clearly. If your income is high and you get low APR then fine but the vast majority of people aren't earning enough for these to be anything other than a case of spending money you can't afford.
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
llcoolmac said:
TyrannosauRoss Lex said:
llcoolmac said:
nickfrog said:
rbozza said:
No one pays cash for these cars, always done on finance and based on what seems affordable out of disposable income. Mega depreciation is irrelevant to the first owner as it’s already been accepted by the monthly contribution.
No one at all? t with money most people are. The vast majority of people who finance cars like this are actually crippling themselves financially without even realising it. £700 a month out of perhaps £3000 monthly income plus deposit and at the end you have nothing...is one of the most incredible stupid decisions one can make. But alas, I won't go on about it. I just don't understand the mentality. If that is your income then you should be buying your dream car that you will keep for 7-10 years. These cars are all amazing enough that you should want to do that. (I have no idea if those figures are anywhere near correct for one of these but I know people pay that % of their income on cars they won't own)But the average person isn't buying for their own pleasure of course...just to impress the neighbours.
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:09
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:10
How someone spends their money is up to them. Yes, it's £700/month or whatever. But some people spend £150 on stuff like Sky movies and Sky Sports, which may be a waste of money to someone else and they haven't got anything left at the end of their Sky Sports contract....
People are so judgemental when it comes to PCP/PCH on here it's utterly crazy. Pray tell, what car do you drive?
I haven't bought my house outright, I have it on a mortgage. Is that also a stupid thing to do? Should I live with my parents until I can save up enough to buy a house outright?
Pick any one of the wonderful cars on sale and enjoy it for a few years. Don't just change becuase the novelty has worn off on something you haven't even worked to earn yet. PCP is just an extension of the throwaway attitude people have to everything. Anyway noone is listening to me so it's okay.
llcoolmac said:
The fact that you are even asking that question kind of reinforces the point I'm making. Your house will most likely be worth the same or more than you have paid into it in 5,10, 15 or 30 years. It's not a depreciating asset. The car will be worth about 50% of what you paid for it in 3 years, but most people haven't even tapped into its potential lifespan. A modern car can do 200,000 miles with ease. Getting rid of it before getting anywhere close to even half of those figures is financially disastrous planning and indicative of an education system which doesn't teach people even the basics of money management.
Pick any one of the wonderful cars on sale and enjoy it for a few years. Don't just change becuase the novelty has worn off on something you haven't even worked to earn yet. PCP is just an extension of the throwaway attitude people have to everything. Anyway noone is listening to me so it's okay.
Surely if you keep it for three or four years, that’s a few years to enjoy it as per your ‘advice’? There’s nothing wrong with getting bored of a car and moving on. Pick any one of the wonderful cars on sale and enjoy it for a few years. Don't just change becuase the novelty has worn off on something you haven't even worked to earn yet. PCP is just an extension of the throwaway attitude people have to everything. Anyway noone is listening to me so it's okay.
How many people actually do 100k in the same car? Some people want a new car for three years or so and fancies a change / needs a bigger car for a growing family etc which is then sold to someone who wants a second hand version. It’s kind of how the car industry has worked...
Court_S said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
But only if you can buy it with no finance and intend to do at least 100k in it...Yes, believe it or not buying car and paying all of the depreciation for three years while putting very little mileage on it is a totally financially idiotic decision. You may have decided you are fine with that but there is plenty of research out there to suggest that most people on PCP deals can't actually afford them when you take into account all of the other things that you will be paying for in your life.
If you are cool with that then fine, but it doesn't lessen the stupidity of your financial imprudence. It's their money and there is a very good reason most people have way less money than they should have by the time they hit retirement or even middle age.
Good article on it here for anyone who has an interest in it.
https://www.petrolprices.com/news/millions-motoris...
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 23:22
llcoolmac said:
But the average person isn't buying for their own pleasure of course...just to impress the neighbours.
Absolute horsesEdited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:09
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 21:10
t each and every time this is trotted out. People paying £700 a month or whatever just to impress their neighbours 
TX.
Amazing thread - therefore BMW’s and C63’s depreciate much more than an Alfa but who cares as no one actually buys the BMW as it’s on PCP!!
The Alfa thread a few weeks ago went on about how wonderful the Alfa was, the BMW thread talks about how people who have BMW’s only lease them !
I’ll stay loving Alfa’s !! Not only the more sensible place to put your money but also the real car lovers place where you talk about the car !
The Alfa thread a few weeks ago went on about how wonderful the Alfa was, the BMW thread talks about how people who have BMW’s only lease them !
I’ll stay loving Alfa’s !! Not only the more sensible place to put your money but also the real car lovers place where you talk about the car !
bilo999 said:
Amazing thread - therefore BMW’s and C63’s depreciate much more than an Alfa but who cares as no one actually buys the BMW as it’s on PCP!!
The Alfa thread a few weeks ago went on about how wonderful the Alfa was, the BMW thread talks about how people who have BMW’s only lease them !
I’ll stay loving Alfa’s !! Not only the more sensible place to put your money but also the real car lovers place where you talk about the car !
Reading some of the crazy comments on here, ‘I think you’ve misunderstood. The Alfa thread a few weeks ago went on about how wonderful the Alfa was, the BMW thread talks about how people who have BMW’s only lease them !
I’ll stay loving Alfa’s !! Not only the more sensible place to put your money but also the real car lovers place where you talk about the car !
But more importantly, buy what you want and not what wins most kudos (or is it least hate?) on here.
llcoolmac said:
I love that the logic of people arguing with me on this is "well people want to do it" or "lots of people do it" as if that somehow diminishes the fact that what the vast majority of people on PCP deals do is idiotic.
Just another angle for you to consider....Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 23:22
I’m one of the people who don’t exist... I bought one outright. Very strong argument that I’d have been more sensible with the certainty of some form of finance instead of riding the depreciation waves. Particularly as it’s unlikely I’ll keep it more than a couple of years. And I have to run a car less than 4 years old to maintain a (good) car allowance.
My irrational dislike of finance without doubt costs me money.
Hungrymc said:
Just another angle for you to consider....
I’m one of the people who don’t exist... I bought one outright. Very strong argument that I’d have been more sensible with the certainty of some form of finance instead of riding the depreciation waves. Particularly as it’s unlikely I’ll keep it more than a couple of years. And I have to run a car less than 4 years old to maintain a (good) car allowance.
My irrational dislike of finance without doubt costs me money.
I am somewhere in between. I only run cars under manufacturers warranty but I will pay cash if it is cheaper but will not own it if it is cheaper. The M135i was cheaper to own so I owned it, but most family cars since then have been cheaper to lease so I leased them. The added flexibility of PCP made them more expensive but had I needed that I would have considered it. I’m one of the people who don’t exist... I bought one outright. Very strong argument that I’d have been more sensible with the certainty of some form of finance instead of riding the depreciation waves. Particularly as it’s unlikely I’ll keep it more than a couple of years. And I have to run a car less than 4 years old to maintain a (good) car allowance.
My irrational dislike of finance without doubt costs me money.
I thought the "impressing the neighbour" thing was a joke to start with as it has become a PH joke but clearly not... I don't know anyone who gives a s
t about what their neighbours drive either way. I don't think many people do. But I do think that people who judge others on the way they pay for depreciation based on assumptions, generalisations and stereotypes are in the minority of disgruntled and embittered neighbour themselves. I also love the balance between "no one pays cash" and "people on PCP pay £700 they don't have". Sounds a bit of a polarised and simplistic view. One might call it irrational.
Edited by nickfrog on Tuesday 28th January 06:58
llcoolmac said:
I love that the logic of people arguing with me on this is "well people want to do it" or "lots of people do it" as if that somehow diminishes the fact that what the vast majority of people on PCP deals do is idiotic.
Yes, believe it or not buying car and paying all of the depreciation for three years while putting very little mileage on it is a totally financially idiotic decision. You may have decided you are fine with that but there is plenty of research out there to suggest that most people on PCP deals can't actually afford them when you take into account all of the other things that you will be paying for in your life.
If you are cool with that then fine, but it doesn't lessen the stupidity of your financial imprudence. It's their money and there is a very good reason most people have way less money than they should have by the time they hit retirement or even middle age.
Good article on it here for anyone who has an interest in it.
https://www.petrolprices.com/news/millions-motoris...
Are you the financial police? You seem to be very bothered by other people’s choices. Yes, believe it or not buying car and paying all of the depreciation for three years while putting very little mileage on it is a totally financially idiotic decision. You may have decided you are fine with that but there is plenty of research out there to suggest that most people on PCP deals can't actually afford them when you take into account all of the other things that you will be paying for in your life.
If you are cool with that then fine, but it doesn't lessen the stupidity of your financial imprudence. It's their money and there is a very good reason most people have way less money than they should have by the time they hit retirement or even middle age.
Good article on it here for anyone who has an interest in it.
https://www.petrolprices.com/news/millions-motoris...
Edited by llcoolmac on Monday 27th January 23:22
Plenty of people fully understand what they’re getting into. If you can afford the payments, the insurance, the fuel etc the you can afford the car. It’s just a different way of buying it. That doesn’t meant than others don’t; there are unfortunately plenty of stupid people out there.
Perhaps your arguments would sound better without stupid, sweeping statements such as ‘only buying to impress the neighbours’.
Is PCP the be all and end all? No. But it can be a worthwhile tool to buy a car if you understand what you’re getting into. At the end if the day, how other people spend their money is none of your business but you seem to quite enjoy banging on about it.
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