RE: Caterham Superlight R500 | The Brave Pill

[Ziplobb]

the reality of running one is this:

its simply too fast for the road, I can get by pretty muh anything anytime I want from 4000 to 7000 rpm, in fact in 'normal ' overtaking mode in 4 th gear its 4000/5000 rpm and one is past the mobile chicane. i have only ever taken it to the max rpm probably 4 or 5 times its so savage,
and on the track my skills dont allow me to exploit it to its full potential , I am really your R300 type of driver skill wise.

so the notion of the recommended engine rebuild for 5000 track miles 20 years on is just advice really , Minister were simply covering themsleves for the boys that wanted to rinse it from cold every weekend racing

[ddom]

scubadude said:

.
I’d imagine the only thing comparable is a snorting quick sport bike (which FYI would need seriously pedalling to shake you in an R500, even a lesser 7, on a twisty road)

Bikes cannot stay with them, it takes a hell of a rider on the road to hang onto a committed 7.

[Mining Subsidence Man]

Too expensive to insure and run and it blows up.

Give me a sylva striker with an RX7 engine or similar.

[ddom]

Mining Subsidence Man said:

Too expensive to insure and run and it blows up.

Give me a sylva striker with an RX7 engine or similar.

Cheaper to insure than pretty much everything, and as robust as the owner.

Sylvia Striker, hmm.

[AndrewGP]

lee_erm said:

ddom said:

That’s actually quite a poor article.

A duratec is a really dull power plant, and tbh the 7 in S3 chassis guise doesn’t need more than 200HP anyway, and can’t really exploit it on the road.

Bit harsh.

I agree that's harsh, I've had a K Series Caterham and currently own a Duratec Caterham. The K Series had a bit more character but the Duratec isn't exactly dull. Mated to a lightweight flywheel, a decent map, a decat pipe and a 6 speed box, it's amazing fun with really excellent throttle response. I also like the fact I don't worry about it grenading on a track day (which the K Series did, requiring a £3.5k rebuild).

scottygib553 said:

What a dreadful colour scheme

Shouldn't be a stopper. I bought my Caterham for its perfect spec but in a colour I hated and had it resprayed for reasonable money. Sevens and Classics can even arrange to do it for you before you collect the car.

[normalbloke]

Mining Subsidence Man said:

Too expensive to insure and run and it blows up.

Give me a sylva striker with an RX7 engine or similar.

The last Caterham I had was 400bhp, and £172 comp per year.

[ddom]

AndrewGP said:

[

I agree that's harsh, I've had a K Series Caterham and currently own a Duratec Caterham. The K Series had a bit more character but the Duratec isn't exactly dull. Mated to a lightweight flywheel, a decent map, a decat pipe and a 6 speed box, it's amazing fun with really excellent throttle response. I also like the fact I don't worry about it grenading on a track day (which the K Series did, requiring a £3.5k rebuild)

To be honest once the K liner heights are sorted it’s a remarkable lump. I’ve tried the r500 D, also the 420 (IIRC) and found them really flat? Also the metric chassis, might have been a head thing but it all just felt very bland. The 620R was great, bit honenstly, just could not get the power down. The sequential box, everything was a rush but ultimately you are managing an accident

It’s cheap to build K power. All you need IMO is 200 HP or so. Fit verniers and map it right and you have a very linear delivery which revs cleanly. In fact I’d build a 1.6 K, obviously wouldn’t keep up down the back straight but they are sweet in a way that no Duranail I’ve ever driven can be.

Of course, if you want an easy 250HP go Duratec, but having been there and done that I’d not bother. Thrills aren’t measured in headline power with 7’s for me.

[Daveyraveygravey]

scottygib553 said:

What a dreadful colour scheme

What is it with people banging on about the colour scheme? Would BMW boring black be better? Or resale dullard silver be more appropriate? It's a car to be driven, not for accountants to whine on about connectivity or resale value or kerb appeal. Dodgy article from PH, better go back to AMG vs M cars, because they are the only real cars that matter 🙄

[Krikkit]

Daveyraveygravey said:

scottygib553 said:

What a dreadful colour scheme

What is it with people banging on about the colour scheme? Would BMW boring black be better? Or resale dullard silver be more appropriate? It's a car to be driven, not for accountants to whine on about connectivity or resale value or kerb appeal. Dodgy article from PH, better go back to AMG vs M cars, because they are the only real cars that matter ??

I like a bright scheme but that's way too fussy.

Blue and orange looks good, but the painted silver nose and wings at the front, black wheel centres with polished rims, various chrome and silver bits all over the place, black weather gear, yellow-green kevlar buckets... Pick a theme!

I'd have it in the same blue/orange over the nose, plain silver wheels, remove or paint the weather gear.

[Julian Thompson]

A1VDY said:

Johnspex said:

That's a lot of toe-out and odd wear on the tyres too isn't it?

Tracking does look out. Tyres look to have been under inflated too.
Ref the K series, they're not that expensive to rebuild and there's plenty about..

Nah that toe is pretty standard fare to get the front to turn in nice

[mcerbm]

A1VDY said:

Johnspex said:

That's a lot of toe-out and odd wear on the tyres too isn't it?

Tracking does look out. Tyres look to have been under inflated too.
Ref the K series, they're not that expensive to rebuild and there's plenty about..

There may be plenty k-series able but there won't be much you could use from them apart from the Block. Internals / head / sump on the R500 are quite specialist. R500 rebuild I would imagine being circa £2500 so does need to be considered.

Great cars though. I have a 220bhp k-series, but its based on a superlight R so its not as light as a R500. I would love to drive one some day. They are quite manic on the road to be fair. Makes my 600bhp M5 feel quite pedestrian in comparison. So an R500 with another 10bhp /500rpm / 30kg less would be pretty manic.

[Murph7355]

Mining Subsidence Man said:

Too expensive to insure and run and it blows up.

Give me a sylva striker with an RX7 engine or similar.

Load of rubbish.

[A1VDY]

mcerbm said:

A1VDY said:

Johnspex said:

That's a lot of toe-out and odd wear on the tyres too isn't it?

Tracking does look out. Tyres look to have been under inflated too.
Ref the K series, they're not that expensive to rebuild and there's plenty about..

There may be plenty k-series able but there won't be much you could use from them apart from the Block. Internals / head / sump on the R500 are quite specialist. R500 rebuild I would imagine being circa £2500 so does need to be considered.

Great cars though. I have a 220bhp k-series, but its based on a superlight R so its not as light as a R500. I would love to drive one some day. They are quite manic on the road to be fair. Makes my 600bhp M5 feel quite pedestrian in comparison. So an R500 with another 10bhp /500rpm / 30kg less would be pretty manic.

What I've always liked with the K series is the fact they're so easy to pull apart. Obviously not race engines but I've done in my time around 6 head gaskets on the 1.8. Once the heads been pressure tested/skimmed, fitted with a shim saver, new steel dowels, multi layer head gasket ect theyre fine. Can be fully reassembled in just a couple of hours work.
Would imagine, fitted with a balanced steel crank and H rods, maybe Omega or Accralite pistons and a kevlar belt they're pretty durable a high revs..

Edited by A1VDY on Sunday 17th May 04:23

[POORCARDEALER]

I had one built to my spec, had it mapped by Steve Greenauld, was 243 bhp, rev limit lowered to 8900 to preserve the engine, I did 280 miles in it and sold it, If I had kept it I don't think I would still be here....mental for a road car

[mcerbm]

Also a diffuser at the back of a Caterham is the last thing it needs, front end lift is always an issue at higher speeds. The diffuser will do little for traction in the lower / mid speed corners, and then cause an issue in higher speed corners. (Talking on track).

[Gandahar]

This is one of the worst comments sections I have read in a long time. Annoying and contradictory.

[Numeric]

Oddly - and in one of those 'well its London and he wont get lost' kinda things - I ended up as the person who tended to pick up 7s from Caterham and take them to Brum and then because the insurance was in my name get to do demonstrations etc for visitors.

Let's be honest I am a hopeless driver, so this was not a great idea

But I am living proof that alll these cars are actually in their own way forgiving. I have no idea what models I drove - but some were very fast, and even I found them really controllable. I loved them and I drove any car which I didn't own, well forgive me but I was a bit of a twit, without the respect they deserved. So while I suspect they never gave me the keys to a 500 I wouldn't be in any way scared of these - once you get used to the whole experience it actually seems quite easy, its a bit like riding a motorbike - first time is good grief a decade later is simples.

And finally, the engineers all told me the K-series thing was overblown, but I really don't know.

[FN2TypeR]

Daveyraveygravey said:

scottygib553 said:

What a dreadful colour scheme

What is it with people banging on about the colour scheme? Would BMW boring black be better? Or resale dullard silver be more appropriate? It's a car to be driven, not for accountants to whine on about connectivity or resale value or kerb appeal. Dodgy article from PH, better go back to AMG vs M cars, because they are the only real cars that matter ??

Yes

[Jon_S_Rally]

I'd have to change the colour scheme. It really doesn't work. A real mish-mash.

Other than that, it's another article slating the K-series, despite the fact that there are thousands of them out there running perfectly fine.

[SidewaysSi]

The K is a very fine engine in this sort of car. Far prefer it to the Duratec and Sigma cars to be honest.