RE: 911 Turbo S Cabriolet vs. McLaren 600LT Spider

[ddom]

Mosdef said:

yep, those 911s are all based on 2 litre diesel rep-mobiles.

I think what he means is the turbo is a breathed upon version of another model.

[Ares]

ddom said:

Mosdef said:

yep, those 911s are all based on 2 litre diesel rep-mobiles.

I think what he means is the turbo is a breathed upon version of another model.

Unlike McLaren that designs every model ground up with no common components for the next in the range....??

[ddom]

Ares said:

Unlike McLaren that designs every model ground up with no common components for the next in the range....??

You’d say there was more commonality in a McLaren?

[WJNB]

RudeDog said:

£940 red brake calipers (From the list of options for the 600LT)

...for a spot of red paint???

A tenner from Halfruads any day - I use their yellow actually on my diesel Vectra so that people think I'm in a Porsche.

[Ares]

ddom said:

Ares said:

Unlike McLaren that designs every model ground up with no common components for the next in the range....??

You’d say there was more commonality in a McLaren?

No, but they are close to being as bad (and certainly worse as a brand). McLaren only really have one production model then offer different flavours of it. Thats why they lose out Vs Ferrari/Lamborghini etc.

[TyrannosauRoss Lex]

Ares said:

ddom said:

Ares said:

Unlike McLaren that designs every model ground up with no common components for the next in the range....??

You’d say there was more commonality in a McLaren?

No, but they are close to being as bad (and certainly worse as a brand). McLaren only really have one production model then offer different flavours of it. Thats why they lose out Vs Ferrari/Lamborghini etc.

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

[bennno]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

[TyrannosauRoss Lex]

bennno said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

But that would be like saying a BMW 3 series is the same as a 7 series, no?

[J4CKO]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

bennno said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

But that would be like saying a BMW 3 series is the same as a 7 series, no?

BMW do 3, 5 and 7 series, and loads of variations around that, they have different architecture between the models with loads of shared parts, but they also do a 2 seater sports car, a FWD/4WD hatch, electric models, Minis, SUV's in several sizes, motorcycles etc.

Its a bit unfair to single out McLaren as they are tiny in comparison, they are all variations on a formula and it works, people buy them, think the issue is all the "new" models that are really more of a variant of the existing.

Suppose its like comparing somewhere like The Cheesecake Factory with its massive menu and a Pizza Place that do great Pizza's but nothing else.

[bennno]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

bennno said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

But that would be like saying a BMW 3 series is the same as a 7 series, no?

if bmw made the 3 and 7 series almost exactly the same size, both just seating 2, both with the same engine, both able to do 200mph or thereabouts - then yes you have nailed it.

[TyrannosauRoss Lex]

J4CKO said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

bennno said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

But that would be like saying a BMW 3 series is the same as a 7 series, no?

BMW do 3, 5 and 7 series, and loads of variations around that, they have different architecture between the models with loads of shared parts, but they also do a 2 seater sports car, a FWD/4WD hatch, electric models, Minis, SUV's in several sizes, motorcycles etc.

Its a bit unfair to single out McLaren as they are tiny in comparison, they are all variations on a formula and it works, people buy them, think the issue is all the "new" models that are really more of a variant of the existing.

Suppose its like comparing somewhere like The Cheesecake Factory with its massive menu and a Pizza Place that do great Pizza's but nothing else.

The reason I used the 3 and 7 series was because they're both front engined saloon cars (ie the same general architecture/layout), but are actually rather different cars. It is a little unfair on McLaren I think because they're ultimately a tiny company. I mean, I don't remember hearing any such negativity towards TVR back in the day, and Lotus to an extent, bar perhaps the Evora.

[bennno]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

The reason I used the 3 and 7 series was because they're both front engined saloon cars (ie the same general architecture/layout), but are actually rather different cars. It is a little unfair on McLaren I think because they're ultimately a tiny company. I mean, I don't remember hearing any such negativity towards TVR back in the day, and Lotus to an extent, bar perhaps the Evora.

Its not negativity, i've bought a mclaren, i used to have lots of TVR's, i'm just pointing out they just make different flavours of 2 seat supercars.

If anything that makes them even more focused than VW owned Porsche, who've got bye for the last 10 years punting out loads of ugly SUV and Saloon cars with Audi diesel engines.

[Ares]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

bennno said:

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

Only 1 production model and variations of it? Are you serious? Most of your posts I agree with but this is simply not true. There are very big "under the skin" differences between the 570S range and 720S range. Then of course the Senna and Speedtail are very different from the others. They effectively have 4 different cars, and variations upon 2 of them.

I'd tend to side with him to a degree - everything is a 2 seater, 4 litre ish, v8 engined, rwd, supercar. Unlike Porsche No 4wd, saloon, estate, suv's, 2+2 GT etc.

Like a restaurant just serving lots of different types of salad.

Personally I bought one as I wanted a 2 seat, 4L, v8 engined, rwd, supercar...... bought 1-2 years old there offer exceptional VFM.

Edited by bennno on Wednesday 8th July 15:02

But that would be like saying a BMW 3 series is the same as a 7 series, no?

If they all had the same carbon tub, variation of the same engine..etc... Yes.

[Ares]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

The reason I used the 3 and 7 series was because they're both front engined saloon cars (ie the same general architecture/layout), but are actually rather different cars. It is a little unfair on McLaren I think because they're ultimately a tiny company. I mean, I don't remember hearing any such negativity towards TVR back in the day, and Lotus to an extent, bar perhaps the Evora.

It's not negativity, but when specifically discussing McLaren Vs Porsche, to levy a lack of model variation against the Germans is a little off pitch.

[ddom]

Ares said:

It's not negativity, but when specifically discussing McLaren Vs Porsche, to levy a lack of model variation against the Germans is a little off pitch.

But Porsche ‘had’ a supercar not so long ago. It was obviously a halo model. I don’t think anyone would refer to the 911 as that, it’s beauty is a useable GT car. Discreet by purpose. Parked next to a McLaren it just looks very ordinary.

[anonymous-user]

If I was buying a McLaren I'd just buy the cheapest one they sell. Can't see the point spending double for one that looks the same, especially when they're all quick enough to get you into trouble.

In the same way I'd never pay double for "super-saloon" or "fast estate" with an engine the size of a planet when it's fundamentally the same car as the base model driven by Clive in accounts.

To be fair I'd say the same about 911. Base Carrera is great value compared with the boy racer jobbies. Rock up in a GT3 and you just look like an idiot. Rock up in a 911 Cabrio and don't be surprised if people wonder why you bought the ugliest Porsche.

Need a 911? I'll take a Targa, thanks...

[TyrannosauRoss Lex]

rockin said:

In the same way I'd never pay double for "super-saloon" or "fast estate" with an engine the size of a planet when it's fundamentally the same car as the base model driven by Clive in accounts.

Really? So, if you need a saloon car for practicality reasons, but don't want a humdrum diesel....what would you do? Or are you saying that everyone who has a saloon car should put up with a dreary 2 litre 4 cylinder diesel?

[av185]

rockin said:

Rock up in a GT3 and you just look like an idiot.

It that just with you at the wheel or every other GT3 driver in the world too?

[ddom]

av185 said:

It that just with you at the wheel or every other GT3 driver in the world too?

Well played Sir

[anonymous-user]

TyrannosauRoss Lex said:

So, if you need a saloon car for practicality reasons, but don't want a humdrum diesel....what would you do?

Get a modest petrol one and spend rest of the money on something else.