RE: 2020 Ford Bronco is 'Built Wild'
Discussion
lee_erm said:
It should bE much more capable. Bronco has front ARB disconnects, coil suspension vs air, lockable diffs, ladder chassis, proper tyres with small rims, solid axles. It's an off roader from the ground up, whereas the new Defender is an SUV.
Very little of what you list will actually make it good off road:- ARB disconnects - Definitely helps articulation to an extent and is most useful when rock crawling but the more dominant factor on a modern car is the calibration of the traction control and diff lock map. I have no reason to suggest Ford haven't done their work here, but it will be no better or worse than the Defender. A lot of time was spent doing rock crawl in the new Defender
- Coil Suspension vs Air - There's literally no difference in performance other than the ability to change ride heights with air suspension
- Lockable diffs - The defender also has lockable diffs. They're controlled as part of the traction control system and terrain response. Sure, you can't manually lock it, but in practice there won't be any difference in terms of actual capability (just that you don't get the 'satisfaction' of engaging the diff lock manually....with a soft button on a screen probably in the Bronco)
- Ladder chassis - It's been done to death and explained many times by many people. This literally does not make a car better off road
- Big tyres - You can get proper tyres on the Defender too
- Solid axles - Also done to death elsewhere
The Defender is absolutely an off roader from the ground up.....arguably the Bronco is probably made to the same test standards as Ford took plenty of the off road test proceedures from LR when they owned them.
BenjiA said:
I'm really not here to start a fight - I mean I would not pay much for a defender, but $90k for this???
I'll have the new one...
You do raise a perfectly valid point but it is the fault of PH opposed to the car. I'll have the new one...
PH knows the bulk of its audience is not American. It knows the Bronco name is slice of American automotive history. It knows that no one outside of America is likely to have the faintest clue as to why. It then chose to assume that everyone does.
Maybe there is another article preceding this one that focuses on the history of the vehicle for non Americans (and very ‘specialist’ UK citizens) or one to follow?
I know the name and recognise the original from some films. This new one looks good although if it were British then many of the British people on PH who will be punching the Spaniard furiously over this American car would be slamming it as a disgraceful betrayal and the reason why the country has too many foreigners in it.
It wouldn’t hurt to not assume everyone in the civilised world knows why the name Bronco is important or iconic.
camel_landy said:
Bingo...
Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
That's what I was thinking. And you can use a roof rack with the panels off.Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
But in this country you'd have to take the doors with you and replace them when it's parked because of a) weather b) chavs.
And on the way home you'd keep the roof on because everyone's hot and tired and the board will drip on your head.
I'm not Tonker level meh, but it is a nonsense here.
Given the cost to:
1) Create RHD (for UK as it's a reasonable chunk of European volume)
2) Do a powertrain/emissions programme, that can be futureproofed to Eu7, and get a diesel to work in the car
3) Most likely develop some sort of hybridisation (the platform can't support it from what I understand) to not attract crazy CO2 penalties
4) Homologate for EU type approval requirements including things like new headlights, tail lights, mirrors, new numberplate apertures etc
with countless other small bits, and when a boggo spec one would most likely cost about £35-40k here, you start to wonder what the market really is? The only way Ford will bring it over is if there is a LOT of volume potential in Europe. As many posters above have identified, other than a niche plaything, the "Bronco"/"Wrangler" lifestyle with doors off and beach driving in the sun just isn't a done thing here. The Bronco name is not a brand in Europe, and when even people on PH can't see what the big deal about a Bronco is, that severely limits its potential.
I'm sure we'll see a few imported from USA, but that route is probably sufficient to satisfy what little demand there is here for such a car.
Personally, I'd absolutely love one, but I've had an orange Ranger before and my taste in these things is quite eclectic. If they could bring one over as a BEV, I'd be all over it!
1) Create RHD (for UK as it's a reasonable chunk of European volume)
2) Do a powertrain/emissions programme, that can be futureproofed to Eu7, and get a diesel to work in the car
3) Most likely develop some sort of hybridisation (the platform can't support it from what I understand) to not attract crazy CO2 penalties
4) Homologate for EU type approval requirements including things like new headlights, tail lights, mirrors, new numberplate apertures etc
with countless other small bits, and when a boggo spec one would most likely cost about £35-40k here, you start to wonder what the market really is? The only way Ford will bring it over is if there is a LOT of volume potential in Europe. As many posters above have identified, other than a niche plaything, the "Bronco"/"Wrangler" lifestyle with doors off and beach driving in the sun just isn't a done thing here. The Bronco name is not a brand in Europe, and when even people on PH can't see what the big deal about a Bronco is, that severely limits its potential.
I'm sure we'll see a few imported from USA, but that route is probably sufficient to satisfy what little demand there is here for such a car.
Personally, I'd absolutely love one, but I've had an orange Ranger before and my taste in these things is quite eclectic. If they could bring one over as a BEV, I'd be all over it!
I spend quite a bit of time in the US and have a bit of a weakness for an old Bronco - absolutely see the appeal.
The new ‘big un’ does look good and would no doubt be amusing. If you do retro’ you can’t be half-arsed about it and Ford look to have done a great job. In Europe, I’d see this as a G-Wagon/Twisted/Grenadier competitor rather than a Defender one.
The little one is more challenging and will, I think, date rapidly and soon be remaindered. More of a cheap Jeep/Disco Sport competitor and may well be equipped with the normal nasty US Ford interior.
The new ‘big un’ does look good and would no doubt be amusing. If you do retro’ you can’t be half-arsed about it and Ford look to have done a great job. In Europe, I’d see this as a G-Wagon/Twisted/Grenadier competitor rather than a Defender one.
The little one is more challenging and will, I think, date rapidly and soon be remaindered. More of a cheap Jeep/Disco Sport competitor and may well be equipped with the normal nasty US Ford interior.
RacerMike said:
Ford have cleverly launched the thing with 99% of the pictures being of the Wildtrak on it's huge wheels and tyres. The reality is that a Defender would look equally cool with the same wheels.
In reality 99% of them sold will look considerably more staid:
And if you take the front off that, is it not basically the same as the new Defender Commercial?
One thing though, the new Defender can't be fitted with tyre larger than 32" without modifying the liner and arches , and combined that super integrated/styled plastic bumper means it simply wouldn't look as off road ready as the Bronco with the Sasquatch package. In reality 99% of them sold will look considerably more staid:
And if you take the front off that, is it not basically the same as the new Defender Commercial?
Knowing the American leisure vehicle customer base, opposite to what you might believe, the reality is there won't be many Broncos look box standard like the basic trim.
https://youtu.be/Q7ymsLXyNP4
Looks really good imo.
Be fascinating to see it tested against a defender and a grenadier?
Looks really good imo.
Be fascinating to see it tested against a defender and a grenadier?
camel_landy said:
Bingo...
Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
But you don’t even know if it can be airdropped yet. Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
As far as the 'little England' stuff is concerned I'm guessing some people haven't had their 'tea and the Telegraph' this morning. Great piece from PH, as ever.
If released here, it's hard not to see this as yet another nail in the JLR coffin as another 4x4 makes the new Def look a bit doughy and stuck between stations. Pricing is very hard to gauge (obviously) but you'd have to think that the Bronco would be a lot more attainable and comes with an added lack of perceived toffishness.
It's weird, isn't it? It feels like for years we've been being told that the 4x4's we want are softer, rounder and less off-roady. Now, they're squarer, more rugged and akin to the stuff we moved away from. I really like the new Bronco but would need to see one on UK roads to gauge whether or not I'd be interested in it as an ownership proposition - if it's the same size as a Rubicon then probably.
If released here, it's hard not to see this as yet another nail in the JLR coffin as another 4x4 makes the new Def look a bit doughy and stuck between stations. Pricing is very hard to gauge (obviously) but you'd have to think that the Bronco would be a lot more attainable and comes with an added lack of perceived toffishness.
It's weird, isn't it? It feels like for years we've been being told that the 4x4's we want are softer, rounder and less off-roady. Now, they're squarer, more rugged and akin to the stuff we moved away from. I really like the new Bronco but would need to see one on UK roads to gauge whether or not I'd be interested in it as an ownership proposition - if it's the same size as a Rubicon then probably.
Krikkit said:
I'll leave this one up here for the Bronco fans too - Jay Leno has a restomodded one with the GT500's 760hp supercharged motor.
As for the new one - want.
Not watched that yet, but suspect its a bit like something in a car game where you can take something like that and magically transplant a massive engine into something that has no business having more than 200 bhp.As for the new one - want.
I bet it is hilariously terrifying, guess I need to watch it but cant imagine its anything else.
Bill said:
camel_landy said:
Bingo...
Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
That's what I was thinking. And you can use a roof rack with the panels off.Pop the doors off, drop the roof, sling in the surf boards and off you go. I live on the coast and would consider something like this (Wrangler, etc..) for just bumming around in. However, it would probably never go further than 20 miles from home or used for anything other than going to the beach.
M
But in this country you'd have to take the doors with you and replace them when it's parked because of a) weather b) chavs.
And on the way home you'd keep the roof on because everyone's hot and tired and the board will drip on your head.
I'm not Tonker level meh, but it is a nonsense here.
I'm not saying it'll be a big market here but you see it already with the likes of the Jimny and the Wrangler. The BiL has a Rubicon and it's not uncommon for the roof to come off & the surfboards to be slung inside.
The Devil, as always, will be in the detail. The options for some sort of securable load area and some kind of wearable, waterproof key would be great as that's where a lot of the modern keys fail.
M
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