RE: Peugeot to sell factory restored 205 GTIs
Discussion
David87 said:
This is great news. I don't have an emotional connection with the 205 (despite how good it is), but the day Renault do this with a Clio Williams I'm in.
I doubt there are enough Williams left to make it worthwhile. According to howmanyleft there are a shockingly large number of 205 GTIs left on British roads and I imagine the situation in France isn't too shabby either.Maxym said:
I'd want to be sure the factory retained the mysterious water leak into the spare wheel well, the appallingly jerky throttle, the rear three-quart panel model badges that fell off and the cheapo cabin fittings. One of the worst cars I've owned.
Oh yes, mine had all of those issues too. The water leak made the boot floor insulation/sound deadening smell interesting....Don't forget the curious vacuum seal sunroof that would leak, fill up the map reading light and then drip on your leg.
J4CKO said:
Like all old hot hatches, we think of them in terms of how we reacted to them when they were new and a 130 bhp, fine handling, good looking hatch was a revelation, but drive them now and they perhaps don't live up to the weight of the nostalgia.
(...)
Love the 205 GTI but we need to remember not to get too carried away.
My view exactly, it's essentially nostalgia and emotion IMO. I really liked my 309 GTI but prefer modern stuff, particularly for the track.(...)
Love the 205 GTI but we need to remember not to get too carried away.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 16th October 15:12
BigChiefmuffinAgain said:
The thing is, while it is a lovely idea, and speaks volume for the high regard these cars are still held, would you actually trust Peugeot to do this ?
Like, it is not really their area of expertise. They are set up to mass produce cars from scratch on a production line, where everyone does their little bit and the car moves to the next station on a conveyor belt. They know as much about car restoration as I do about brain surgery. And I cannot imagine there will be anyone left who worked on the original cars ?
Beside the supposed cache, I suspect you would be far better going to a specialist who knows what they are doing.
Ha ha, I was scrolling through reading and collecting my thoughts and had come to the same conclusion. If you have one in decent nick, worth restoring, why on earth would you trust Peugeot to do it, let alone pay their inevitable premium?Like, it is not really their area of expertise. They are set up to mass produce cars from scratch on a production line, where everyone does their little bit and the car moves to the next station on a conveyor belt. They know as much about car restoration as I do about brain surgery. And I cannot imagine there will be anyone left who worked on the original cars ?
Beside the supposed cache, I suspect you would be far better going to a specialist who knows what they are doing.
Obviously these are cool cars and objectively very good fun to drive and everyone should want to own one ahead of the myriad of s
t that has followed over the decades. But they're also st cars from a company that has only ever made st cars. At least give yourself a fighting chance by handing it over to a proper restoration company.It's great if they flood the market with parts to enable more to be kept on the roads, though they won't, because as the article says, they are going to 3D print stuff rather than tool up for production runs. Which anyone could do.
1602Mark said:
daveco said:
LP670 said:
David87 said:
1602Mark said:
Wonder if BMW might be up for knocking out a few E30 M3's? 
I've been saying this for years. Would much rather have one than the new version. 
An E30 325i sport would do as well!
Is that the M44? If so, that's a cracking little engine
I doubt I’ll be able to afford this to be honest but if I could, and VW were to do the same with the mk1 or 2 GTi then I’d desperately try to find the pfennigs.
For me I can understand the nostalgia thing, I was around 21 when the 205 GTi first came onto our markets and it is, of course very iconic.
Yes, in nearly every way it’s dynamically inferior to today’s warm hatches, no pas or abs, or even stability control (I believe later 205’s did get pas and possibly abs?) but the thing is you can drive one nearer to its limits for more of the time, and have more fun ((remember that concept, a strange thing that has been continually diluted by safety systems...?) for more of the time.
And as most of us, despite what we might like to think, aren’t driving gods, doesn’t that make it a ‘better’ or more fun thing to drive? Give me a drive over the N Yorks moors on a sunny weekend morning and the choice of a 205 or a Fiesta ST and I know which I would park my bum in...
For me I can understand the nostalgia thing, I was around 21 when the 205 GTi first came onto our markets and it is, of course very iconic.
Yes, in nearly every way it’s dynamically inferior to today’s warm hatches, no pas or abs, or even stability control (I believe later 205’s did get pas and possibly abs?) but the thing is you can drive one nearer to its limits for more of the time, and have more fun ((remember that concept, a strange thing that has been continually diluted by safety systems...?) for more of the time.
And as most of us, despite what we might like to think, aren’t driving gods, doesn’t that make it a ‘better’ or more fun thing to drive? Give me a drive over the N Yorks moors on a sunny weekend morning and the choice of a 205 or a Fiesta ST and I know which I would park my bum in...
Augustus Windsock said:
I doubt I’ll be able to afford this to be honest but if I could, and VW were to do the same with the mk1 or 2 GTi then I’d desperately try to find the pfennigs.
For me I can understand the nostalgia thing, I was around 21 when the 205 GTi first came onto our markets and it is, of course very iconic.
Yes, in nearly every way it’s dynamically inferior to today’s warm hatches, no pas or abs, or even stability control (I believe later 205’s did get pas and possibly abs?) but the thing is you can drive one nearer to its limits for more of the time, and have more fun ((remember that concept, a strange thing that has been continually diluted by safety systems...?) for more of the time.
And as most of us, despite what we might like to think, aren’t driving gods, doesn’t that make it a ‘better’ or more fun thing to drive? Give me a drive over the N Yorks moors on a sunny weekend morning and the choice of a 205 or a Fiesta ST and I know which I would park my bum in...
Ive previously owned 3 205gtis and currently in a Fiesta ST. I'd take the 205 on that trip every time.For me I can understand the nostalgia thing, I was around 21 when the 205 GTi first came onto our markets and it is, of course very iconic.
Yes, in nearly every way it’s dynamically inferior to today’s warm hatches, no pas or abs, or even stability control (I believe later 205’s did get pas and possibly abs?) but the thing is you can drive one nearer to its limits for more of the time, and have more fun ((remember that concept, a strange thing that has been continually diluted by safety systems...?) for more of the time.
And as most of us, despite what we might like to think, aren’t driving gods, doesn’t that make it a ‘better’ or more fun thing to drive? Give me a drive over the N Yorks moors on a sunny weekend morning and the choice of a 205 or a Fiesta ST and I know which I would park my bum in...
Blackpuddin said:
Probably, and yet you have to ask why we expect that, given that Peugeot has all the means, tools and (you'd think still) directly experienced personnel to do restos like this much more efficiently and quickly than regular non-factory restorers.
I assumed, maybe completely incorrectly, that they would be outsourcing the restorations to one of the big places further East rather than hiring a team and allocating space themselves?I hope it’s a big hit and that more manufacturers pluck up the courage to recycle old bangers from this era as those of us who had these vehicles as our first cars are now of the age where a bit of hassle free nostalgia is firmly on the cards and quite a few of us just find the modern offerings dull, regardless of how brilliant they are. These icons of a gone era may not see which way a modern hatchback has gone but the point is that you wouldn’t have been looking or caring.
Frankly, it’s also a small miracle to read a recycling of an old car that isn’t about filling it with all the modern tech that many of us are desperate to have a choice to get away from when we want to. A car that unlocks with a key, doesn’t have Dunning Kruger trying to second guess what you want to do and just has a single din stereo and is then a bit of fun to sling around at sensible speeds.
Maxym said:
I'd want to be sure the factory retained the mysterious water leak into the spare wheel well, the appallingly jerky throttle, the rear three-quart panel model badges that fell off and the cheapo cabin fittings. One of the worst cars I've owned.
Aye, Pugs of that vintage had great chassis, but were not what you'd call "reliable" or "well made". I had a 405 and it was calamitous.Collaudatore said:
GTRene said:
I like the idea, those 205 GTI are lovely, I looked it up, I've owned 11 times a Peugeot 205 in my 'car' life,
most were 1.9 GTI, but also 1.6 GTI and a GT 1.6 and a Rallye 1.9 and Gutman 1.9 and a Gutman tuned Dimma 1.9 (T16 look) and my last one back in 1999 (car 92 on my list) was a 1991 Gentry 1.9 in that dark-ish green, lovely car also.
good old times
Mate, you can't tell us all that without photos most were 1.9 GTI, but also 1.6 GTI and a GT 1.6 and a Rallye 1.9 and Gutman 1.9 and a Gutman tuned Dimma 1.9 (T16 look) and my last one back in 1999 (car 92 on my list) was a 1991 Gentry 1.9 in that dark-ish green, lovely car also.
good old times
I only have the more pricier sporty cars on my PC (a lot scans) and in 2 of those pictures, with both a different E30 M3, you can also spot a 205 GTI and in another a small part of the Dimma version in it hah, guess at the time I drove the 205 gti first, before I bought again a e30 M3 from which I also owned at least 4 in different versions and power stage etc, good old days.
daveco said:
1602Mark said:
daveco said:
LP670 said:
David87 said:
1602Mark said:
Wonder if BMW might be up for knocking out a few E30 M3's?
I've been saying this for years. Would much rather have one than the new version. An E30 325i sport would do as well!
Is that the M44? If so, that's a cracking little engine
daveco said:
1602Mark said:
daveco said:
LP670 said:
David87 said:
1602Mark said:
Wonder if BMW might be up for knocking out a few E30 M3's?
I've been saying this for years. Would much rather have one than the new version. An E30 325i sport would do as well!
Is that the M44? If so, that's a cracking little engine
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
1602Mark said:
It is, yes. It's just had a full rebuild, vapour clean etc and as well as the ITB's, lighter E30 flywheel and free flow exhaust, it now runs DTA S60 Pro standalone management. Hopefully it's getting mapped any day now and I'm hoping for about 165 -175 brake and the car itself it a fair bit lighter than a stock 02. It's also on coilovers with a new 40% LSD with sintered clutch pack and 5 speed box.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Nice! https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Considering mine is at 163 on a head skim, cam timing tweak, 4bar FPR and a Superchips Compact Cup map I would expect you to get well past my figures.
geeks said:
If it is from a Z3 it will most likely be an M44, most people rate the M42 over the M44 though, there are reasons, none come to mind though I am drawing a blank!
I think the forged internals make it better for boost? Maybe? I had one in my E21 race car and it would pound around Brands all day long. I think the M44 is better though and the likes of BDS and Shrigley can get them to make 250+ bhp. I'd have loved an S14/2.3 but they're just too expensive now. An M44 can be had for a couple of hundred quid. My friend at JFi Classics has a supercharged M44 in his 1602 and it's a properly quick little thing and the SC whine is epic. Apologies for the diversion from 205's.
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