RE: 331mph Tuatara is world's fastest production car
Discussion
Gecko1978 said:
Oddly I like this in ways I did not like the Bugatti when it broke 270 or 300, this seems like the underdog effort an also i bet this costs a lot less than a limited edition Bugatti. The real thrill would be owning one and turning up to an even twhere people are crowding round a Divo or a Chiron Pur Sang and saying yeah nice car but its not that fast.
That might be a priceless moment
The steering wheel looks like it from a Cleethorpe's sea front arcade though and its had spotty teenagers tugging at it for the best part of a decade That might be a priceless moment
The inner, Top Trump loving, boy in me is impressed by the sheer speed.
The way it accelerates from 200 to 330 is what is most impressive - it barely hesitates at all. The aero and power in the thing must be truely awesome. From watching the in-car, it just looks almost effortless.
Driver still had one gear left and there were some strong cross winds, so there is more left in the tank apparently
The way it accelerates from 200 to 330 is what is most impressive - it barely hesitates at all. The aero and power in the thing must be truely awesome. From watching the in-car, it just looks almost effortless.
Driver still had one gear left and there were some strong cross winds, so there is more left in the tank apparently
I’m slightly surprised that it doesn’t have a longer arse than it does to be honest. Bugatti purposely extended theirs due to the obvious benefits and the Speedtail, which according to Chris Harris at least, maintains it’s ability to accelerate like nothing else he has driven because of it’s elongated form. Maybe there will be an long tail version of this to come, or maybe it just isn’t as important as I was let to believe? Hopefully at some point somebody will go over the details of the design from an aerodynamic point of view.
“The point” of things like this is surely its expression of the innate human urge to compete - the urge which often, but not always (sometimes it’s really bad, like the race to build the bomb), furthers the human race. We can’t foresee the full range of any spin-off benefits yet, so let’s just enjoy the achievement.
Modern engine management systems got a huge leg up from the F1 race to harness turbos in the 80’s. No one can dispute the benefits of these systems, aside from grieving for the character of the carburettor.
Aerodynamically it must have some interesting details. Tony Southgate proved a long tail wasn’t necessary for low drag and downforce in the 80’s when he used the Jag XJR’s rear wings to “virtually” lengthen the tail and pull air out of the diffusers. I’ve no idea how stability-generating a McLaren Speedtail is, it’s got an arse like a 30’s streamliner and they sacrificed stability for drag. I’m guessing the McLaren is less focused on any more stability than it needs within its design envelope - 250 mph is a relatively familiar territory, they did it with the F1. This is going 80 mph faster into a more unknown region where compressibility begins to have more effect, and stability must have been top priority, it certainly looks very stable. A video of the Jesko testing suggests Konigsegg are still working on this. You could argue stability and containment of excess drag is SSC’s biggest achievement here.
Modern engine management systems got a huge leg up from the F1 race to harness turbos in the 80’s. No one can dispute the benefits of these systems, aside from grieving for the character of the carburettor.
Aerodynamically it must have some interesting details. Tony Southgate proved a long tail wasn’t necessary for low drag and downforce in the 80’s when he used the Jag XJR’s rear wings to “virtually” lengthen the tail and pull air out of the diffusers. I’ve no idea how stability-generating a McLaren Speedtail is, it’s got an arse like a 30’s streamliner and they sacrificed stability for drag. I’m guessing the McLaren is less focused on any more stability than it needs within its design envelope - 250 mph is a relatively familiar territory, they did it with the F1. This is going 80 mph faster into a more unknown region where compressibility begins to have more effect, and stability must have been top priority, it certainly looks very stable. A video of the Jesko testing suggests Konigsegg are still working on this. You could argue stability and containment of excess drag is SSC’s biggest achievement here.
Water Fairy said:
I can't help but ask why? What's the end game here?
If there is an end game then it is to continuously push the boundaries of what is possible...engineering, dynamics, power, etc. It's man's nature to do that, we all do that whether we are doing a press-up challenge or playing on the X-box.The end of I.C......yes soon but not for a while.... but what a opportunity it must be to have a chance at creating the fastest I.C. road car that will ever be created! This is a unique time where an old technology is starting to be pushed out by the new. I think all the big names will be gunning for that title because at some point that will be it...the book will be closed and one manufacture will go down in history as the ones to have created the fastest...fullstop! a bit like the Tupolev Tu-114.
I think the big boys will go mental and we might see some ridicules speeds before the I.C. engine is laid to rest.
Interesting times!
I think the big boys will go mental and we might see some ridicules speeds before the I.C. engine is laid to rest.
Interesting times!
Justin Case said:
I am amazed that anything with the aerodynamics of a brick outhouse can do 30mph, let alone 330:
https://tuataraatv.com/atv-products-and-add-ons/
Although it certainly helps, it's not aerodynamics that get you a record top speed, it's horsepower. Man did not get to the moon with aerodynamics alone, Saturn 5 had 160 million horsepower to play with :-)https://tuataraatv.com/atv-products-and-add-ons/
FlukePlay said:
Justin Case said:
I am amazed that anything with the aerodynamics of a brick outhouse can do 30mph, let alone 330:
https://tuataraatv.com/atv-products-and-add-ons/
Although it certainly helps, it's not aerodynamics that get you a record top speed, it's horsepower. Man did not get to the moon with aerodynamics alone, Saturn 5 had 160 million horsepower to play with :-)https://tuataraatv.com/atv-products-and-add-ons/
WCZ said:
so it actually makes 1350hp on normal fuel which makes the record invalid imo
also i'd be surprised if this thing was engineered for 300mph in the same way the chiron ss is / does it have any reliability?
E85's available straight from the pump in the US (over 5000 stations offer E85 pumps), although I get where you're coming from. I think there are otherwise a fair few potential issues with the 'record' status, at a glance, but it's unquestionably a remarkable feat in any instance. also i'd be surprised if this thing was engineered for 300mph in the same way the chiron ss is / does it have any reliability?
It obviously won't be engineered and honed to the same standards and degree of compliance as the Chiron, but there will be a degree of reliability there. Those NRE engines, for example, are often built to last several seasons of competition use – so they're not horrendously fragile.
WCZ said:
so it actually makes 1350hp on normal fuel which makes the record invalid imo
also i'd be surprised if this thing was engineered for 300mph in the same way the chiron ss is / does it have any reliability?
The change of fuel would allow for a different engine mode (more ignition timing, more boost - with greater resistance to pinking). If we're splitting hairs, didn't the Bugatti run 300mph with a roll cage that isn't featured on the purchasable car and a stripped out interior, with the passenger seat missing? also i'd be surprised if this thing was engineered for 300mph in the same way the chiron ss is / does it have any reliability?
Few of these records are set in exactly the same state of trim or tune that a customer would receive. The SSC is unlikely to have the cossetting luxury of a Bugatti, nor the £5k magnesium indicator stalks, but 331mph is still 331mph. I wouldn't be concerned about reliability - Nelson engines are tough bullets.
This is the point I was trying to make a few pages back: this isn't a production car per se, its a prep'd version of a very limited edition vehicle. Going 300+ mph in an ICE car isn't a big deal if you accept that its not also expected to do the school run. The technical differences between this car and something like the Bugatti are like comparing a gun to a catapult. Dragsters and other race cars do 300+ regularly e.g. speed week, so the technical challenge of the speed isn't that special. An EV can easily make 2000HP, e.g. Lotus Evija. Electric motors are not highly strung and can deliver the goods across the range with minimal fuss.
As someone mentioned, the big deal are the tires. Great, good for the tire manufacturer. Now the EV suppliers have even less reason to go faster than this record.
I'm not anti ICE, I've had at least one V8 on my drive for the last 20 years, but I'd be the first to acknowledge that the age of tuned engines eeking the last HP out of the system to go as fast as possible are over. Its a pity but that's progress for you.
As someone mentioned, the big deal are the tires. Great, good for the tire manufacturer. Now the EV suppliers have even less reason to go faster than this record.
I'm not anti ICE, I've had at least one V8 on my drive for the last 20 years, but I'd be the first to acknowledge that the age of tuned engines eeking the last HP out of the system to go as fast as possible are over. Its a pity but that's progress for you.
CraigyMc said:
GravelBen said:
I'm just curious why they named it after a rather slow-moving lizard!
Because https://www.massey.ac.nz/massey/about-massey/news/...Thoroughly impressive achievement still.
A few details people seem to have missed:
E85 is not a special race or speed run fuel. It's a commonly available fuel in the US.
The Bugatti speed run last year was not valid as a record since:
- it was not a production model but a one-off specifically built for the run
- it only was a one-way run specifically picked for the direction that was best
Even allowing for the Bugatti being a one-off the production Tuatara's best one-way speed was over 25 MPH faster than Bugatti's special-built record car
The Tuatara's fuel and tires and all other items are identical to the production model
The record holder prior to the Tuatara was not Bugatti but the Koenigsegg Agera RS at 277.9 MPH set in 2017
The Tuatara broke the Agera's record by 14% which is the 3rd biggest post-war jump beaten only by the Mercedes 300SL taking the crown from the Jaguar XK-120 in 1955 and the Veryon taking it from the McLaren F1 in 2005. And it's worth noting that SSC's previous model, the Ultimate Aero was the car that took the title away from Bugatti in 2007.
E85 is not a special race or speed run fuel. It's a commonly available fuel in the US.
The Bugatti speed run last year was not valid as a record since:
- it was not a production model but a one-off specifically built for the run
- it only was a one-way run specifically picked for the direction that was best
Even allowing for the Bugatti being a one-off the production Tuatara's best one-way speed was over 25 MPH faster than Bugatti's special-built record car
The Tuatara's fuel and tires and all other items are identical to the production model
The record holder prior to the Tuatara was not Bugatti but the Koenigsegg Agera RS at 277.9 MPH set in 2017
The Tuatara broke the Agera's record by 14% which is the 3rd biggest post-war jump beaten only by the Mercedes 300SL taking the crown from the Jaguar XK-120 in 1955 and the Veryon taking it from the McLaren F1 in 2005. And it's worth noting that SSC's previous model, the Ultimate Aero was the car that took the title away from Bugatti in 2007.
Edited by MikeGalos on Tuesday 20th October 17:16
Gecko1978 said:
... i bet this costs a lot less than a limited edition Bugatti....
It's worth noting that the "limited edition" Bugatti with the same name as their 300MPH run car is only "inspired" by it and doesn't have the same specs as the car Bugatti actually used to do their press event. You can't buy the car Bugatti ran. You can buy an SSC Tuatara exactly like the one that set the new production car record (if you have quite a bit of money). Although, personally, I think the Tuatara looks better in white than in the black color they used for the record car.
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