RE: Discovery Sport
Discussion
Nik Gnashers said:
This has to be a paid advert.
I don't know anyone who would spend the massive amount of money these cost, to commute 27 miles a day, only to not be able to park it when you get to work because they are so big.
I work at a main dealership, and there are two charge points for the whole place, both of which are taken by sales people, two of which run pure EV's as their company cars. At least the cars in question where I work have an electric-only range of 280 miles each on average, and are not so massive that they can actually be parked in regular parking bay.
I can only see pure land rover / range rover fanatics buying these, because there are much MUCH better options for less money.
Neither Disco Sport nor Evoque are 'big'.I don't know anyone who would spend the massive amount of money these cost, to commute 27 miles a day, only to not be able to park it when you get to work because they are so big.
I work at a main dealership, and there are two charge points for the whole place, both of which are taken by sales people, two of which run pure EV's as their company cars. At least the cars in question where I work have an electric-only range of 280 miles each on average, and are not so massive that they can actually be parked in regular parking bay.
I can only see pure land rover / range rover fanatics buying these, because there are much MUCH better options for less money.
Mrs Digga ran 3 Evoques on the bounce, a new one every few years since their launch. She loves them. Her work often requires parking in long term railway or airport car parking, as well as at office, gym etc. etc. and this was a key reason for choosing the car - it does fit in spaces nicely.
If she did not now have an I-pace on the way, from a new company scheme, I think she'd be one of the many who find these vehicles interesting.
There are, as the article points out, going to be a lot of people switching to these, both from company cars and also company 'vans' (think posh pickups or lifestyle vans) because the BIK is very attractive.
Oh, and neither she nor I work for JLR.
Around here the Disco Sport seems immensely popular among the non perma tanned pensioner day trippers as well as older locals. It also seems more of an old boy’s car and the wives appear to opt for the Evoque more. The two products seem to work quite well together, sitting as king and queen of the pensioner mini SUV segment. And to be fair it’s easy to see why.
Limpet said:
Our company offers the 330e on the company car list. Of the dozen or so people I’ve spoken to who have one, not one plugs it in.
They all chose it for the BIK saving. Apparently it’s about £150 cheaper a month in BIK for a 40% taxpayer than a 320d would be.
Private buyers of course will be motivated differently, but I would agree there are a lot of PHEVs out there that don’t get plugged in, and as a result are likely to be less efficient and more polluting than a conventional equivalent in the real world. People will always gravitate toward tax efficiency.
I wonder if thats because they also have a fuel card or petrol costs paid, with no company contribution to electricity. Perhaps if the companies (and the govertment tax system) woke up to this, or put in a charge point at the offices (doesn't even have to be free) more people would plug in They all chose it for the BIK saving. Apparently it’s about £150 cheaper a month in BIK for a 40% taxpayer than a 320d would be.
Private buyers of course will be motivated differently, but I would agree there are a lot of PHEVs out there that don’t get plugged in, and as a result are likely to be less efficient and more polluting than a conventional equivalent in the real world. People will always gravitate toward tax efficiency.
Ultimately they will have to for EV's so why not for hybridsjagfan2 said:
Limpet said:
Our company offers the 330e on the company car list. Of the dozen or so people I’ve spoken to who have one, not one plugs it in.
They all chose it for the BIK saving. Apparently it’s about £150 cheaper a month in BIK for a 40% taxpayer than a 320d would be.
Private buyers of course will be motivated differently, but I would agree there are a lot of PHEVs out there that don’t get plugged in, and as a result are likely to be less efficient and more polluting than a conventional equivalent in the real world. People will always gravitate toward tax efficiency.
I wonder if thats because they also have a fuel card or petrol costs paid, with no company contribution to electricity. Perhaps if the companies (and the govertment tax system) woke up to this, or put in a charge point at the offices (doesn't even have to be free) more people would plug in They all chose it for the BIK saving. Apparently it’s about £150 cheaper a month in BIK for a 40% taxpayer than a 320d would be.
Private buyers of course will be motivated differently, but I would agree there are a lot of PHEVs out there that don’t get plugged in, and as a result are likely to be less efficient and more polluting than a conventional equivalent in the real world. People will always gravitate toward tax efficiency.
Ultimately they will have to for EV's so why not for hybridsSo if you doing higher business miles in a hybrid it doesn't really matter if you plug in or not.
The saving is purely tax. My 530e saved me around £200 a month over a VRS tdi.
Digga said:
J4CKO said:
CDP said:
Over two tons in weight. That's about three Aygos.
Why does eco motoring seem to be so wasteful?
Was just going to post the same thing, the small(ish) Range Rover Evoque weighs over two tonnes.Why does eco motoring seem to be so wasteful?
That’s before you’ve even considered the massively improved refinement, dynamics, technology, electric range, etc etc
Also, on higher miles, with a 30 mile range, the plug-in bit is moot. You will need to put petrol/diesel in to your PHEV.
However, the clever bit is, that through regen braking, the cars are more fuel efficient and also able to 'save' charge, so you can drive to a village/town/city on fossil power, but then use only leccy in the built-up area. This is where IMHO, there is another big win with PHEVs, because you can (if you use them sensible) reduce your emissions in built up areas.
Still, the main win with these is for those whose journeys are mostly short and can be done on the 15 mile radius EV tether.
However, the clever bit is, that through regen braking, the cars are more fuel efficient and also able to 'save' charge, so you can drive to a village/town/city on fossil power, but then use only leccy in the built-up area. This is where IMHO, there is another big win with PHEVs, because you can (if you use them sensible) reduce your emissions in built up areas.
Still, the main win with these is for those whose journeys are mostly short and can be done on the 15 mile radius EV tether.
Yup. When used appropriately they are a big win. Never been sold on the ‘regen’ argument as it’s really just man maths for trying to fob off the crippling inefficiency of filling a car with a load of Victorian bricks that it has to lug about its entire life.
It’s like Paul Daniels telling you to look at the 2 watts saved using regen while distracting you from the 100 watts used to get the big fat f
ker moving forward every time. Or Doris that fat office pig lying on the floor crying on top of yet another collapsed chair and wailing to anyone that will listen that she had a salad for lunch.
Something like this DS hybrid is still the fat pig that half fills the lift but it’s got the potential to void its bowels in that lift less frequently. It’s not eco but it is a bit more polite to those around it.
It’s like Paul Daniels telling you to look at the 2 watts saved using regen while distracting you from the 100 watts used to get the big fat f
ker moving forward every time. Or Doris that fat office pig lying on the floor crying on top of yet another collapsed chair and wailing to anyone that will listen that she had a salad for lunch. Something like this DS hybrid is still the fat pig that half fills the lift but it’s got the potential to void its bowels in that lift less frequently. It’s not eco but it is a bit more polite to those around it.
I think a PHEV would be perfect for me.
I have off street parking, do too many local journeys which could be done on foot or bike but also do some 100 mile motorway trips as well.
Unless I’ve missed something the petrol engine doesn’t charge the battery, which I understand it does in a Prius or BMW range extender. A missed trick in my opinion but the Volvo system is the same and I think I read that it makes the ICE very inefficient if it has to charge the battery while driving the car at the same time.
Yesterday I specced an Evoque using the LR online tool and it came to £55k which I don’t have* and anyway I can see 3 LR models from my front room so SWMBO has decided they’re common and we’re having an XC40 instead.
In a couple of years time, when the current leases run out and they are available second hand will the battery be barely used so in excellent condition or barely used so in terrible condition?
I have off street parking, do too many local journeys which could be done on foot or bike but also do some 100 mile motorway trips as well.
Unless I’ve missed something the petrol engine doesn’t charge the battery, which I understand it does in a Prius or BMW range extender. A missed trick in my opinion but the Volvo system is the same and I think I read that it makes the ICE very inefficient if it has to charge the battery while driving the car at the same time.
Yesterday I specced an Evoque using the LR online tool and it came to £55k which I don’t have* and anyway I can see 3 LR models from my front room so SWMBO has decided they’re common and we’re having an XC40 instead.
In a couple of years time, when the current leases run out and they are available second hand will the battery be barely used so in excellent condition or barely used so in terrible condition?
- Finance blah blah blah, actually I do have £55k but it’s going towards a kitchen extension next year if I can find a builder to quote for it.
The Wookie said:
Or alternatively comparable size (inside and out perhaps excluding the boot) and weight to a later classic Range Rover but more or less double the power, and around a third of the fuel consumption even with the batteries flat.
That’s before you’ve even considered the massively improved refinement, dynamics, technology, electric range, etc etc
Yup.That’s before you’ve even considered the massively improved refinement, dynamics, technology, electric range, etc etc
Mrs Digga's Evoque was the last of the 2018 MY, so just prior to the new shape with flush door handles. There's been a huge move forawrd wit hthe new platform, but even the 2018 cars are lovely to drive.
I borrowed a 2020 Velar diesel a week or so back and am smitten. Just the right amount of power and size (room for rear passengers and dogs in boot) but less bulk and width than Disco/RRS/RR, but superb refinement.
Digga said:
J4CKO said:
CDP said:
Over two tons in weight. That's about three Aygos.
Why does eco motoring seem to be so wasteful?
Was just going to post the same thing, the small(ish) Range Rover Evoque weighs over two tonnes.Why does eco motoring seem to be so wasteful?
I know there have been advances in safety but there have also been advances in materials and engineering.
All this weight takes energy to move around. All these materials need to be produced.
A MK5 Cortina was not an unpleasant car but came in at 965kg. While I wouldn't want to crash one that was built with an all cast iron engine and 1970's steel technology for the body.
CDP said:
A MK5 Cortina was not an unpleasant car but came in at 965kg. While I wouldn't want to crash one that was built with an all cast iron engine and 1970's steel technology for the body.
You're comparing a dog-eared Filofax and a few shillings of telephone change to an iPhone 12.I doubt too many 1970's and 80's cars would survive the crater-strewn tarmac and speed mountains we have to put up with these days.
RUSSELLM said:
If it’s the same system as the RR and RRS, it will.
You can select ‘My EV’ on the infotainment screen, and watch which way the charge is going, engine to battery etc
You’d think it would be the same system but on the Land Rover website, under how to charge the battery, it just says plug it in, no mention of charging by driving. You can select ‘My EV’ on the infotainment screen, and watch which way the charge is going, engine to battery etc
I’ve got a day off on Wednesday, I might amble into the JLR showroom and see if they’ll deign to talk to me about it .
Mr_Sukebe said:
So, Land Rover reliability mixed with complex technology.
Anyone see a potential issue here?
Yes. Just watched a YouTube video of a brand new Defender in the USA. It managed 167 miles (from new) until the Check Engine light came on. No sooner than they fixed that, the whole 360 camera package stopped working. For a £55-60K range motor, I would be crying! (and that is not a hybrid with the additional complexity).Anyone see a potential issue here?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBVZyvfiqKw
Lovely looking cars, but would I trust one. Sorry, no. There are so many other good cars out there that make it out of the factory and continue to live without problems. "Prestigious", possibly. "Quality", possibly not.
CoupeKid said:
You’d think it would be the same system but on the Land Rover website, under how to charge the battery, it just says plug it in, no mention of charging by driving.
I’ve got a day off on Wednesday, I might amble into the JLR showroom and see if they’ll deign to talk to me about it .
Why would you want to do that anyway? Clue is in the name when it says plugin.I’ve got a day off on Wednesday, I might amble into the JLR showroom and see if they’ll deign to talk to me about it .
JonnyVTEC said:
CoupeKid said:
You’d think it would be the same system but on the Land Rover website, under how to charge the battery, it just says plug it in, no mention of charging by driving.
I’ve got a day off on Wednesday, I might amble into the JLR showroom and see if they’ll deign to talk to me about it .
Why would you want to do that anyway? Clue is in the name when it says plugin.I’ve got a day off on Wednesday, I might amble into the JLR showroom and see if they’ll deign to talk to me about it .
Land Rover said:
An electric motor is fitted to the rear axle which delivers instantly accessible torque to the rear wheels. It can also charge the high voltage battery through regenerative braking.
https://www.landrover.co.uk/vehicles/phev/what-is-phev.htmlClick on item "3" the "Electric Motor / Drivetrain" on the diagram of the PHEV architecture.
I don't need to read the manual.
Regen braking is the motor working energy backwards when slowing the car = free energy for tractive effort later.
The questions asked was along the lines of cruising up the motorway with roadload covered by the engine + extra load to charge the battery signiciantly back up. Utter waste of time and energy.
Regen braking is the motor working energy backwards when slowing the car = free energy for tractive effort later.
The questions asked was along the lines of cruising up the motorway with roadload covered by the engine + extra load to charge the battery signiciantly back up. Utter waste of time and energy.
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