Car parts from Europe

[Olivergt]

21st Century Man said:

... But there is no duty, so can we close that off now please? ...

Not yet.

Looking at example 4 here, there is definitely customs duty to be paid when importing to Ireland.

Example 4 relates to sports clothing, so nothing weird, example 3 relates to a digital camera which is 0 rated.

Unfortunately it's not easy to see what items will be 0 rated and which items will be subject to customs duty.

But there is customs duty payable on certain goods when importing to Ireland, that fact cannot be disputed.

There is also the VAT issue on S/H goods, this cannot be removed by a UK seller, so any S/H goods sold to an EU country will be subject to VAT at the rate for the destination country. In Irelands case that is 21%.

And to add a PH theme, that 21% VAT applies to S/H cars imported to Ireland as well as a 10% customs duty, see 2nd link.


See examples 3 and 4 on this web page:
https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-...

Importing car to Ireland from the UK:
https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-...

[21st Century Man]

I know about duty/vat on second hand, it was me that raised it. As for new, please read the trade agreement. There's a bit of a summary here.

https://www.whitecase.com/publications/alert/what-...

Please don't come back to me about origin rules either.

I'm out.

[Olivergt]

21st Century Man said:

robinessex said:

Foreign VAT off, UK vat on. No import duty. Does that sum it up correctly?

Yes, and some carriers are taking the piss with fees for clearing it for you, though this can be avoided. I've had a number of parcels from Japan and I pay what's due to hmrc, but not FedEx's £12 fee which I get waived when I query it (theres lot's about that on the internet). Other carriers have had no such fee, just the duty/vat for hmrc.

Not to Ireland, some items are subject to Customs duty, for example cars at 10%.

And S/H goods cannot have the VAT removed before shipping. So any S/H goods entering the UK will be subject to UK VAT and any S/H goods from the UK will be subject to the destination VAT.

So S/H cars from UK to Ireland will be subject to:

+10% Customs duty.
+21% VAT (I believe this is charged on the Customs duty value as well!)
+ VRT (this is Vehicle Registration Tax when importing a car to Ireland). This is based on the Age and CO2 of the car, €750? minimum.

[thebraketester]

Stegel said:

thebraketester said:

Stu_g87 said:

thebraketester said:

Also what about website like autodoc?

I ordered some parts from them the other week, and after some delay I ended up cancelling after being told that they have "temporarily suspended all shipments to the uk".

Bugger.

I placed an order with Autodoc on the 18th Jan and expected a similar message judging by a few things I’d read elsewhere. However, it was collected by GLS on Monday (25th) and the tracking displays the normal “underway” it usually does. Last year I’d expect delivery at the end of this week or early next, so we will see what the new normal means for the haul from Germany.

Cool... keep us posted. The items I need represent a huge discount via them (oem quality lemforder) vs OEM (vw)

[Olivergt]

The one thing that all the comments in this thread highlight is the fact that import/export in/out of the UK is a bit of a mess at the minute.

[james_zy]

thebraketester said:

Stegel said:

thebraketester said:

Stu_g87 said:

thebraketester said:

Also what about website like autodoc?

I ordered some parts from them the other week, and after some delay I ended up cancelling after being told that they have "temporarily suspended all shipments to the uk".

Bugger.

I placed an order with Autodoc on the 18th Jan and expected a similar message judging by a few things I’d read elsewhere. However, it was collected by GLS on Monday (25th) and the tracking displays the normal “underway” it usually does. Last year I’d expect delivery at the end of this week or early next, so we will see what the new normal means for the haul from Germany.

Cool... keep us posted. The items I need represent a huge discount via them (oem quality lemforder) vs OEM (vw)

I ordered mine on the 28th December. Collected by GLS on 5th Jan. Sat in Großbeeren from 5th Jan to 22nd, until which time it moved to Neuenstein. Left Neunenstein on the 27th and arrived at UK a few hours later. Delivered on the 28th.

I can confirm there was no customs charge or anything. I feel there has been a lot of misinformation on this - the VAT just needs to be paid by the retailer (which it was at 20% by AutoDoc in my case). There is no additional levy or anything, unless you have bought fags/booze which attracts excise.

[Olivergt]

james_zy said:

I ordered mine on the 28th December. Collected by GLS on 5th Jan. Sat in Großbeeren from 5th Jan to 22nd, until which time it moved to Neuenstein. Left Neunenstein on the 27th and arrived at UK a few hours later. Delivered on the 28th.

I can confirm there was no customs charge or anything. I feel there has been a lot of misinformation on this - the VAT just needs to be paid by the retailer (which it was at 20% by AutoDoc in my case). There is no additional levy or anything, unless you have bought fags/booze which attracts excise.

The fact that you ordered and probably paid on the 28th December is why you weren't charged any extra. The UK was still in the EU then.

Have you tried doing the same quote on Autodoc since the UK left? Would be interested to find out how you get on.

[jabloko99]

"For example, a £200 coat bought from a German website could attract 12% or £24 customs duty. VAT at 20% is then applied to the total of £224, giving a VAT bill of £44.80. Once the courier has added its £11.50 admin fee, the UK consumer must pay £80.30 to the courier on the doorstep before it will hand over the item – adding around 40% to the coat’s price."


https://www.theguardian.com/money/2...s-the-import...

[CharlieAlphaMike]

Equally, there are plenty of individuals and businesses who have and will stop buying from the UK. 'Divorcing' our biggest trading partner was a huge mistake. But hey, at least we'll all have blue passports and we'll be able to make our own rules now etc etc...

[robinessex]

jabloko99 said:

"For example, a £200 coat bought from a German website could attract 12% or £24 customs duty. VAT at 20% is then applied to the total of £224, giving a VAT bill of £44.80. Once the courier has added its £11.50 admin fee, the UK consumer must pay £80.30 to the courier on the doorstep before it will hand over the item – adding around 40% to the coat’s price."


https://www.theguardian.com/money/2...s-the-import...

Would it have had 12% customs duty before we left the EU added, and is the £200 purchase cost inclusive of German VAT (19%), which should be deducted if it is? The £11.50 admin fee is a blatant rip-off.

[idealstandard]

21st Century Man said:

This is how I'm understanding it, it's not so much the duty/vat issues as there shouldn't be any duty and it should be vat off/vat on, which more or less cancels out. Is it the carriers seizing an opportunity to extort? I never pay FedEx's £12 clearance fee (last year they wanted £127 for a small envelope of plastic clips due to an error, which did get resolved easily enough when queried though).

Sorry for the late response.

Yes basically this is it. So from our perspective we are having to send all our goods to private clients via DDP (deliver duties paid)

DHL charges are: £16.00 clearing fee, £5.50 brexit surcharge, 5% of the VAT as a service fee on top of the local VAT. Plus tariff. So an extra charge of about £21 (plus the 5% of the VAT fee as well) on every parcel into Europe. That, coupled with wholesale abandonment by European customers due to the transit times is giving us a real headache.

If a sender sends you a parcel on a "DAP" basis (duties/vat to be paid "delivered at place"), then you will be charged the local VAT where you are for the value of the goods, plus whatever handling fee the carrier decides to charge. These fees for end users are typically around £11-20 regardless of carrier.. We have just moved out european stuff to DPD as they are fairer, at "only" £6.50 for their DDP fee but their clearing process is even slower.

Putting it into perspective of how much money these guys are creaming in, DPD handle circa 350,000 parcels a night into Europe ex UK, or did before 2021 anyway. They're now charging £6.50 extra on top of the standard tariff per parcel per night.

So...if you are buying from europe - make sure to check your supplier is using Delivered Duties Paid. They will likely be charging you their local VAT on the sale price, so if they are sending it anything other than DDP, they're pulling the wool over your eyes. Hope this helps. We're still getting our heads around it and we're quite a decent size B2C operator.

Alex

Edited by idealstandard on Friday 29th January 09:46

Edited by idealstandard on Friday 29th January 09:46

[21st Century Man]

jabloko99 said:

"For example, a £200 coat bought from a German website could attract 12% or £24 customs duty. VAT at 20% is then applied to the total of £224, giving a VAT bill of £44.80. Once the courier has added its £11.50 admin fee, the UK consumer must pay £80.30 to the courier on the doorstep before it will hand over the item – adding around 40% to the coat’s price."


https://www.theguardian.com/money/2...s-the-import...

I said I was out of this debate but I'm coming back in on this as I've learnt so much over the last few days on the subject.

The above scenario assumes that as the UK is now out of the EU, the UKGT now applies to goods from the EU in the same way that it applies to goods from the RoW. The article even links to the Gov website for the UKGT and one can check the tariff/duty for various goods, eg clothing 12%, shoes 16%. However the UKGT only applies in the absence of a trade deal and is replaced by the terms of a trade deal if one is in place. The UK-EU FTA is zero quota/zero tariff, it voids the UKGT. The linked gov UKGT website references this and provides further links to the various trade deals in place with RoW and the tariff/duty due under the various agreements. The UK-EU being zero tariff/duty. The Guardian journalist neglects to mention this.

There are exceptions, rules of origin for example, so the Guardian journalist could be assuming that the coat breaches rules of origin (but again is neglecting to mention this). Whereby say, Chinese goods from China could be brought in via the EU to avoid the UKGT under the terms of the UK-EU FTA, rules of origin close off that loophole and brings us to the subject of bonded warehouses and free ports.

With the Guardian example, one also has to assume that the vat was not removed from the price of the coat in Germany, otherwise what difference does it make? It's not an additional cost. I feel like a stuck record, there is no import duty (exceptions accepted) and it's vat off/vat on. They're right about the admin fee though.

I also found a nifty bang up to date import duty calculator on the simply duty website which takes account of UKGT and the various trade deal tariffs around the world on a commodity/country basis. Stick almost anything in from an EU country and it comes up with a zero, change countries and it applies the relevant import duty.

[21st Century Man]

idealstandard said:

21st Century Man said:

This is how I'm understanding it, it's not so much the duty/vat issues as there shouldn't be any duty and it should be vat off/vat on, which more or less cancels out. Is it the carriers seizing an opportunity to extort? I never pay FedEx's £12 clearance fee (last year they wanted £127 for a small envelope of plastic clips due to an error, which did get resolved easily enough when queried though).

Sorry for the late response.

Yes basically this is it. So from our perspective we are having to send all our goods to private clients via DDP (deliver duties paid)

DHL charges are: £16.00 clearing fee, £5.50 brexit surcharge, 5% of the VAT as a service fee on top of the local VAT. Plus tariff. So an extra charge of about £21 (plus the 5% of the VAT fee as well) on every parcel into Europe. That, coupled with wholesale abandonment by European customers due to the transit times is giving us a real headache.

If a sender sends you a parcel on a "DAP" basis (duties/vat to be paid "delivered at place"), then you will be charged the local VAT where you are for the value of the goods, plus whatever handling fee the carrier decides to charge. These fees for end users are typically around £11-20 regardless of carrier.. We have just moved out european stuff to DPD as they are fairer, at "only" £6.50 for their DDP fee but their clearing process is even slower.

Putting it into perspective of how much money these guys are creaming in, DPD handle circa 350,000 parcels a night into Europe ex UK, or did before 2021 anyway. They're now charging £6.50 extra on top of the standard tariff per parcel per night.

So...if you are buying from europe - make sure to check your supplier is using Delivered Duties Paid. They will likely be charging you their local VAT on the sale price, so if they are sending it anything other than DDP, they're pulling the wool over your eyes. Hope this helps. We're still getting our heads around it and we're quite a decent size B2C operator.

Alex

Thanks for coming back to me.

I have a very good friend also in B2C, says much the same.

Bon Courage!

[parabolica]

james_zy said:

mmm-five said:

thebraketester said:

Also what about website like autodoc?

Autodoc are registered for UK VAT though (AUTODOC GMBH's VAT Number is GB206461432), so other than the logistics nightmare we're currently in, the price should be with UK VAT charged instead of German VAT.

Will be interested to see what happens with my AutoDoc order (there is a parallel thread to this which I started for others experiencing delays).

I ordered £200 of parts from them on the 28th December 2020, and they charged me 20% VAT on the order at the outset. I think they always have done if I am not mistaken.

Will be interesting to see what happens with regards to any additional customs duty (which I'm not expecting to be honest). Order reached UK shores this morning, so wait hopefully won't be long

As per the autodoc thread i ordered from them on Jan 4th and the parts arrived on the 19th. The tracking didn’t update until the morning of the 19th and about 1 hour before the parts arrived at my door.

[jamoor]

idealstandard said:

Sorry for the late response.

Yes basically this is it. So from our perspective we are having to send all our goods to private clients via DDP (deliver duties paid)

DHL charges are: £16.00 clearing fee, £5.50 brexit surcharge, 5% of the VAT as a service fee on top of the local VAT. Plus tariff. So an extra charge of about £21 (plus the 5% of the VAT fee as well) on every parcel into Europe. That, coupled with wholesale abandonment by European customers due to the transit times is giving us a real headache.

If a sender sends you a parcel on a "DAP" basis (duties/vat to be paid "delivered at place"), then you will be charged the local VAT where you are for the value of the goods, plus whatever handling fee the carrier decides to charge. These fees for end users are typically around £11-20 regardless of carrier.. We have just moved out european stuff to DPD as they are fairer, at "only" £6.50 for their DDP fee but their clearing process is even slower.

Putting it into perspective of how much money these guys are creaming in, DPD handle circa 350,000 parcels a night into Europe ex UK, or did before 2021 anyway. They're now charging £6.50 extra on top of the standard tariff per parcel per night.

So...if you are buying from europe - make sure to check your supplier is using Delivered Duties Paid. They will likely be charging you their local VAT on the sale price, so if they are sending it anything other than DDP, they're pulling the wool over your eyes. Hope this helps. We're still getting our heads around it and we're quite a decent size B2C operator.

Alex

Edited by idealstandard on Friday 29th January 09:46

Edited by idealstandard on Friday 29th January 09:46

The best part of the whole thing is that companies will probbably not be interested in entering the market due to the palaver and would rather just stick to the rest of the EU.

They really have us over a barrel.

[idealstandard]

jamoor said:

The best part of the whole thing is that companies will probbably not be interested in entering the market due to the palaver and would rather just stick to the rest of the EU.

They really have us over a barrel.

but, but, but, £300m to the NHS and we can fish as much fish we want (even if noone wants to buy it any more as all the customers are Spanish anyway). but but!

[spareparts]

I bought a 30 year old motorbike from Germany in December 2020. Fully paid for with proof of payment received by the seller.

The delivery company (a reputable UK company) are holding it at the EU storage facilities, and they have advised me that 5% VAT is now due on it.

Can anyone confirm if this is correct? I can see nothing online from the gov.uk website that affirms these are the new rules?

[21st Century Man]

spareparts said:

I bought a 30 year old motorbike from Germany in December 2020. Fully paid for with proof of payment received by the seller.

The delivery company (a reputable UK company) are holding it at the EU storage facilities, and they have advised me that 5% VAT is now due on it.

I'm pretty sure that second hand goods are subject to import duty and vat, although I'm not 100% on that, I read something in the UK-EU FTA that suggested used items were subject to the same zero duty tariff as new, which makes sense. If that's the case you dodge the import duty but you've still got the vat to pay. Best check with hmrc directly.

If it's not yet been imported physically into the UK yet, my understanding was that used vehicles/parts would be subject to 10% import duty on top of the cost of the bike and the shipping cost, then 20% vat on top of that. This has been the case with my car/parts from Japan.

5% doesn't seem to fit in with anything, duty or vat, pre or post.

Edited by 21st Century Man on Friday 29th January 12:20

[21st Century Man]

idealstandard said:

jamoor said:

The best part of the whole thing is that companies will probbably not be interested in entering the market due to the palaver and would rather just stick to the rest of the EU.

They really have us over a barrel.

but, but, but, £300m to the NHS and we can fish as much fish we want (even if noone wants to buy it any more as all the customers are Spanish anyway). but but!

If they've only ever traded within the EU, I can see that might be the case, but if they already trade with the RoW, then it shouldn't.

Also consider that the vat was previously paid in the EU member State and stayed in the EU member State. Now it's sent to, or is paid in, the UK.

[airbusA346]

robinessex said:

Foreign VAT off, UK vat on. No import duty. Does that sum it up correctly?

From what I have read regarding the import duty, it depends on where the goods originated from.

For example I got an email yesterday warning people that if they order Diecast models from Europe that they will incur import duty because the models are made in China and not the EU.