Run a car to end of its life
Discussion
2002 and Vikingette1 was on the way. Everyone was buying EmmPeeVees. We tried the babyseat and it wouldn't fit our brand new R50 MINI Cooper, Porsche 968 Sport, and it had to be forced past the folding front seat of our Saab 900 Turbo Coupe. Something had to give and it was the R50 Cooper as despite having it for a year, we were offered £500 more than we paid for it by a MINI dealer, such was the demand for them.
Along came a brand new 2002 Vauxhall Zafira 1.8 Elegance Automatic in Angry Dad Silver which we still have. It seemed to have been a cancelled order as it had an amazing spec which wasn't mentioned on the order sheet - 16 inch alloys
, winter pack of heated seats & headlamp washers, and the boot had acrylic headlamp protectors for UK and Euro, carpet mats and floor mats, 4 mudflaps, a dog guard etc. We used it for 7 years and it was brilliant. You could change Vikingette1 on the fold flat front passenger seat.
After 7 years I decided on a diesel Mazda 5 and my Mum asked if she could buy it to transport some old biddies around at her charity. I think it was worth £2.5k, so I said no, just use it. I still taxed, MOTed, insured, vacuumed and washed and waxed it each week
3 years ago my Mum said I could have the Zafira back as there were no longer that many old biddies left to transport around. The condition of the car is amazing inside and out. If it wasn't for the dated styling you would think it was a new car - a testament to my many hundreds of hours cleaning and waxing it.
Along came a brand new 2002 Vauxhall Zafira 1.8 Elegance Automatic in Angry Dad Silver which we still have. It seemed to have been a cancelled order as it had an amazing spec which wasn't mentioned on the order sheet - 16 inch alloys
, winter pack of heated seats & headlamp washers, and the boot had acrylic headlamp protectors for UK and Euro, carpet mats and floor mats, 4 mudflaps, a dog guard etc. We used it for 7 years and it was brilliant. You could change Vikingette1 on the fold flat front passenger seat.After 7 years I decided on a diesel Mazda 5 and my Mum asked if she could buy it to transport some old biddies around at her charity. I think it was worth £2.5k, so I said no, just use it. I still taxed, MOTed, insured, vacuumed and washed and waxed it each week
3 years ago my Mum said I could have the Zafira back as there were no longer that many old biddies left to transport around. The condition of the car is amazing inside and out. If it wasn't for the dated styling you would think it was a new car - a testament to my many hundreds of hours cleaning and waxing it.
Because I'm at the older end of the spectrum here unfortunately I think back to some of the issues that we used to encounter back in the day keeping a car long term. If a mainstream car got anywhere near 100,000 miles you wouldn't go near it no matter how much service history had because it was as good as dead. Rust was an ever present menace,I can remember laughing my grandmother when she was getting splattered with gravel from a newly surfaced road as the only thing holding my grandads Austin 1100 together were the carpets.
Then there was the lack of choice, British Leylands finest, Ford rust buckets and Vauxhalls mixed with the odd Lada were the choice on offer.
Cars of today are a much better proposition for keeping long term and with a bit of home servicing and keeping on top of jobs it's not too difficult to keep a car for 10 years or more providing that you bought it in good condition in the first place.
Then there was the lack of choice, British Leylands finest, Ford rust buckets and Vauxhalls mixed with the odd Lada were the choice on offer.
Cars of today are a much better proposition for keeping long term and with a bit of home servicing and keeping on top of jobs it's not too difficult to keep a car for 10 years or more providing that you bought it in good condition in the first place.
Edited by dunc01965 on Tuesday 2nd March 18:11
I’ve got two 2010 Alfas.
Alfa Giulietta Cloverleaf and Brera TBI. They’re a pleasure to own and drive if a little high-maintenance.
I do about 500-600 miles a month in total. What is the point in having an expensive new motor costing me a fortune in depreciation?
Some of the bills on these two are a little eye watering but it’s still thousands cheaper than running a new car.
I expect to have these two for quite a long time yet.
Alfa Giulietta Cloverleaf and Brera TBI. They’re a pleasure to own and drive if a little high-maintenance.
I do about 500-600 miles a month in total. What is the point in having an expensive new motor costing me a fortune in depreciation?
Some of the bills on these two are a little eye watering but it’s still thousands cheaper than running a new car.
I expect to have these two for quite a long time yet.
Maybe not the very end, but for a long time, more so than previously. However, the best bets for this policy are simple vehicles. The former rust problem is far less serious; from part time trade experience I can confirm the cliche that electronic failures cause the most premature scrapping. Most modern cars will last a long time, if serviced and kept clean underneath.A top notch specialist will help to keep the posh stuff going a little longer, but 1) There a lot of amateurs out there with laptops who don’t really know what they are doing and 2) If it was expensive to run new, it will be expensive to run old.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
By ridiculously placed, do you mean inside the bell housing? It seems quite a few vehicles now place the clutch slave at this point. but as for the rest of your description that is pretty much my position too, except that my daily driver is approaching 200 000 miles, and `everything' works as well as as when it was brand new. with only service items having been renewed at the appropriate intervals.My discovery 3 could fall into this bracket as well.
It’s an early 54 plate, has 203,924 miles on the clock, last year it went in for some age and mileage related repairs, which weren’t done properly, some general incompetence left more faults with the car and due to circumstances, it’s currently parked up on SORN.
It’s fate is either scrapped, which I don’t want to do, or save up and do the semi restoration it needs to bring it back to life.
I’ve had it 8 1/2 years and done just over 106,000 miles in it.
With some tlc it should be good for another 100k or so.
It’s an early 54 plate, has 203,924 miles on the clock, last year it went in for some age and mileage related repairs, which weren’t done properly, some general incompetence left more faults with the car and due to circumstances, it’s currently parked up on SORN.
It’s fate is either scrapped, which I don’t want to do, or save up and do the semi restoration it needs to bring it back to life.
I’ve had it 8 1/2 years and done just over 106,000 miles in it.
With some tlc it should be good for another 100k or so.
Dracoro said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
There is however a difference between having a birth rate that the planet can sustain, in line with keeping a balance with the natural world, or doing what we are doing now.
So, how will you define what exactly is "sustainable"? using more or less that what we are using now? Climate (putting aside what is or isn't man made) is ever changing (and has been for the entire history of this planet), so the planet itself doesn't sustain everything. There's plenty of things that lived and died off before humans came along. There isn't a "status-quo" when everything is changing all the time anyway (regardless of human actions).
Pan Pan Pan said:
Or perhaps you do not believe we are destroying natural habitats, like rain forests, or coral reefs, and ocean floor, at unprecedented rates, or losing unique species in those habitats, at unprecedented rates. All to satisfy the colossal, and growing demands for the space, and products required by the global human population? Perhaps Soylent Green might be the answer (for a while at least?)
There's political issues too. We (the western world) have cut down nearly all our trees (the UK was once covered by trees, most fields you see are "man made" - essentially for farming, for humans to grow/eat food) over the past thousands of years to facilitate humans and our development, yet we want to tell those in (for example) Brazil that they can't do the same. Put simply, it's the rich telling the poor, no YOU can't develop as it's not good for the planet, but WE're OK as we've already done it. Ecologically, a solution is required, but so it a political question else humans will rebel (self-preservation)Some things are destroyed yes, and some things are made better.
I don't agree that we just destroy whatever we want with no care whatsoever. We do have to define what does/doesn't get "saved", why, how, for what end goal, what is the repercussions.
Ultimately, the planet will be here long after humans have gone. So the question remains, who (or what) is the planet being saved for? What's the end goal?
Who wants to live on a planet, where the only large species left alive, are humans, and where other species and habitats are only gawked at in zoos, or in books / on computer screens?
WonkeyDonkey said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Neighbour of mine has a 1995 Micra K11 that he bought new, to run until the end of it's life. He's 83 now, car has done nearly 400K miles and it still going strong. He says the car has decided to run him to the end of his life!!
In a sad way i'd love to know what that car has cost him per mile. For a car bought brand new there can't be many ever that have worked out cheaper!I've had my Evoque from new. It's 7 now and about to get its BIG (timing belt) service.
Its probably the car I get asked about the most, so, my experience to date;
https://youtu.be/F_D_AaFQm2Q
Hoping for another 7 years to be honest.
Its probably the car I get asked about the most, so, my experience to date;
https://youtu.be/F_D_AaFQm2Q
Hoping for another 7 years to be honest.
What family car would be suitable to buy NOW new, and then keep say 10-15 years? I love the idea of doing that, but fear the speed of EV progress makes it somehow a bit pointless now... Or just get an efficient petrol estate (or SUV?), knowing we'll still be able to buy petrol in 2030+
Think its an age thing, when I was younger I always wanted something faster, better than my escort 1.3L. Now I can afford something fast and smart I feel no need to upgrade every couple of years. I have had my 911 for 13 years now and I am driving it until it dies or crashes. Also having had company cars, I was used to chucking away cars every 3 years, so buying a car older than 3 years old to me is like buying an older scrapper, they have no value to me. I would rather buy new and keep, I don't like the thought of buying someone's worn out car, its like second hand shoes urgh.
Earthdweller said:
I bought my X3 new in 2015
Normally id change every three or four years but a couple of things made me decide to keep it
Firstly, it’s brilliant at what it does and fits our needs perfectly and the obvious replacement would be another one. I just can’t bring myself to lay out another 20-30k to continue driving something essentially the same but newer.
As it approaches six years old it’s got 64k on the clock and is like a new ( ish ) car inside and out and when not being used sits in the garage
It’s now essentially a free car as it’s paid for ... so for now it stays the intention being long term
Secondly, technology is changing so fast and the options are continually improving that it seems sensible to wait out to as close as 2030 as possible before jumping into a replacement, at which point the X3 will be 15 years old
Therefore I sit and wait and see what happens in the world of cars and taxation ... and well of course because of Covid it’s hardly getting worn out
I'm in a similar position to Earthdweller, having bought our Volvo XC90 new in 2010. Normally id change every three or four years but a couple of things made me decide to keep it
Firstly, it’s brilliant at what it does and fits our needs perfectly and the obvious replacement would be another one. I just can’t bring myself to lay out another 20-30k to continue driving something essentially the same but newer.
As it approaches six years old it’s got 64k on the clock and is like a new ( ish ) car inside and out and when not being used sits in the garage
It’s now essentially a free car as it’s paid for ... so for now it stays the intention being long term
Secondly, technology is changing so fast and the options are continually improving that it seems sensible to wait out to as close as 2030 as possible before jumping into a replacement, at which point the X3 will be 15 years old
Therefore I sit and wait and see what happens in the world of cars and taxation ... and well of course because of Covid it’s hardly getting worn out
Our third child had just been born and today it still fits our needs as a family wagon perfectly. It doesn't have the luxury of sitting in a garage but has survived the passing years in remarkably good shape apart from the occasional cosmetic dings and scratches inevitable from life in London. Any replacement would demand significant expenditure on something that would do the same job little better or with the uncertainty associated with a used purchase: there's great comfort to be taken from knowing the history of our car and the fact that we were lucky and got a reliable one!
Regarding technology, I agree that the rate of change encourages me to just keep the XC90 for the next few years until things settle down and battery tech and charger availability improve. We live inside the ULEZ zone so that charge is an extra cost but since we bought a five years old Hyundai i10 for the older sprogs to learn in, we will use that for shorter journeys and save the XC90 for dump trips and longer journeys and just pay the £12 charge each time.
JD82 said:
What family car would be suitable to buy NOW new, and then keep say 10-15 years? I love the idea of doing that, but fear the speed of EV progress makes it somehow a bit pointless now... Or just get an efficient petrol estate (or SUV?), knowing we'll still be able to buy petrol in 2030+
That is pretty much my train of thought, and to try to keep my current daily driver going until whatever is deemed best, for the future has been decided would be nice, (but not necessarily possible).The car also has some sentimental value to me, which is why I would like to keep it / keep it going as long as possible. What I may have to do is just replace it with another younger ICE vehicle before switching to whatever come next, but whether that would be a more expensive option has yet to be determined. My current daily driver has also made it possible to have my high day and holiday cars, which is another reason why I rate it so much.
JD82 said:
What family car would be suitable to buy NOW new, and then keep say 10-15 years? I love the idea of doing that, but fear the speed of EV progress makes it somehow a bit pointless now... Or just get an efficient petrol estate (or SUV?), knowing we'll still be able to buy petrol in 2030+
Your dilemma is understandable. For the reasons you list I honestly think there is no point buying a new family car now. Probably best to get something like a used Skoda Superb estate 1.5tsi or, if you want more fun, a Ford Focus estate 1.5T.
Well, the Allroad has come back from a major service today with a totally clean bill of health (although i need to keep an eye on the rear brake callipers at they are rusting. Some mild corrosion underneath, but nothing to worry about. Cost of service £200 all in (it helps to know an Audi Master Tech)
The CR-V is booked in later this month for front springs, front/rear links and a CV boot kit. £350, which is a worthwhile spend. The aircon is on the blink as well, which will no doubt be a perished hose at the most inaccessible point of the system.
They soldier on!!
The CR-V is booked in later this month for front springs, front/rear links and a CV boot kit. £350, which is a worthwhile spend. The aircon is on the blink as well, which will no doubt be a perished hose at the most inaccessible point of the system.
They soldier on!!
colin86 said:
Was thinking today does anyone buy a new/nearly new car and run it till the end of its life ?
In the process of doing that 
Bought our M140i new in 2019. Committing to keeping it 10+ years but in reality if we keep it that long, we'll keep it for the duration.
Our other two cars are both 15 years old and even the "runabout" one looks set to last many years yet (the other is a weekend car).
Both the 15 year old cars have ran impeccably in the year we've owned them needing only standard wear and tear maintenance when bought. Hard to think the M140i wont be the same.
Not usually...but my current car a 2017 Pro'ceed GT has proved stubbornly difficult to sell, its a really good car and has a hell of a lot of life left in it so I'am thinking keeping it long term to get my money's worth from it.
The seven year Kia warranty is a nice cushion to fall back on if anything serious crops up.
The seven year Kia warranty is a nice cushion to fall back on if anything serious crops up.
Like the stories of the “cockroach” Micras that refuse to give up and was wondering if the Up! and variants could be the modern equivalent...?
Owened my 2013 Mii since new. Only repair in that time is a replacement pax airbag switch. They are so simple there’s nothing to go wrong with them.
Briefly considered selling it during first lockdown but after doing the sums decided not to bother. Over its lifetime it’s worked out cheaper than getting the bus to work. May as well keep it till it dies...
Owened my 2013 Mii since new. Only repair in that time is a replacement pax airbag switch. They are so simple there’s nothing to go wrong with them.
Briefly considered selling it during first lockdown but after doing the sums decided not to bother. Over its lifetime it’s worked out cheaper than getting the bus to work. May as well keep it till it dies...
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