RE: Megane 275 Cup-S vs. Honda Civic Type R (FK8)

[popeyewhite]

Gilhooligan said:

MiseryStreak said:

popeyewhite said:

Turbojuice said:

Could've just said that instead of flexing

Excuse me?

It’s <25 speak for having a bit of a strop, or getting your panties in a twist.

Nah it means showing off.

Nah I think it's immature speak, otherwise this chap is showing off as well [above, this page]

Speed Badger said:

I have had a Renault 5 GT Turbo, Clio 172, 182, 200, Megane R26, 250, 265, Civic Type R EP3, FN2, FD2, FK2 & FK8 ...

Strikes me a bit odd that listing some past cars owned to illustrate a point on a car forum is 'showing off', but it's a different crowd on here now... .

[Haltamer]

macky17 said:

I know what you mean about the civic feeling almost too planted and battering the road into submission. It isn't as playful or up on its toes as a megane, or a fiesta ST for that matter.

I'd say this is true, but is largely dependent on tyres. The standard Conti6s and Cup2s have a very neutral balance that will allow you to pop the tail out on command (Or if you're not being careful) - Perfect for adding a bit of flourish to a deserted roundabout. - If you opt for softer sidewall PS4S as most do, the handling gets a bit more bland.

That being said, if you drive the car properly and lean on the LSD to pull you through, keeping the weight settled, it is very much a grip monster.

[havoc]

kalniel said:

havoc said:

- Why do road cars KEEP getting stiffer? Especially a hot-hatch, which SHOULD excel on a bumpy B-road (as outside of an Elise, what else will nowadays?) The FK8 sounds like the first retrograde step here, which is good to hear...but still...

- Why do road cars KEEP getting wider? (See below) Same principle - B-road fun. Is that not allowed anymore? Are we supposed to be good consumers/citizens and spend hundreds on a (warranty-destroying) trackday every time we want some fun?

The simple part of the answer is the UK is small fry (and driving enthusiasts even smaller again). Cars are designed for a much larger market and it doesn't make enough economical sense to do too much tailoring for us.

And our roads are unique?!? Hardly...

[Speed Badger]

popeyewhite said:

Gilhooligan said:

MiseryStreak said:

popeyewhite said:

Turbojuice said:

Could've just said that instead of flexing

Excuse me?

It’s <25 speak for having a bit of a strop, or getting your panties in a twist.

Nah it means showing off.

Nah I think it's immature speak, otherwise this chap is showing off as well [above, this page]

Speed Badger said:

I have had a Renault 5 GT Turbo, Clio 172, 182, 200, Megane R26, 250, 265, Civic Type R EP3, FN2, FD2, FK2 & FK8 ...

Strikes me a bit odd that listing some past cars owned to illustrate a point on a car forum is 'showing off', but it's a different crowd on here now... .

I wasn't showing off, I was just illustrating that I have had many of the RenaultSport and Type R models and can provide a good frame of reference as to how the FK8 compares.

As another poster asked, I have also had two DC2's and two DC5 Integras - I didn't list them as I considered them more sports coupés than hot hatches. Now that's showing off (if indeed one can show off by owning mostly sub £10k French/ Japanese hot hatches!) Anyway, all good fun and the FK8 never stops looking ludicrous. Although you do tend to forget what it looks like on the outside when you've been driving it a bit, so you end up with the power of ignorance if you can't get on with the looks.

[havoc]

Speed Badger said:

I have had a Renault 5 GT Turbo, Clio 172, 182, 200, Megane R26, 250, 265, Civic Type R EP3, FN2, FD2, FK2 & FK8

I wasn't showing off, I was just illustrating that I have had many of the RenaultSport and Type R models and can provide a good frame of reference as to how the FK8 compares.

Speed Badger said:

As another poster asked, I have also had two DC2's and two DC5 Integras

So, of all that list, which are your top-3 for 'fun' - for the most engaging, involving, hair-stand-up-on-your-neck smile-inducing drives?

...and which as all-rounders - stuff you'd be happy to commute in as well as take to Wales, take to the 'ring, etc. etc...

[Ben Lowden]

havoc said:

So, of all that list, which are your top-3 for 'fun' - for the most engaging, involving, hair-stand-up-on-your-neck smile-inducing drives?

...and which as all-rounders - stuff you'd be happy to commute in as well as take to Wales, take to the 'ring, etc. etc...

I'm keen to know too. As at the end of the day, no matter how good a hot hatch is, it's still a hatchback. I was much more comfortable driving my Clio Trophy fast than I was my Elise 111S, but the Elise just felt so damn special. I'm quite tempted by a DC5 Integra - do they feel special in a way that a hot hatch can't?

[popeyewhite]

Speed Badger said:

I wasn't showing off

Yeah, I know

[Koolkat969]

Ben Lowden said:

I'm keen to know too. As at the end of the day, no matter how good a hot hatch is, it's still a hatchback. I was much more comfortable driving my Clio Trophy fast than I was my Elise 111S, but the Elise just felt so damn special.

Exactly my thoughts this week from switching cars. It's just a completely different experience between a sports car and a hatchback even where they match performance.....just can't replicate one in the other as they're completely different platforms.

Thanks for confirming my thoughts

[SidewaysSi]

Koolkat969 said:

Ben Lowden said:

I'm keen to know too. As at the end of the day, no matter how good a hot hatch is, it's still a hatchback. I was much more comfortable driving my Clio Trophy fast than I was my Elise 111S, but the Elise just felt so damn special.

Exactly my thoughts this week from switching cars. It's just a completely different experience between a sports car and a hatchback even where they match performance.....just can't replicate one in the other as they're completely different platforms.

Thanks for confirming my thoughts

And an Elise is hugely dependent in setup to give confidence in all conditions...says the man who is about to spend a load of cash on custom dampers for his Lotus.

[Speed Badger]

havoc said:

Speed Badger said:

I have had a Renault 5 GT Turbo, Clio 172, 182, 200, Megane R26, 250, 265, Civic Type R EP3, FN2, FD2, FK2 & FK8

I wasn't showing off, I was just illustrating that I have had many of the RenaultSport and Type R models and can provide a good frame of reference as to how the FK8 compares.

Speed Badger said:

As another poster asked, I have also had two DC2's and two DC5 Integras

So, of all that list, which are your top-3 for 'fun' - for the most engaging, involving, hair-stand-up-on-your-neck smile-inducing drives?

...and which as all-rounders - stuff you'd be happy to commute in as well as take to Wales, take to the 'ring, etc. etc...

Most Fun
1. Clio 182
2. Integra DC5
=3. FK8 in +R mode
=3. FD2 Type R

All rounder as a practical, comfortable proposition that can still do the fun stuff
1. FK8 Type R
2. Megane 265
3. Megane R26

The DC2 is great, but while it gives you rawer thrills and the VTEC crossover is more pronounced, the DC5 is the better car in terms of overall performance and better brakes, plus it's probably the best looking car on the list. My Megane R26 was re-mapped to around 270 bhp which makes all the difference, I was surprised how much I enjoyed it and was spacious and practical. The FD2 revving to 9k rpm is nuts and does tingle the spine a bit, but it also breaks it too with the hugely stiff suspension.

The Clio 182 is the car I jumped in to go for a blast the most out of every car I've owned probably, I only sold it during lockdown as I was barely using the Type R and the Clio was just sat there. The driving position is too high, but if you slide your seat back and hunker down a bit it's ok, but I defy anyone to drive a 182 and be left cold and bored, it's the most fun you can have for the lowest amount of money (although prices on the up now).

The Megane 265 is also an excellent car, mine was a 2015 facelift and the infotainment was decent, I had electric heated seats sports seats in mine which were well bolstered and comfortable. The boot was a good size, (although the aperture was a bit small) and had enough room for the child seat and bits and bobs. To drive it actually felt quite similar to the FK2 Type R, but a shade better in a few departments such as throttle response and just a bit more lively around corners. The gearshift wasn't too French, although the placement of the 'RS mode' button, hidden on the dash behind your steering wheel to the right hand side, most definitely was. When you put it in sport mode it gives you a few extra horses and more pops & bangs, but subtly so, and if you have the RS monitor you can change the throttle mapping. I would definitely have a Megane 265/275 again if necessary, it would be my first port of call if I wanted an FK8 but couldn't afford one, or didn't want to spend that much money.

Edited by Speed Badger on Friday 28th May 16:17

[framerateuk]

I absolutely loved my Megane 250 Cup.

The back end might have well been on tiny little casters, it was so controllable on the throttle, you can tighten up the rear or send it sliding out with the slightest adjustment of throttle. It was all about the front end and that diff for me. I can't imagine having the non-cup, but then it's not something you notice as much on the road - but on a track it's night and day.

Mine thankfully had the RS Monitor so I could adjust the throttle modes. The default sport setting was far too jumpy - linear was perfect.

I replace it with a Clio 220 Trophy - which was a lovely little car, but I just didn't get along with the gearbox (not particular that gearbox really, but I just don't think DCT's are for me!).

I have a 280 Cup now. It's very similar to the 250 in a lot of ways, but the grip levels are higher. It's hard to compare directly though as it's been a long time since I've been in a MK3 (I also have the dog in it with me most of the time so driving hard isn't an option!).

[Ben Lowden]

Speed Badger said:

Most Fun
1. Clio 182
2. Integra DC5
=3. FK8 in +R mode
=3. FD2 Type R

Good to know. Time to get another Clio then...

[bigmowley]

I’ve just got home from a track day at Castle Combe. I did it in my Cayman R and in my 275Cup S. Two of the finest chassis of the last 20 years or so. I had an absolute blast
I have had the Meg from new and it hardly got used last year due to Covid. I was on the brink of selling it as a result. So glad I didn’t. It was outrageously good on track. I had forgotten what a brilliant chassis it really is. Its so intuitive and beautifully mobile, shuffling from oversteer to understeer on demand, it is amazing.
The Cayman R is a brilliant car too and hoping from one to the other is such fun. I think by the narrowest of margins the Meg wins the fun factor but it’s oh so close. Happy times.

[havoc]

Koolkat969 said:

Ben Lowden said:

I'm keen to know too. As at the end of the day, no matter how good a hot hatch is, it's still a hatchback. I was much more comfortable driving my Clio Trophy fast than I was my Elise 111S, but the Elise just felt so damn special.

Exactly my thoughts this week from switching cars. It's just a completely different experience between a sports car and a hatchback even where they match performance.....just can't replicate one in the other as they're completely different platforms.

Thanks for confirming my thoughts

Agree with all of that...the NSX isn't as biddable as the FD2, nor as raw, frenetic and zero-slack immediate. But it's just such a lovely thing to drive, so well balanced and so fluid in what it does. And it looks and sounds a step above...the view forwards framed by two yellow wheelarches is just pure theatre...

[Str6mik]

bigmowley said:

I’ve just got home from a track day at Castle Combe. I did it in my Cayman R and in my 275Cup S. Two of the finest chassis of the last 20 years or so. I had an absolute blast
I have had the Meg from new and it hardly got used last year due to Covid. I was on the brink of selling it as a result. So glad I didn’t. It was outrageously good on track. I had forgotten what a brilliant chassis it really is. Its so intuitive and beautifully mobile, shuffling from oversteer to understeer on demand, it is amazing.
The Cayman R is a brilliant car too and hoping from one to the other is such fun. I think by the narrowest of margins the Meg wins the fun factor but it’s oh so close. Happy times.

Really interesting post. As mentioned above I have a 987 boxster spyder and a Megane rs265 which replaced an fk8 type r

What you post above, I would have considered sacrilege if I too didn’t own both cars

I think the Megane is more fun on road and track than the spyder. There I said it too.

The meg is my track car but it’s the car I always take for that blast to the shops, or just for giggles.

I love both of them. But I love the Megane more. I’ve never driven a car that is more of an oxymoron - it feels exciting and alive to drive, but at the same time always on your side and so easy to manage it’s movements. It’s like it’s movements are choreographed but in a totally organic way.

Both cars aren’t std - spyder has 200 cell cats manifolds and back box. The meg straight through and hybrid turbo. The meg is a 4 banger with a farty sound at start up. Now this is sacrilege - the engine in the meg makes me laugh out loud it’s that characterful.

I was always obsessed with rwd - but again confession time I think I find a powerful fwd more exciting. Managing the traction on the power, getting the weight over the nose, turning on the brakes and then managing the power theough the diff. It’s old school 911 in reverse - and the feeling at least in my meg is very pronounced - more so than in the spyder.

The spyder has pride of place in the single garage but I’m increasingly tempted to swap the spyder with the meg. I love it that much.

[Zarco]

havoc said:

Agree with all of that...the NSX isn't as biddable as the FD2, nor as raw, frenetic and zero-slack immediate. But it's just such a lovely thing to drive, so well balanced and so fluid in what it does. And it looks and sounds a step above...the view forwards framed by two yellow wheelarches is just pure theatre...

Props for owning an NSX

[Dblue]

Gilhooligan said:

davidif said:

Stevie_c said:

I'd have the Megane every time!

I'd have the Civic every time!

I want to like the Civic but it’s too ugly. I think the mk3 Megane nailed the sporty/ body kit look without going too over the top.

Its subjective, the looks, but I genuinely get nothing but positive response to my FK8. Much more interest in it than the Megs, which I loved the looks off but the general public not so much.
But objectively its the best "hot hatch" that' you can buy on just about every metric. A proper swiss army knife of a car