Will electric hot hatches be a hit ?
Discussion
otolith said:
DonkeyApple said:
What's unfortunate is that those are three cars which due to their tiny production numbers as well as how they are typically used just aren't part of the global or even local issues but will eventually get caught up in the change while being poster boys for kitten and child murder.
Lightweight, small engine, composites...(gloss over the 30mpg, which is pretty s
t all things considered)
I'd love a proper electric hot hatch and do think they will be the way forward especially for the majority of people.
You don't even have to improve the handling of the current hot hatches just switching too electric should be enough of a jump forward. No more petrol stations and cheaper motoring.
Trying to claim an I3 is a hot hatch is just a bit too much of a stretch for me and does nothing to help EVs.
You don't even have to improve the handling of the current hot hatches just switching too electric should be enough of a jump forward. No more petrol stations and cheaper motoring.
Trying to claim an I3 is a hot hatch is just a bit too much of a stretch for me and does nothing to help EVs.
otolith said:
Leon R said:
Quite.Though what does it drop to if you drive it like an absolute t
t? Because the Elise doesn't really change much...70 mile trip to Hampshire showed I was wrong and I even took a different route home but it was still sitting at 41 when I parked up so I am pleasantly surprised.
Wiltshire Lad said:
100% - which is why they don't work for me - but are absolutely spot on for my father or wife - and a lot of households will have 2 cars - and an EV is perfect as a daily local commute. And even then, it very much depends where your longer trips are to..if you know you re-charge at the destination without hassle (e.g when my parents come down to us) it's not a problem.
What would make sense to me is an urban EV really optimised for urban use with no real compromise made for longer / faster use. Something really light, cruise at 30-40 mph with 60 at a push. 50 mile range, and basic fit so it's cheap. Mave said:
What would make sense to me is an urban EV really optimised for urban use with no real compromise made for longer / faster use. Something really light, cruise at 30-40 mph with 60 at a push. 50 mile range, and basic fit so it's cheap.
I've a friend with a Smart EV for that purpose. I don't think it was particularly inexpensive though. We might see an evolution down the line for low range EVs as people get used to understanding their true daily car usage and want better savings but I suspect that battery costs by that time won't be the kind of drain they have been to date?
Plus, I suspect the general trend of not having a car in the urban environments where such a vehicle would be most popular might well continue.
Our runabout car wouldn't need any more than 50-100 mile range but it's a 2009 120 with 30k on the clock and another ten years of life potentially.
I have contemplated a Twizzy just for giggles a few times but in reality a Vespa is far more logical.
My hot hatch tastes seem rather old fashioned - I really think they should be small and FWD.
I can envisage something like a Zoe (certainly no larger) with the standard battery to give a range of 200 miles-ish in normal use but with two motors, one per front wheel, to allow enormously entertaining handling via torque vectoring. I would like controls to adjust the level of regen braking to suit the road I am on and to tweak the sharpness of turn-in/response to lift-off oversteer. I don't think I would need or want any more than 150bhp but could be persuaded by 200.
I can envisage something like a Zoe (certainly no larger) with the standard battery to give a range of 200 miles-ish in normal use but with two motors, one per front wheel, to allow enormously entertaining handling via torque vectoring. I would like controls to adjust the level of regen braking to suit the road I am on and to tweak the sharpness of turn-in/response to lift-off oversteer. I don't think I would need or want any more than 150bhp but could be persuaded by 200.
Neil1323bolts said:
Blu3R said:
DonkeyApple said:
The only significant issue being that hatches are predominantly urban vehicles and more urban environments will probably set outright bans on ICE cars over the next decade?
That there is the only fly in the ointment I think. Otherwise I'm with you on everything you've said on this thread.Any form of hot hatch isn't for me primarily because I think I'm now too old (42) although I had quite a few when I was younger. I've also had some pinnacle chavmobiles too - M3, Escort Cosworths, Imprezas - none of which (or the modern equivalents) I could possibly bring myself to drive now.
nickfrog said:
You're never too old to drive a car that you like and that should happen without giving a st what other people think. Particularly at 42!!
Thanks both for massaging my ego t what other people think. Particularly at 42!!
I do have a Noble which I think is borderline, but the windows are so small that you can't really work out who's driving so that suits me
Northernboy said:
DonkeyApple said:
That said, the i3 is the same sort of weight as a typical hot hatch and good fun to hoon. The range is also OK, even for blasts between mundanity. I've not driven the EV Mini but the performance stats and weight aren't all that off. I think these two cars that are at the early stage of EVs tend to show that everything is there bar the manual labour and oikery which personally, I consider key ingredients.
It's got a "real world" range of about 110 miles though, hasn't it? That's not really "OK" as someone's only car unless they really never use it for much other than commutig and local trips.After 15 months of WFH and using my i3S as a shopping cart, I got permission for a couple of site visits last week.
50 mile drive Crewe to Derby and it showed 25% battery usage.
I was a little surprised but then the return 50 miles also used 25%.
100 miles for £1.00 and still half the battery isn't so bad.
Which i3 model is your 110 miles range based on?
so called said:
Northernboy said:
DonkeyApple said:
That said, the i3 is the same sort of weight as a typical hot hatch and good fun to hoon. The range is also OK, even for blasts between mundanity. I've not driven the EV Mini but the performance stats and weight aren't all that off. I think these two cars that are at the early stage of EVs tend to show that everything is there bar the manual labour and oikery which personally, I consider key ingredients.
It's got a "real world" range of about 110 miles though, hasn't it? That's not really "OK" as someone's only car unless they really never use it for much other than commutig and local trips.After 15 months of WFH and using my i3S as a shopping cart, I got permission for a couple of site visits last week.
50 mile drive Crewe to Derby and it showed 25% battery usage.
I was a little surprised but then the return 50 miles also used 25%.
100 miles for £1.00 and still half the battery isn't so bad.
Which i3 model is your 110 miles range based on?
delta0 said:
Hatches are great for the city but when most people don’t have drives or access to home charging points then there won’t be big uptake
If the range is sufficient and the charging easy enough to do in a timely manner then it ceases to be a requirement to have a charger at home. We don't have fuel pumps at home either.That's the key enabler, along with prices dropping, plus there is I think some give and take needed, at least until range eclipses the best ICE vehicles an charging is sufficiently rapid.
We are used to a five minute stop for petrol to add 300 miles plus, but you are stood there tipping it into the car. I go to the supermarket once a week as I dont work Friday afternoons, it takes around 45 minutes to an hour to do the shop, pay and load it into the car, seems like a good opportunity to charge it.
Its early days but I see it getting harder to fill an ICE as nobody is going to keep a petrol station open for nostalgia.
J4CKO said:
If the range is sufficient and the charging easy enough to do in a timely manner then it ceases to be a requirement to have a charger at home. We don't have fuel pumps at home either.
That's the key enabler, along with prices dropping, plus there is I think some give and take needed, at least until range eclipses the best ICE vehicles an charging is sufficiently rapid.
We are used to a five minute stop for petrol to add 300 miles plus, but you are stood there tipping it into the car. I go to the supermarket once a week as I dont work Friday afternoons, it takes around 45 minutes to an hour to do the shop, pay and load it into the car, seems like a good opportunity to charge it.
Its early days but I see it getting harder to fill an ICE as nobody is going to keep a petrol station open for nostalgia.
If there are lots of them like in every supermarket space then it works great. I do think they can be very expensive to charge from though.That's the key enabler, along with prices dropping, plus there is I think some give and take needed, at least until range eclipses the best ICE vehicles an charging is sufficiently rapid.
We are used to a five minute stop for petrol to add 300 miles plus, but you are stood there tipping it into the car. I go to the supermarket once a week as I dont work Friday afternoons, it takes around 45 minutes to an hour to do the shop, pay and load it into the car, seems like a good opportunity to charge it.
Its early days but I see it getting harder to fill an ICE as nobody is going to keep a petrol station open for nostalgia.
delta0 said:
If there are lots of them like in every supermarket space then it works great. I do think they can be very expensive to charge from though.
I guess the ideal situation would have been to charge at a place of work funded by the employer, but that’s changed somewhat over the last year now most working from home Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff