M3 Estate not quite as good as it appeared.
Discussion
ESD1711 said:
And still not another peep on the matter from the folk making the stories up. Funny that eh.
Guess they probably got a few likes and follows out of it, maybe makes the fairytales worth while to them.
Unfortunately there is a growing under class that social media gives a voice to, they are best ignored.Guess they probably got a few likes and follows out of it, maybe makes the fairytales worth while to them.
After doing a bit of digging, I’ve found the original owners Instagram who if you read back has pictures of the build but they’re not posted.
There’s two sides of this story:
If the owner had the works carried out for him, sourced parts and supplied them to be fitted then he has my full sympathy and should chase the company’s/bodyshop who fitted the roof like that and made it structurally unsound for compensation because we’ve all been there when going somewhere and saying I want this and it’s been half assed etc.
If however it’s a self build and the owner knew about the welds, parts being sourced from spurious places then he’s an arse and has absolutely no argument to defend himself.
The police unit that has crushed it is a dedicated unit set up to eradicate anti social behaviour in cars which this car has been highlighted on a number of occasions being involved in. I’m glad I had my youth in the days where the sapphire cosworth was king, Southend seafront was the setting and the police didn’t really give a toss.
I remember a guy in our club had a Escort GTi that he turbo’ed, it still wasn’t massively quick (by modern standards) but it was a remarkable build and more importantly was safe. Now even standard cars are loud and so fast even hot hatches are cosworth fast - even faster/louder when modified and being driven even worse - we’ve all seen videos of RS Audi’s or M BMW’s being driven through rush hour traffic like absolute turnips then the owners wonder why they’re being victimised by the police. You were lucky if you had traction control and ABS back in the 90’s if you inevitably ran out of talent - now everyone thinks they’re a driving god because the electronics take over and keep everything in check.
The scene has changed, and not for the better.
There’s two sides of this story:
If the owner had the works carried out for him, sourced parts and supplied them to be fitted then he has my full sympathy and should chase the company’s/bodyshop who fitted the roof like that and made it structurally unsound for compensation because we’ve all been there when going somewhere and saying I want this and it’s been half assed etc.
If however it’s a self build and the owner knew about the welds, parts being sourced from spurious places then he’s an arse and has absolutely no argument to defend himself.
The police unit that has crushed it is a dedicated unit set up to eradicate anti social behaviour in cars which this car has been highlighted on a number of occasions being involved in. I’m glad I had my youth in the days where the sapphire cosworth was king, Southend seafront was the setting and the police didn’t really give a toss.
I remember a guy in our club had a Escort GTi that he turbo’ed, it still wasn’t massively quick (by modern standards) but it was a remarkable build and more importantly was safe. Now even standard cars are loud and so fast even hot hatches are cosworth fast - even faster/louder when modified and being driven even worse - we’ve all seen videos of RS Audi’s or M BMW’s being driven through rush hour traffic like absolute turnips then the owners wonder why they’re being victimised by the police. You were lucky if you had traction control and ABS back in the 90’s if you inevitably ran out of talent - now everyone thinks they’re a driving god because the electronics take over and keep everything in check.
The scene has changed, and not for the better.
It's nice to see that West Midlands Police took the time to answer some of the questions being asked this BMW on their Social Media.
It's quite telling that the owner of the car, plus the people that 'built' it and also the people who claim that there was a judgement made against the police in court have all gone very quiet.
I think that it is definitely a win win for West Midlands Police.
It's quite telling that the owner of the car, plus the people that 'built' it and also the people who claim that there was a judgement made against the police in court have all gone very quiet.
I think that it is definitely a win win for West Midlands Police.
Pip1968 said:
Whilst I am a big environmentalist despite being a petrolhead and would like to see more recycling I think crushing is probably the better option here. Nobody likes seeing their pride and joy being crushed. More so scumbag, thieving, dodgy, gits so for me it adds to the punishment.
Pip
Removing and flogging all the desirable trim, engine etc would seem sensible with the funds being chucked in the insurance industry's uninsured payout bucket but I guess its pocket change in the grand scheme and crushing the car intact sends a clear message to those buying and modifying cars.Pip
VanquishRider said:
westmidlandspolice Since we released the video of us crushing an illegal BMW earlier this week, there has been lots of rumours and questions?
?? So yesterday two of our officers from our Traffic Unit, PC Wright and PC Ray, went live to dispel some of these rumours. ??
?? It was seized in November last year and examined by trained stolen vehicle examinors
?? It was structuraly unsafe - the roof was welded on and all of the pillars were cut
?? It was identified to have stolen parts from at least TWO stolen cars
?? NO, we did not pay the owner any compensation ??
?? We couldn't auction this off - as this car is structurally unsafe!! ??
?? We couldn't take it apart and sell the parts, we don't know the history of these parts and they again could be really unsafe and a huge risk to the owner
?? Op Hercules is our operation to combat illegal street racing and gathering
From those points, crushing it seems the best outcome. Can’t help thinking that it’s have been better to state stuff like that in the original video.?? So yesterday two of our officers from our Traffic Unit, PC Wright and PC Ray, went live to dispel some of these rumours. ??
?? It was seized in November last year and examined by trained stolen vehicle examinors
?? It was structuraly unsafe - the roof was welded on and all of the pillars were cut
?? It was identified to have stolen parts from at least TWO stolen cars
?? NO, we did not pay the owner any compensation ??
?? We couldn't auction this off - as this car is structurally unsafe!! ??
?? We couldn't take it apart and sell the parts, we don't know the history of these parts and they again could be really unsafe and a huge risk to the owner
?? Op Hercules is our operation to combat illegal street racing and gathering
- policefamily #operationhercules #streetracing #999family #trafficcops #trafficofficers #bluelightfamily
normalbloke said:
InitialDave said:
AlexRS2782 said:
On the subject of road tax raised in a few posts - based on a search on the rate table for that era of 3:
320d M-Sport Estate - 12 months tax either £130 or £155 dependent on emission category changes.
BMW M3 (petrol) of the same era - 12 months tax is either £315, £340 or £490 dependent on where it sits in the same emission category changes.
So, apart from the legitimacy of the history of the "donor" parts that will be another reason they wouldn't declare the change on the logbook.
Mmm, that's kind of what I was wondering, but after a couple of people have mentioned it, I'm rather intrigued now, as I can't find anything about how the VED charge actually changes.320d M-Sport Estate - 12 months tax either £130 or £155 dependent on emission category changes.
BMW M3 (petrol) of the same era - 12 months tax is either £315, £340 or £490 dependent on where it sits in the same emission category changes.
So, apart from the legitimacy of the history of the "donor" parts that will be another reason they wouldn't declare the change on the logbook.
Pre 2001, it's dead simple, if the engine is above/below the capacity threshold, that's the band it's in.
But newer stuff, nowhere does it seem to explain how it would vary, if at all.
I'm getting very suspicious that they don't actually have a mechanism to do anything about it, and it stays the same.
Someone must have done it by the book and know the answer!
Wills2 said:
ESD1711 said:
And still not another peep on the matter from the folk making the stories up. Funny that eh.
Guess they probably got a few likes and follows out of it, maybe makes the fairytales worth while to them.
Unfortunately there is a growing under class that social media gives a voice to, they are best ignored.Guess they probably got a few likes and follows out of it, maybe makes the fairytales worth while to them.
nipsips said:
The scene has changed, and not for the better.
Very accurate posts. Spot on Wills, ESD and nipsips. My F80 was stolen in October '18 and it's no surprise to see various parts for sale all over places like eBay (for example S55 engines were going for £5k at the time). There should be more joined up thinking with online sales sites to make used car part sales more difficult for people breaking stolen cars.
pigeyman said:
Mr Joe Achilles did the vid, Nick (63NP) is the owner and yes he did an exceptional job. I don't know him, just follow him on Instagram. He did the same thing with a silver E91 before that which again was perfectly done. Got crashed into sadly.
Hmm this one seems to be incorrectly registered too, in the sense that the original engine capacity shows up, unlike my own car as above where it reflects the engine swap. 
Additionally because its still registered as a diesel its liable to pay the daily ULEZ charge inside the A406 in London which is a bit s
t. 
APontus said:
My F80 was stolen in October '18 and it's no surprise to see various parts for sale all over places like eBay (for example S55 engines were going for £5k at the time). There should be more joined up thinking with online sales sites to make used car part sales more difficult for people breaking stolen cars.
That would be a massive ask though. At any one time there are thousands of cars being broken up, most of them legitimately so.Fady said:
That would be a massive ask though. At any one time there are thousands of cars being broken up, most of them legitimately so.
Just regulate it. If you want to sell used car spares you have to have a licence and the online platforms require confirmation of the licence. Lose your licence lose your outlet to sell. You can't realistically stop it at the theft end. People are bashing down doors and stealing keys. You can't make every house a fortress. We haven't the police to investigate every crime, the courts to try them or the prison space to house them. They only do it because it's profitable and easy to sell the items. The amount of risk thieves are willing to take is, like in business, directly proportionate to the reward. Upping sentences isn't a deterrent.
If you remove the profitability on the exit you remove the motivation to steal in the first place.
APontus said:
Fady said:
That would be a massive ask though. At any one time there are thousands of cars being broken up, most of them legitimately so.
Just regulate it. If you want to sell used car spares you have to have a licence and the online platforms require confirmation of the licence. Lose your licence lose your outlet to sell. You can't realistically stop it at the theft end. People are bashing down doors and stealing keys. You can't make every house a fortress. We haven't the police to investigate every crime, the courts to try them or the prison space to house them. They only do it because it's profitable and easy to sell the items. The amount of risk thieves are willing to take is, like in business, directly proportionate to the reward. Upping sentences isn't a deterrent.
If you remove the profitability on the exit you remove the motivation to steal in the first place.
Fady said:
APontus said:
Fady said:
That would be a massive ask though. At any one time there are thousands of cars being broken up, most of them legitimately so.
Just regulate it. If you want to sell used car spares you have to have a licence and the online platforms require confirmation of the licence. Lose your licence lose your outlet to sell. You can't realistically stop it at the theft end. People are bashing down doors and stealing keys. You can't make every house a fortress. We haven't the police to investigate every crime, the courts to try them or the prison space to house them. They only do it because it's profitable and easy to sell the items. The amount of risk thieves are willing to take is, like in business, directly proportionate to the reward. Upping sentences isn't a deterrent.
If you remove the profitability on the exit you remove the motivation to steal in the first place.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Fastdruid said:
EBay won't let you sell anything without the environmental permit to break vehicles *or* proof that you're reselling something that was sold legitimately.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Who even would use Ebay for car parts when there are countless Facebook groups without the need to use fees.... Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Fastdruid said:
EBay won't let you sell anything without the environmental permit to break vehicles *or* proof that you're reselling something that was sold legitimately.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Yeah, but this really sucks for the hobbiest. I've got a garage full of bits and bobs.Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
CarCrazyDad said:
Fastdruid said:
EBay won't let you sell anything without the environmental permit to break vehicles *or* proof that you're reselling something that was sold legitimately.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Who even would use Ebay for car parts when there are countless Facebook groups without the need to use fees.... Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
I didn't pay any specific attention to any permits with my purchases either. That stuff doesn't apply to private sellers and all eBay really cars about is making money.
Far too many listings for them to be able to police the site properly and they only really take an item down if it is brought to their attention as being somehow fraudulent.
Fady said:
CarCrazyDad said:
Fastdruid said:
EBay won't let you sell anything without the environmental permit to break vehicles *or* proof that you're reselling something that was sold legitimately.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Who even would use Ebay for car parts when there are countless Facebook groups without the need to use fees.... Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
I didn't pay any specific attention to any permits with my purchases either. That stuff doesn't apply to private sellers and all eBay really cars about is making money. [quote]
If you read the link Ebay says it *does* apply to private sellers. Even though legally it doesn't.
Fady said:
Far too many listings for them to be able to police the site properly and they only really take an item down if it is brought to their attention as being somehow fraudulent.
It's very different to being fraudulent. People are getting automated messages about the requirement to have the permit. CarCrazyDad said:
Fastdruid said:
EBay won't let you sell anything without the environmental permit to break vehicles *or* proof that you're reselling something that was sold legitimately.
Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
Who even would use Ebay for car parts when there are countless Facebook groups without the need to use fees.... Legally this only needs to be for Businesses but Ebay are "gold plating" it so that all sellers private or business have to display the permit.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/sellin...
(also https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&... )
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