RE: Suzuki Jimny | PH Used Buying Guide
Discussion
Silvanus said:
he Jimny is great, but was never designed as an all-rounder, which is why it is so good at the things its supposed to do. I really am tempted by a second hand one.
So much this. It's obviously an excellent off-road car that's sorely limited in other ways. There's no hardship in that, in the same way as a Caterham being badly suited to the supermarket run doesn't diminish its talents.To be honest, at this stage, the thread is probably going to descend into most reasonable people agreeing, while 300 goes on a multi-quote rampage to defend his choice of car against any perceived criticism.
A familiar pattern.
bennno said:
The best alternative to the lcv still on sale on price is probably a lightly used hilux or l200. With a box back.
Depends. I admit I do rather like the Ranger if going for a pickup truck. But they are completely different sizes to the Jimny. Being small really is part of the appeal and buying something as long as an ocean liner isn't really a direct alternative IMHO.The closest vehicle to the Jimny would be a traditional Defender 90 or a Jeep Wrangler. Both marginally bigger, but still pretty similar. The SWB 3 door Shogun is more of a distant alternative, along with the SWB Land Cruiser, although they are both somewhat 'softer' and less rugged in the same sort of off road focused sense.
In past times a Daihatsu Fourtrack might have also been an option.
C70R said:
What about this suggests it's not "proper"? https://youtu.be/fsCeJyVhPvE
Looks perfectly capable to me, but obviously you'll dismiss it as not being comparable because you like going down narrow lanes.
Not wanting to knock the vehicle. But that looked like a fairly simple bumpy dry track. That the Shogun Sport made a complete meal of trying to drive up. It really showed the limitations of the suspension and drive system. Even your Discovery would have gone up there with less hassle (albeit completely relying on its clever traction control).Looks perfectly capable to me, but obviously you'll dismiss it as not being comparable because you like going down narrow lanes.
To be clear. I said I'd not take a Shogun Sport or use in places off road I take the Jimny. The Shogun Sport is too long, too big with poor approach and departure angles. You'd just end up damaging it. Indeed even your Discovery would be too big to go some of the places the Jimny does with ease (have been there done it!). Which is why boxy compact vehicles like the Wrangler, traditional Defender, Jimny are so good as off road vehicles.
The vid you have supplied is of a very large, open wide track in Australia. UK off roading is rarely like that. If you are in tight wooded areas with lots of trees or on technical terrain where you run the risk of impacting the bodywork on the ground. Large vehicles do not do so well. And ones that lack good suspension flex will struggle more, as they get stuck easier and/or you end up having to go too quickly over the terrain. You can see an example of this here: https://youtu.be/fsCeJyVhPvE?t=54
If it was wet or tighter confines, you'd run the risk of driving into something (have seen it done lots of times).
The Shogun Sport is 'ok', not much of a looker IMO and a bit bland. But its ok. It doesn't have the best traction systems and lacks suspension flex. But you can take anything off road. I've successfully off roaded an MG Maestro and an Austin Metro. But I'm not going to recommend them for laning.
I don't know how much off roading you have done or what kind of off roading. But if you have ever done anything serious off road (RTV/CCV trials sort of thing) then you'll know what I'm talking about in terms of size and capablity.
To show I'm willing to be more than reasonable. I have access to 2 different off road sites. If you wanted to come and try your Disco out on them, we could meet up. Just shoot me a message. I'm sure the capabilities of the Disco will amaze and impress you (which are IMO far better than the Shogun Sports). But you'll probably also be amazed at the places you won't want to take for risk of damage or getting stuck.
Silvanus said:
Plenty for sale at the price mentioned above
Silvanus said:
Used was quite clearly mentioned, new prices are irrelevant
Well it wasn't, not at that point of the discussion. But let's ignore that.Looking at used 2018 and up 3 door Land Cruisers results in you needing over £40k still. Quite a difference in price. If you drop to 2012 there is a single vehicle with 120,000 miles on the clock for £20k......
So under £33k, even used there appears to be bugger all as much of a direct alternative to the Jimny.
300bhp/ton said:
I don't pretend anything...
The Land Cruiser Commercial is vastly more money and is a lot bigger vehicle, with probably less off road ability. They also look minging.
Did you actually check the prices? Not remotely apples to apples.
The article said used newer shape Jimnys we’re going for over £30k, you can get a used, fairly late Landcruiser commercial for similar money, obviously comparing a brand new one to a used Jimny, it’s going to be more.The Land Cruiser Commercial is vastly more money and is a lot bigger vehicle, with probably less off road ability. They also look minging.
Did you actually check the prices? Not remotely apples to apples.
As for less off road ability I’d very much doubt it, perhaps in certain situations where the shorter wheelbase and lesser weight of the Jimny would be an advantage but overall I’d think they’d be fairly equal.
I know you’ve got a bit of a dislike for Landcruisers, but saying they’re not incredibly capable off road is a stretch.
It’s actually quite refreshing to see you do like at least one non LR 4x4 in the Jimny though!.
Edited by Walter Sobchak on Tuesday 16th August 12:29
300bhp/ton said:
C70R said:
What about this suggests it's not "proper"? https://youtu.be/fsCeJyVhPvE
Looks perfectly capable to me, but obviously you'll dismiss it as not being comparable because you like going down narrow lanes.
Not wanting to knock the vehicle. But that looked like a fairly simple bumpy dry track. That the Shogun Sport made a complete meal of trying to drive up. It really showed the limitations of the suspension and drive system. Even your Discovery would have gone up there with less hassle (albeit completely relying on its clever traction control).Looks perfectly capable to me, but obviously you'll dismiss it as not being comparable because you like going down narrow lanes.
To be clear. I said I'd not take a Shogun Sport or use in places off road I take the Jimny. The Shogun Sport is too long, too big with poor approach and departure angles. You'd just end up damaging it. Indeed even your Discovery would be too big to go some of the places the Jimny does with ease (have been there done it!). Which is why boxy compact vehicles like the Wrangler, traditional Defender, Jimny are so good as off road vehicles.
The vid you have supplied is of a very large, open wide track in Australia. UK off roading is rarely like that. If you are in tight wooded areas with lots of trees or on technical terrain where you run the risk of impacting the bodywork on the ground. Large vehicles do not do so well. And ones that lack good suspension flex will struggle more, as they get stuck easier and/or you end up having to go too quickly over the terrain. You can see an example of this here: https://youtu.be/fsCeJyVhPvE?t=54
If it was wet or tighter confines, you'd run the risk of driving into something (have seen it done lots of times).
The Shogun Sport is 'ok', not much of a looker IMO and a bit bland. But its ok. It doesn't have the best traction systems and lacks suspension flex. But you can take anything off road. I've successfully off roaded an MG Maestro and an Austin Metro. But I'm not going to recommend them for laning.
I don't know how much off roading you have done or what kind of off roading. But if you have ever done anything serious off road (RTV/CCV trials sort of thing) then you'll know what I'm talking about in terms of size and capablity.
To show I'm willing to be more than reasonable. I have access to 2 different off road sites. If you wanted to come and try your Disco out on them, we could meet up. Just shoot me a message. I'm sure the capabilities of the Disco will amaze and impress you (which are IMO far better than the Shogun Sports). But you'll probably also be amazed at the places you won't want to take for risk of damage or getting stuck.
I'd imagine that fewer than 1% of Jimny owners bought their car to take it on off-road trials courses. The fact that a Shogun Sport can't complete the kind of courses that a hick bobtail Disco can is completely irrelevant to 99% of 4x4 owners.
This feels like you've raised a very niche scenario to support what would otherwise be a fairly spurious point.
300bhp/ton said:
Silvanus said:
Plenty for sale at the price mentioned above
Silvanus said:
Used was quite clearly mentioned, new prices are irrelevant
Well it wasn't, not at that point of the discussion. But let's ignore that.Looking at used 2018 and up 3 door Land Cruisers results in you needing over £40k still. Quite a difference in price. If you drop to 2012 there is a single vehicle with 120,000 miles on the clock for £20k......
So under £33k, even used there appears to be bugger all as much of a direct alternative to the Jimny.
Silvanus said:
300bhp/ton said:
Silvanus said:
Plenty for sale at the price mentioned above
Silvanus said:
Used was quite clearly mentioned, new prices are irrelevant
Well it wasn't, not at that point of the discussion. But let's ignore that.Looking at used 2018 and up 3 door Land Cruisers results in you needing over £40k still. Quite a difference in price. If you drop to 2012 there is a single vehicle with 120,000 miles on the clock for £20k......
So under £33k, even used there appears to be bugger all as much of a direct alternative to the Jimny.
I bought two, one in black for my father and one in white that I then painted metallic blue for me.
They are ideal down here in the deeper parts of Cornwall. Tiny lanes, no parking space and some great green lanes.
Its not our main car, far from it but it makes me smile, which is actually the main thing. In this rat racy world.
They are ideal down here in the deeper parts of Cornwall. Tiny lanes, no parking space and some great green lanes.
Its not our main car, far from it but it makes me smile, which is actually the main thing. In this rat racy world.
Edited by Getragdogleg on Tuesday 16th August 13:00
Walter Sobchak said:
300bhp/ton said:
I don't pretend anything...
The Land Cruiser Commercial is vastly more money and is a lot bigger vehicle, with probably less off road ability. They also look minging.
Did you actually check the prices? Not remotely apples to apples.
The article said used newer shape Jimnys we’re going for over £30k, you can get a used, fairly late Landcruiser commercial for similar money, obviously comparing a brand new one to a used Jimny, it’s going to be more.The Land Cruiser Commercial is vastly more money and is a lot bigger vehicle, with probably less off road ability. They also look minging.
Did you actually check the prices? Not remotely apples to apples.
As for less off road ability I’d very much doubt it, perhaps in certain situations where the shorter wheelbase and lesser weight of the Jimny would be an advantage but overall I’d think they’d be fairly equal.
I know you’ve got a bit of a dislike for Landcruisers, but saying they’re not incredibly capable off road is a stretch.
It’s actually quite refreshing to see you do like at least one non LR 4x4 in the Jimny though!.
Edited by Walter Sobchak on Tuesday 16th August 12:29
Very few £30k Jimny's and I'm note sure any would actually have sold at that money. Certainly nobody on the bigjimny forum owns up to paying anything like that. And there are a lot of 4th Gen owners on there.
And as posted above. Used Land Cruisers 3 doors seem to be about £40k+. so almost double the money. That was a nationwide autotrader search.
I don't hate or dislike Land Cruisers either. I do think the current ones look boring and fulgly, because they are boring and fugly looking.
But you need to understand there is more than one type of Land Cruiser. And what we get here is a much softer version with IFS, built more as a Discovery (or RRC) type of vehicle. This doesn't make them bad vehicles, I think in the LC world they call these the "Comfort models". While other parts of the World still get the "Off road models" based on the J70. Available in several wheelbases and much more rugged and off road focused.
These are very cool:
But what we get in the UK is intended as far more as an SUV than as off road 4x4. You can even get it with an even worse looking face and a Lexus badge, priced right up at Full Fat Range Rover levels....
300bhp/ton said:
Silvanus said:
300bhp/ton said:
Silvanus said:
Plenty for sale at the price mentioned above
Silvanus said:
Used was quite clearly mentioned, new prices are irrelevant
Well it wasn't, not at that point of the discussion. But let's ignore that.Looking at used 2018 and up 3 door Land Cruisers results in you needing over £40k still. Quite a difference in price. If you drop to 2012 there is a single vehicle with 120,000 miles on the clock for £20k......
So under £33k, even used there appears to be bugger all as much of a direct alternative to the Jimny.
king point
C70R said:
How on earth did we get around to talking about off-road trials? It's probably one of the most niche motoring pastimes in the world.
I'd imagine that fewer than 1% of Jimny owners bought their car to take it on off-road trials courses. The fact that a Shogun Sport can't complete the kind of courses that a hick bobtail Disco can is completely irrelevant to 99% of 4x4 owners.
This feels like you've raised a very niche scenario to support what would otherwise be a fairly spurious point.
Oh dear :sigh: .... why can't you read what I wrote, rather than make stuff up in what you'd wish I written.I'd imagine that fewer than 1% of Jimny owners bought their car to take it on off-road trials courses. The fact that a Shogun Sport can't complete the kind of courses that a hick bobtail Disco can is completely irrelevant to 99% of 4x4 owners.
This feels like you've raised a very niche scenario to support what would otherwise be a fairly spurious point.
I used trials as an example of off road ability and if you'd personally done anything like it. Think of it akin to track days.... driving at 95mph on the M1 is not like lapping a track. And if you drive on track, you'll see cars in a different light to how you do on the road.
The same is true for 4x4's, if you properly off road them. You will see other attributes they either have or don't have.
As for the number of people using Jimny's off road. I'd say probably a good proportion. Probably more used off road than there are Porsches taken on track days.
Which is why there must be a hundred different companies making off road bits for them. Not just in Oz or Asia, but here in the UK too. If people didn't off road them, simply put there would be no market to sell off road bits too. And clearly there is. e.g.
A meet last year in the UK, lots of 4th Gens, they all went off road. And this was still during COVID times.
I can link you to the full library of pictures if you are interested.
And just take a look on YouTube at the number of 4th Gens properly off roaded.
And before you try and twist my words or make something else up. I NEVER said about competing with Jimny's. That was a reference to the type of terrain I do drive on and wouldn't take a Shogun Sport. It doesn't mean that you have to be competing to drive technical difficult off road obstacles.
Should I also assume as you ignored it, that you are uninterested in having a go off road as per my offer?
300bhp/ton said:
<lots of valid points>
Well, if I was going to be towing all the time I'd probably use a defender if it was a choice between the two. 
That's right, it's leafs all round. Less articulation and generally more bouncy. Previous owner of mine has installed heavy duty ones too, so it's extra tit jiggly. Being fair, the SJ is probably more comparable to a Series in that respect.
the SJ Jimny is easy to convert as well without a bulkhead, except from it's cab form as the rear part is welded. SJ comes in full canvas tilt form!
Defenders don't use Birmabright, pretty sure that ended with the Series. Which is unfortunate, because their panels are better quality imo.
Obviously the Unimog comment was a joke. We re-chassis one in 2017 (a 1984 model) and the chassis on its own was £70k lol
Don't worry, I'm well versed in importing. SVA test isn't a big hurdle people seem to think it is for cars under 10 years old, the Jimny is already compliant. Fit a fog light, dual speedo (mph and kmh) and bobs your uncle. Emissions? PLG under 1500cc flat rate for both engine sizes.
Regular rate of VAT and Customs works out to 30% of the declared vehicle value and shipping fee.
I've driven mine in the Garden if that counts. The reason I bought it:
1. Small, but big enough to get 2 dogs in with the back down. Gets used for Asda shops.
2. 4x4 - if it's snows here we get stuck occasionally.
3. Cheap (so I thought) I paid 15.5k for it on pre-order.
4. Cute!
I don't really care how it drives TBH, it's the 3rd car in a 2 person house.
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