Discussion
otolith said:
carlo996 said:
Just the other day I was out in the SUV, guy pulled up alongside and said..."you're acting antisocially"
Said nobody. Ever
If you aren't aware of how much some people hate them, you must have been living under a rock.Said nobody. Ever
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/e...
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/mar/0...
https://twitter.com/georgemonbiot/status/117108497...
https://www.newstalk.com/news/suvs-are-anti-social...
https://inews.co.uk/news/environment/suv-climate-c...
https://travelloglewes.co.uk/lewes-cars/leaflettin...
But it just shows a group of eco-nutters that are angry at everything.
otolith said:
For sure. Simply making the point that there are people who have a problem with them, they're not all grumpy old men, and perhaps that's why some people feel the need to justify their choice.
If I wanted one (I don't) I'd just tell people I bought it because I liked it.
Which is what pretty much every owner of one on here has said.... If I wanted one (I don't) I'd just tell people I bought it because I liked it.
helmbarrie said:
I can't see the point of SUVs for road use. They cost more, are heavier,ride and corner less well, are not efficient in space and use more petrol. They to my eyes are usually quite ugly. Like a previous poster I would prefer a BMW 5 series estate to an X5 and indeed I have a owned a 2001 530i estate for the last 19 years that swallows more luggage than an X5, is faster and more economical too. Most mention the HGV driving position as a benefit but when almost everyone has one the advantage disappears.
Yawn Yawn YawnBut an X5 boot is 15% bigger with the seats up, 10% bigger with seats down and they are more efficient in load space. And it doesn't look like a hearse.
Oh and the X5 is shorter than the 5-series Touring...only 2cm, granted, but still shorter
otolith said:
Julian Scott said:
Which is what pretty much every owner of one on here has said....
I think you've assumed that I was having a go at the people on here?As my dear department grandmother used to say, "it's perhaps time to put up or shut up."
Square Leg said:
Just had a look in my garage, and yep - I still don’t need an SUV.
Me neither. Do love mine though.I also look at all my bikes. Don't need those either.
Wife's car. She doesn't need that.
Photos of my last 8 cars, didn't need those either.
Actually, my house, I don't need this house.
Etc.
otolith said:
Julian Scott said:
No, you just keep taking about all the owners trying to justify their ownership but can't give any example of owners trying to justify their ownership? This despite several people asking you to give examples of owners trying to justify their ownership.
As my dear department grandmother used to say, "it's perhaps time to put up or shut up."
You appear determined to have an argument with me about some perceived slight you read into what I said that wasn't there.As my dear department grandmother used to say, "it's perhaps time to put up or shut up."
This was what I replied to.
C70R said:
But the wider issue is why anyone has to "justify" anything. Who needs this "justification", and what does it help them with?
I said that people need "justification" when their choice is criticised and they are embarrassed to admit that they just wanted it. People (in general) will give excuses for things (in general) about which they are criticised when they think the real reason will make their critic think worse of them. That's who needs "justification" and what it helps them with. I mean, it's such an obvious observation that one would have to be seriously on the spectrum not to get it, I'm amazed that people are triggered by it.
Bored explaining this now.
You replied by saying:
otolith said:
It helps them avoid having to tell the truth about why they own something someone else thinks is antisocial - the truth being "because I want to". Another possible response is "none of your business". If they find those answers embarrassing, they can attempt some "justification".
Who are 'they'? Give us examples of 'them'?
Give us examples showing 'they' avoid telling the truth?
Give us examples of how 'they' attempt 'some "justification"'?
Or just admit that 'they' don't exist except in narrow, embittered minds.
Mick-umnh9 said:
We went on a cruise a few years ago, the balcony cabin was near the pointy end and, whilst I found the floaty wallowing motion of the ship fairly relaxing, I wouldn't want to re-live it on a daily basis. Yes, you can probably see over the hedges that you're probably likely to end up in.
I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
I went to a funeral on Tuesday. The coffin was carried in a large estate car-like vehicle. It was nice to be able to see the coffin through the long, awkward looking rear, but I wouldn't want to be in it until I'm dead.I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
I'll happily pass on an estate car and stick with what the f*ck I like
Square Leg said:
Cold said:
Square Leg said:
Just had a look in my garage, and yep - I still don’t need an SUV.
Just had a look in my garage, and yep - I still don't need an Aston Martin or a Lotus. But thankfully there isn't a load of internet bores trying to get me to justify owning them. Just conducted a bit of research - asked Mrs Leg why she bought a blacked out, drug dealer spec Golf R that she only ever drives in Eco mode when a basic diesel variant would’ve done (and she’s a mid 50 year old HR director so not quite down with the kids…)- imagine my horror when she said she just *wanted* one.
I had to sit down at that bombshell.
AceKid said:
In a household with both a 530d touring and my old suv, I can happily say the suv is the least practical.
1999 Jeep Cherokee XJ, smaller inside than a ford focus, a highly inefficient and very thirsty 4.0 engine, handles how you would expect (wallowing and vague).
Do I need to justify it? No.....
Do I need it?....No....
Do I love it?....hell yes!
Anyone coming back saying that it isnt an suv and its a proper 4x4, Jeep themselves sold and marketed this as such and is actually regarded as one of the first suv's.
The issue is that the jeep is a 25yr old American car, it wouldn't matter what kind of 25 yr old American car. They are all wallowing, vague, thirsty and a bit s1999 Jeep Cherokee XJ, smaller inside than a ford focus, a highly inefficient and very thirsty 4.0 engine, handles how you would expect (wallowing and vague).
Do I need to justify it? No.....
Do I need it?....No....
Do I love it?....hell yes!
Anyone coming back saying that it isnt an suv and its a proper 4x4, Jeep themselves sold and marketed this as such and is actually regarded as one of the first suv's.
t...if a little addictive!bad company said:
This has become the most ridiculous thread I’ve seen on PH and there’s been a few.
If someone likes SUV’s, that’s great. Another reckons estate cars are better, also great so buy one. I prefer my TVR sports car and a 4 door saloon.
Seriously guys WTF is this argument about?
A lot of your answers can be found in Richard's recently posted diatribe:If someone likes SUV’s, that’s great. Another reckons estate cars are better, also great so buy one. I prefer my TVR sports car and a 4 door saloon.
Seriously guys WTF is this argument about?
RichardHMorris said:
In the good old days there were MPVs and 4x4s. And of course 2-seaters, coupes, saloons and estates.
The 4x4s were bought by people who occasionally went off road and then later by aspirational types.
The MPVs were bought by people who couldn't keep it in their pants or use contraception. And their MPVs were ugly and not in the least bit sporty.
So marketing departments invented the SUV: "Sport Utility Vehicles" for aspirational MPV drivers to buy. They are still ugly as sin and sometimes stupidly named, like the F-Pace which is like Bernie Winters saying "space". And if the car crash video channels on YouTube are anything to go by, they're prone to falling over at the slightest suggestion.
The more aspirational SUV owners also started wanting faster engines, so the marketing departments told the engineering departments to make it so. And they did, despite having to get over those compromises they'd built in in the first place.
My Mum drives an SUV but then she's 86 and disabled so she likes them being easy to get in and out of and her Motability thingy doesn't stretch to a Range Rover.
Even at 60 and despite "life-changing injuries" I can still get in and out of 'proper' cars that look and handle so much better.
Maybe when I can kid myself they look better and/or I can't bend down, I'll get one, but I'd probably go for a 4x4 instead.
The 4x4s were bought by people who occasionally went off road and then later by aspirational types.
The MPVs were bought by people who couldn't keep it in their pants or use contraception. And their MPVs were ugly and not in the least bit sporty.
So marketing departments invented the SUV: "Sport Utility Vehicles" for aspirational MPV drivers to buy. They are still ugly as sin and sometimes stupidly named, like the F-Pace which is like Bernie Winters saying "space". And if the car crash video channels on YouTube are anything to go by, they're prone to falling over at the slightest suggestion.
The more aspirational SUV owners also started wanting faster engines, so the marketing departments told the engineering departments to make it so. And they did, despite having to get over those compromises they'd built in in the first place.
My Mum drives an SUV but then she's 86 and disabled so she likes them being easy to get in and out of and her Motability thingy doesn't stretch to a Range Rover.
Even at 60 and despite "life-changing injuries" I can still get in and out of 'proper' cars that look and handle so much better.
Maybe when I can kid myself they look better and/or I can't bend down, I'll get one, but I'd probably go for a 4x4 instead.
cayman-black said:
Yahonza said:
carlo996 said:
Mick-umnh9 said:
We went on a cruise a few years ago, the balcony cabin was near the pointy end and, whilst I found the floaty wallowing motion of the ship fairly relaxing, I wouldn't want to re-live it on a daily basis. Yes, you can probably see over the hedges that you're probably likely to end up in.
I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
Plenty of decent handling SUV's around.I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
cayman-black said:
Julian Scott said:
Mick-umnh9 said:
We went on a cruise a few years ago, the balcony cabin was near the pointy end and, whilst I found the floaty wallowing motion of the ship fairly relaxing, I wouldn't want to re-live it on a daily basis. Yes, you can probably see over the hedges that you're probably likely to end up in.
I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
I went to a funeral on Tuesday. The coffin was carried in a large estate car-like vehicle. It was nice to be able to see the coffin through the long, awkward looking rear, but I wouldn't want to be in it until I'm dead.I'll happily pass on an SUV and stick with my estate car. x
I'll happily pass on an estate car and stick with what the f*ck I like
braddo said:
C70R said:
Sensational trolling effort. If in doubt, make it personal. 
I'm not tone deaf at all. I hear the tiny minority of grumpy old men in this thread as clear as day. I just don't care.
What about it is trolling? You're sounding like one of your favourite words - desperate. I'm not tone deaf at all. I hear the tiny minority of grumpy old men in this thread as clear as day. I just don't care.
I'm just hinting at your hypocrisy.
This isn't pointed at you specifically > I don't understand why so many SUV owners don't have the balls to say they own one because they like them and have better image than a van or MPV, instead of making up faux justifications about practicality or that estates are too long etc. Even Clarkson drew the line at a X6 years ago about image and being socially unacceptable, but lots of PHers just want to ignore the world around them.
I am not some green warrior but I have enough self awareness to know when some of my behaviour is part of the problem of excessive consumption of fossil fuels and climate change (V8 family cars including a SUV, a sports car, driving for pure pleasure etc).
C70R said:
J4CKO said:
Tomanybikes said:
C70R said:
Mouse Rat said:
If you hit a cyclist, they usually go under the car rather than over it scratching the paintwork etc.
The main reason I bought a Discovery.I'm a cyclist. Pre-COVID I was doing almost 1,500 commuter miles a year in London. Do you cycle?
Edited by C70R on Friday 7th October 11:00
And I do about 1,500 miles some months
C70R said:
Julian Scott said:
C70R said:
J4CKO said:
Tomanybikes said:
C70R said:
Mouse Rat said:
If you hit a cyclist, they usually go under the car rather than over it scratching the paintwork etc.
The main reason I bought a Discovery.I'm a cyclist. Pre-COVID I was doing almost 1,500 commuter miles a year in London. Do you cycle?
Edited by C70R on Friday 7th October 11:00
And I do about 1,500 miles some months
Or maybe it just wasn't funny? Or even written as if it was trying to be?
C70R said:
BS62 said:
C70R said:
But do you do more than 1,500 miles some months?
No because I'm not a MAMIL obsessively pedalling in the opposite direction of whatever my problems are. I ride a mountain bike for fun not Strava stats. Although I reckon every off-road mile is worth 10 covered by one of those self-appointed moving traffic calming islands. I ps off fewer people too (with my bike) - but particularly like it when I can balance that out by transporting my bike in an SUV.What a ridiculous thread this has become.
GT9 said:
mikeiow said:
A500leroy said:
Anyone seen the new BMW electric suv? The grill is a sticker, A STICKER!!
Have to say the newer BMW EV grills look, IMHO, absolutely awful. Just too big (& obviously flat).I’m sure many will disagree.
The 'grille' now has two purposes. It is a sensor panel for various functions and it is also there to make it obvious to 7.7 billion people that the car they are looking at, from whatever perspective or distance, is unmistakably a BMW.
The plastic used for the panel is self-healing, presumably because it will draw even more attention to itself if it's all scratched up...
On the second point, I think it's a masterstroke from BMW.
The have definitely succeeded in making the car unmistakable for another brand, whilst creating a frenzy of attention from all points of view. They say there is no such thing as bad press, etc.
In my opinion the number of people who are genuinely in the market for this type of car that will be put-off buying it because of the shape of a piece of plastic are outnumbered 10 to 1 by those will see the car in a much broader light. The effect of the grille on the long-term ownership experience is so insignificant, yet to everyone else it seems almost life or death.
The importance of low drag to EVs is becoming more and more prominent, and in is inevitable all EVs will eventually look like an an amorphous blob shaped by the wind, indistinguishable from each other.
Which leaves manufacturers no option but to have a brand-specific panel on the front. For BMW it was always going to be a big and bold pair of kidneys. To me its a refreshing alternative to the sea of sameness now appearing.
BMWs are arguably the smaller of the grilles of the mass German brands - Audi and Mercs are at least as big if not bigger, and without breaking up the mass, or identity.
GT9 said:
Julian Scott said:
A500leroy said:
Not sure what size those wheels are, but they make a fairly sizeable SUV look hot hatch sized.In the end it got toned down to an iX M60 with non-descript low-drag wheels in gansta black.
Wheels have quite a big impact on range for these cars so I don't expect we will ever see anything like what is shown in the image, which is a shame because they look SO much better.
Standard ones do suit the car.
XM's wheels look better
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff