RE: 2024 Porsche Macan Turbo | PH Review
Discussion
stimshady said:
i think i'd be questioning why have you been persuaded if I were you... what with the pathetic infrastructure, huge queues to find expensive electricity, questionable environmental processes to find the minerals like cobalt, unknown future of recycling, variable mileage in the cold, dismal residual values, fires that cannot really be put out, insanely expensive battery replacements, battery degradation over time (dependent on various factors such as fast charge and heat of environment), the fact the electricity has to be generated from somewhere (and don't tell me wind turbines will power the country AND all our cars) and to cap it all off - turbo badges when there are no turbos... the list goes on. Oh, and they sound rubbish. Soul-less iPads on wheels.
(and no i'm not 50, not for a while yet anyway).
Mine costs 2.5p per mile as i charge at 7.5p /kWhr. Infrastructure is fine. I've never had a problem charging commercially albeit it is infrequent. Residuals are also fine and their risk of catching fire is really quite low. The only car fires I've ever seen personally are ICEs the last coming away from Orlando airport in November. (and no i'm not 50, not for a while yet anyway).
If you really wish to talk about sustainability and grid power demand you really should do some research. Just saying uneveidenced stuff simply doesn't cut it.
I swopped out the Macan GTS for the Taycan and wouldn't swop back not even an electric version.
BTW I know how ICEs work I was building /rebuilding engines and gearboxes back in the 70s and built a 380bhp S1 Exige track car but as an Engineer i like engineering excellence and the ICE will be relegated to history within 50 years.
The quietness is a real bonus for me and I'm not selfish enough to want to upset residents.
Anyway you live with your prejudiced views and your post just confirm my previous comment.
Nomme de Plum said:
Mine costs 2.5p per mile as i charge at 7.5p /kWhr. Infrastructure is fine. I've never had a problem charging commercially albeit it is infrequent. Residuals are also fine and their risk of catching fire is really quite low. The only car fires I've ever seen personally are ICEs the last coming away from Orlando airport in November.
If you really wish to talk about sustainability and grid power demand you really should do some research. Just saying uneveidenced stuff simply doesn't cut it.
I swopped out the Macan GTS for the Taycan and wouldn't swop back not even an electric version.
BTW I know how ICEs work I was building /rebuilding engines and gearboxes back in the 70s and built a 380bhp S1 Exige track car but as an Engineer i like engineering excellence and the ICE will be relegated to history within 50 years.
The quietness is a real bonus for me and I'm not selfish enough to want to upset residents.
Anyway you live with your prejudiced views and your post just confirm my previous comment.
Ok mate, good luck with it.If you really wish to talk about sustainability and grid power demand you really should do some research. Just saying uneveidenced stuff simply doesn't cut it.
I swopped out the Macan GTS for the Taycan and wouldn't swop back not even an electric version.
BTW I know how ICEs work I was building /rebuilding engines and gearboxes back in the 70s and built a 380bhp S1 Exige track car but as an Engineer i like engineering excellence and the ICE will be relegated to history within 50 years.
The quietness is a real bonus for me and I'm not selfish enough to want to upset residents.
Anyway you live with your prejudiced views and your post just confirm my previous comment.
P.Griffin said:
Not specifically, no, but all EVs are treated the same in the UK. While the UK and several other nations have reduced our fossil fuels, we subsidise China who accounted for 95% of the world’s new coal power construction activity in 2023 and the level of new construction starting in China is nearly quadruple what it was in 2019.
On that basis, I don't think they should be treated evenly.
Spread your research further On that basis, I don't think they should be treated evenly.
Look up the amount of renewable energy China has installed in the last 2-3 years. It's more than the whole of the rest of the world.......combined !
On your point about EV subsidy. BIK is an additional tax, some vehicles attract less tax due to the lower pollution, just the same as the VED process for ICE cars.
Lower tax is not a subsidy !
Else everyone on less than 45% income tax is getting a subsidy too
Edited by SDK on Wednesday 24th April 08:39
Terminator X said:
You have no garage? Go on add your car(s).
TX.
My main passion was always sailing but not practicable when i was still working in London and overseas. Hence a few TVRs and trackday 380bhp Exige S1. I now live within a few hundred metres of my marina so don't need a car for much so I3s here and my (GFs) Taycan in Tallinn. I have a fun trip to St Vaast la Houge Normandy next month with a few other yachts . Can't do that in a car without a ferry. TX.
Your Alpine is a great car and looks really good to. Probably a bit more sophisticated than my Exige. Oh and my first proper sports car was an S1 Elan back in 1973.
J4CKO said:
The vehement anti EV folk remind me of the cat we had as a kid, Barney.
Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
Nice anecdote, but reality doesn't tally up with your analogy.Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
The problem here is that, from personal experience through 3 close friends (as opposed to your usual put down regarding "bloke told me in the pub") the new, very expensive bed didn't live up to expectations and certainly had flaws not present in their old bed. 2 of the cats are now back in their old beds, and the other will give the new bed back when the company lease scheme ends.
EVs do work in many instances, but they are not where they need to be yet for mass adoption. Until the issue of range and home charging is addressed, some people will stick to ICE. And who can blame them. EVs don't work for a lot of people yet..get over it. Why do you insist everyone should think like you, and condescend them if they think otherwise.
And while some have mentioned youngsters here, how the hell do you expect new young drivers to adopt EVs when it's virtually impossible for them to get insurance?
I know things will change, but your berating doesn't take into account many factors. We may not all be blessed with the space/situation/funds etc that I suspect many of the EVangelists have.
Edited by P.Griffin on Wednesday 24th April 09:35
stimshady said:
Lotobear said:
Haha love it!Sent it to my neighbour who owns a Tesla and even he said he had a good laugh
P.Griffin said:
J4CKO said:
The vehement anti EV folk remind me of the cat we had as a kid, Barney.
Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
Nice anecdote, but reality doesn't tally up with your analogy.Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
The problem here is that, from personal experience through 3 close friends (as opposed to your usual put down regarding "bloke told me in the pub") the new, very expensive bed didn't live up to expectations and certainly had flaws not present in their old bed. 2 of the cats are now back in their old beds, and the other will give the new bed back when the company lease scheme ends.
EVs do work in many instances, but they are not where they need to be yet for mass adoption. Until the issue of range and home charging is addressed, some people will stick to ICE. And who can blame them. Why do you insist everyone should think like you, and condescend them if they think otherwise.
And while some have mentioned youngsters here, how the hell do you expect new young drivers to adopt EVs when it's virtually impossible for them to get insurance?
I know things will change, but your berating doesn't take into account many factors. We may not all be blessed with the space/situation/funds etc that I suspect many of the EVangelists have.
If you have tried an EV, lived with one or have a cogent opinion other than "Oh Noes Milk Floats Lol" then it has much more credence than the single line dumb sounding comments.
I am no EVangelist, limited experience of a few passenger rides, but I take something of a realist/devils advocate standpoint with regards to EVs, they have their downsides, but lets be honest there are an awful lot of them about, million of them now so they arent going to go away.
So may as well get used to it as there is no "current" alternative, Hydrogen isnt happening any time soon by the looks of it, eFuels are expensive and inefficient and carrying on burning fossil fuels indefinitely isnt going to happen really is it ?
J4CKO said:
P.Griffin said:
J4CKO said:
The vehement anti EV folk remind me of the cat we had as a kid, Barney.
Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
Nice anecdote, but reality doesn't tally up with your analogy.Money didn’t grow on trees and my mum treated him to a new bed as his was manky, so very manky.
She spent like £20 on this fancy new bed but Barney spurned it, wouldn’t go in it, my mum was really disappointed as this bed looked so cosy, it had a roof over him, fur lined and had a nice pattern all over it of fish and stuff and had spent £20 on it, back in like 1986 was a lot of money.
Anyway, the old bed was left as otherwise he slept on the floor if it was taken away, studiously avoiding the new bed.
My mum made a point of leaving it there, it was there month in month out, we thought it would be there until the day he took his final trip to the vets.
But, one day, my mum went in the kitchen and there he was, sat looking very happy in his new bed, the old one was left for a bit but he didn’t bother with it again and it got binned, what was left of it.
“Thats you that is”
The problem here is that, from personal experience through 3 close friends (as opposed to your usual put down regarding "bloke told me in the pub") the new, very expensive bed didn't live up to expectations and certainly had flaws not present in their old bed. 2 of the cats are now back in their old beds, and the other will give the new bed back when the company lease scheme ends.
EVs do work in many instances, but they are not where they need to be yet for mass adoption. Until the issue of range and home charging is addressed, some people will stick to ICE. And who can blame them. Why do you insist everyone should think like you, and condescend them if they think otherwise.
And while some have mentioned youngsters here, how the hell do you expect new young drivers to adopt EVs when it's virtually impossible for them to get insurance?
I know things will change, but your berating doesn't take into account many factors. We may not all be blessed with the space/situation/funds etc that I suspect many of the EVangelists have.
If you have tried an EV, lived with one or have a cogent opinion other than "Oh Noes Milk Floats Lol" then it has much more credence than the single line dumb sounding comments.
I am no EVangelist, limited experience of a few passenger rides, but I take something of a realist/devils advocate standpoint with regards to EVs, they have their downsides, but lets be honest there are an awful lot of them about, million of them now so they arent going to go away.
So may as well get used to it as there is no "current" alternative, Hydrogen isnt happening any time soon by the looks of it, eFuels are expensive and inefficient and carrying on burning fossil fuels indefinitely isnt going to happen really is it ?
Edited by P.Griffin on Wednesday 24th April 10:11
Edited by P.Griffin on Wednesday 24th April 10:13
cerb4.5lee said:
I'm not a fan of the brake regeneration aspect in the EVs I've driven(it just spoils the whole smoothness vibe that EVs are mainly known for), so unlike the author of this article...I'd actually prefer that it isn't aggressive in these to be honest.
I can't stand the daft front end nose diving that EVs generally tend to do, however I appreciate that I could turn the brake regen completely off altogether in an EV though(and I would if I owned one I think).
Driving round town I find one pedal mode smoother (BMW i4), although it takes a while to get used to it. Motorways and open roads I switch to (next to) no regen which works better, one pedal doesn't work so well then (especially with cruise control).I can't stand the daft front end nose diving that EVs generally tend to do, however I appreciate that I could turn the brake regen completely off altogether in an EV though(and I would if I owned one I think).
cerb4.5lee said:
I grew up lusting after the Lambo Countach/Magnums Ferrari 308 etc, whereas I'd imagine that the kids of today lust after a Tesla or a Taycan etc in comparison though. Times have just changed I reckon, and not necessarily for the better either.
Lambos, Rs3's, M3's... and anything loud, proud and fast... its still the same...
Tesla's and all electric rubbish don't get a look in.. Unless you have a cyber truck.. and again thats just for the novelty and kudos of it... thats for you older folks; vegans and the alphabet mafia
I always find it mad just how out of touch people are on PH... (Not pointing at you specifically Cerb4)
Edited by MyV10BarksAndBites on Wednesday 24th April 13:11
Edited by MyV10BarksAndBites on Wednesday 24th April 13:12
Nomme de Plum said:
Mine costs 2.5p per mile as i charge at 7.5p /kWhr. Infrastructure is fine. I've never had a problem charging commercially albeit it is infrequent. Residuals are also fine and their risk of catching fire is really quite low.
Firmly agree on all this. If you can charge at home (and I daresay pretty much buyers of new Porsches can park off street) then it costs pennies to charge overnight. The reality for nearly all use cases is that public charging is pretty rare - a few times per year for me - and I've never had to queue in four years owning an EV, and the number of chargers aroud now dwarfs the number when I first owned an EV.All cars are a potential fire risk - luckily EVs are considerably less likely to catch fire than ICEs.
So many of these 'excuses' are very tired and easily debunked - and generally used by people that have never had to live with EV.
MyV10BarksAndBites said:
You think they do... They don't!!!...
Lambos, Rs3's, M3's... and anything loud, proud and fast... its still the same...
Tesla's and all electric rubbish don't get a look in.. Unless you have a cyber truck.. and again thats just for the novelty and kudos of it... thats for you older folks; vegans and the alphabet mafia
I always find it mad just how out of touch people are on PH... (Not pointing at you specifically Cerb4)
I spend my weekends in club with hundreds of kids, teenagers and young adults. Very very few have any interest in cars other than tow or carry their boats. Lambos, Rs3's, M3's... and anything loud, proud and fast... its still the same...
Tesla's and all electric rubbish don't get a look in.. Unless you have a cyber truck.. and again thats just for the novelty and kudos of it... thats for you older folks; vegans and the alphabet mafia
I always find it mad just how out of touch people are on PH... (Not pointing at you specifically Cerb4)
Edited by MyV10BarksAndBites on Wednesday 24th April 13:11
Edited by MyV10BarksAndBites on Wednesday 24th April 13:12
The parents of the younger ones are turning in quite large numbers to EVs Tesla being the most common but quite a few Taycans, IPaces, Kias, Hyundai and VWs too.
I'm pretty sure this new Macan will soon be seen also.
bobo79 said:
Firmly agree on all this. If you can charge at home (and I daresay pretty much buyers of new Porsches can park off street) then it costs pennies to charge overnight. The reality for nearly all use cases is that public charging is pretty rare - a few times per year for me - and I've never had to queue in four years owning an EV, and the number of chargers aroud now dwarfs the number when I first owned an EV.
All cars are a potential fire risk - luckily EVs are considerably less likely to catch fire than ICEs.
So many of these 'excuses' are very tired and easily debunked - and generally used by people that have never had to live with EV.
By the sounds of things, you don't really drive anywhere of any distance if you always charge at home? That wasn't my point. All cars are a potential fire risk - luckily EVs are considerably less likely to catch fire than ICEs.
So many of these 'excuses' are very tired and easily debunked - and generally used by people that have never had to live with EV.
I also wasn't talking about the risk of fire, more the difficulty of putting the fire out. So, again that wasn't my point.
I was talking about the infrastructure, but seeing as you never charge outside your home, i'm not sure you're well placed to answer that point anyway.
But please feel free to 'debunk' all of the points I did actually make... (but the actual points, not a changed version of the point).
stimshady said:
By the sounds of things, you don't really drive anywhere of any distance if you always charge at home? That wasn't my point.
I also wasn't talking about the risk of fire, more the difficulty of putting the fire out. So, again that wasn't my point.
I was talking about the infrastructure, but seeing as you never charge outside your home, i'm not sure you're well placed to answer that point anyway.
But please feel free to 'debunk' all of the points I did actually make... (but the actual points, not a changed version of the point).
On the fire issue point. It is accepted that an EV battery fore is harder to extinguish due to it being a chemical reaction and thereby self perpetuating. But:I also wasn't talking about the risk of fire, more the difficulty of putting the fire out. So, again that wasn't my point.
I was talking about the infrastructure, but seeing as you never charge outside your home, i'm not sure you're well placed to answer that point anyway.
But please feel free to 'debunk' all of the points I did actually make... (but the actual points, not a changed version of the point).
https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/tusker-fleet-data...
Also
"Despite the increased danger once a battery fire is burning, the probability of being caught in an EV fire appears overall to be much lower than for petrol or diesel cars, based on currently available data – although this could change as more people get electric cars.
Walker said it was possible that the prevalence of fires in EVs could increase as the average age of batteries on the roads increases. However, at this point, it appears that they would have to multiply by many times to be worse than internal combustion engines."
From here
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/20/d...
Also
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/electric-cars/h...
Mileage wise in the UK the per day average is less than 20 with annual milage less than 8,000.
https://www.nimblefins.co.uk/cheap-car-insurance/a...
Albit slightly higher here
https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/ev-mileages-incre...
So charging away from home is for most people only required very infrequently.
As for infrastructure have a look at Electroverse which is an Octopus network with preferential rates for customers.
https://electroverse.octopus.energy/map/operator/e...
There is also Zapmap
https://www.zap-map.com/live/
There is no shortage of charge points for the 1M+ EVs we currently have. The problem is for the companies to make these installations financially viable particularly in the short term.
I think these looks great inside and out. I just wont be buying an EV anytime soon.
Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
jaacck said:
I think these looks great inside and out. I just wont be buying an EV anytime soon.
Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
There is a petrol version available in the UK until end 2024 or maybe mid 2025 and in Europe longer.Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
Taycan has outsold the Panamera 40K to 34K so how do you call that a crash?
Nomme de Plum said:
jaacck said:
I think these looks great inside and out. I just wont be buying an EV anytime soon.
Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
There is a petrol version available in the UK until end 2024 or maybe mid 2025 and in Europe longer.Quite bold for them to not bring out a petrol version also, seems like they will miss out on a lot of business by making it EV only. I imagine the EV doubt / huge market crash of the taycan happened so late into the production of this that it was too late to go back.
Taycan has outsold the Panamera 40K to 34K so how do you call that a crash?
Cheap company motoring is the main reason it’s sold 40,000 units. Electric Macan will be exactly the same while the incentives are there.
Nomme de Plum said:
There is a petrol version available in the UK until end 2024 or maybe mid 2025 and in Europe longer.
Um no, Europe well the EU is discontinued first. The UK end of sale is post EU.ICE macan sales for factory spec’d orders for have already ended for the EU market. The cut off was the January allocation round. The ICE car doesn’t meet EU regs as of July ‘24 which is last possible registration/sale date.
Just to point out but the Porsche.de configurator states “Das gewählte Modell ist nicht mehr als frei konfigurierbarer Neuwagen bestellbar.” In English that’s selected model can no longer be ordered as configurable new car.
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