RE: Lamborghini unveils 800hp Urus SE plug-in hybrid
Discussion
murphyaj said:
Charlie_1 said:
Perfect example of envy in print
Straw man argument.It is possible for somebody to dislike an expensive product without it necessarily being about envy?
Totally.
If you know your mind and it is your genuine opinion it is not about envy at all.
Saying it is envy is sometimes just a lazy Ill thought out swipe.
Julian Scott said:
The continued ignorance in branding any Lamborghini/Audi/Porsche/Bugatti/etc as a 'rebadged VW' reminds me how stupid and bitter some people are ;-)
Ok, 'rebadged' is an overstatement. But the architecture of the Urus is shared with the Touareg, Q8 etc as noted. Some people don't care about architecture and are happy to buy the same car in different clothes. To me it's fundamental, as it strongly constrains weight distribution, suspension fundamentals, which engines and drivetrains can fit, and the basic dimension minimums.A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
samoht said:
Ok, 'rebadged' is an overstatement. But the architecture of the Urus is shared with the Touareg, Q8 etc as noted. Some people don't care about architecture and are happy to buy the same car in different clothes. To me it's fundamental, as it strongly constrains weight distribution, suspension fundamentals, which engines and drivetrains can fit, and the basic dimension minimums.
A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)
By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
Exactly. It’s amazing how people are ill informed, a client of mine arrived at our meeting with his Cayenne and commented on my DBX explaining why he didn’t order a DBX because “it isn’t a proper Aston Martin and is essentially a Mercedes underneath”. Err, actually no it isn’t. I could have started on his Cayenne but refrained as I was being polite and didn’t want it to ruin our meeting.A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
CSK1 said:
Exactly. It’s amazing how people are ill informed, a client of mine arrived at our meeting with his Cayenne and commented on my DBX explaining why he didn’t order a DBX because “it isn’t a proper Aston Martin and is essentially a Mercedes underneath”. Err, actually no it isn’t. I could have started on his Cayenne but refrained as I was being polite and didn’t want it to ruin our meeting.
A nice display of professionalism on your part. So many are simply unaware. el romeral said:
I really like these and I think that they must be epic to drive. This model would be perfect for the socially conscious Lamborghini owner (if such things exist??). Could do the 6 am starts in hybrid mode and not awaken the entire street or village.
Yeah......Yeah.................
They don't exist
They'd buy an Audi Q7 :-)
Edited by Griffith4ever on Wednesday 24th April 19:20
These are everywhere in Alderley Edge, I can remember seeing a Countach as a kid one day, now I can’t remember a day not seeing an Urus.
Someone my youngest knows had one, dropped him at their place and had a nosey in it, the interior looked like it had been specced as a soft play area, his girlfriend used it mostly, quite a way to arrive at what was a minimum wage job !
Someone my youngest knows had one, dropped him at their place and had a nosey in it, the interior looked like it had been specced as a soft play area, his girlfriend used it mostly, quite a way to arrive at what was a minimum wage job !
samoht said:
Ok, 'rebadged' is an overstatement. But the architecture of the Urus is shared with the Touareg, Q8 etc as noted. Some people don't care about architecture and are happy to buy the same car in different clothes. To me it's fundamental, as it strongly constrains weight distribution, suspension fundamentals, which engines and drivetrains can fit, and the basic dimension minimums.
A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)
By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
Nice to see real info. I must say that's a typical VW/Audi setup or DKW as you say. And not a setup one would expect from a supercar brand. I can only presume there's VAG part numbers and labels all over this 'Lambo'.A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
Edited by JJJ. on Wednesday 24th April 19:40
CSK1 said:
samoht said:
Ok, 'rebadged' is an overstatement. But the architecture of the Urus is shared with the Touareg, Q8 etc as noted. Some people don't care about architecture and are happy to buy the same car in different clothes. To me it's fundamental, as it strongly constrains weight distribution, suspension fundamentals, which engines and drivetrains can fit, and the basic dimension minimums.
A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)
By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
Exactly. It’s amazing how people are ill informed, a client of mine arrived at our meeting with his Cayenne and commented on my DBX explaining why he didn’t order a DBX because “it isn’t a proper Aston Martin and is essentially a Mercedes underneath”. Err, actually no it isn’t. I could have started on his Cayenne but refrained as I was being polite and didn’t want it to ruin our meeting.A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
dodgydelboy75000 said:
Always thought it looks a bit vulgar compared to the rivals. Never understood the fast SUV. Surely SUV is more about comfort and usability and not outright speed.
It's a Lambo so it's meant to be somewhat gauche, to put it mildly. SUVs can also be about speed as well as comfort and usability. And it's the nature of any car segment for some consumers to desire something a bit quicker so some rapid ones is perfectly normal. This particular car is too brash and too quick for what I buy and enjoy but I do t envy nor begrudge an owner with a different set of wants to me.
And while hundreds of millions of normal punters keep persisting in buying endless possessions, experiences and consuming in general then the shopkeepers they all hurl their money at 24/7/365 can hardly help but become extremely wealthy as a result and so more and more things such as this are offered by other shopkeepers. To stop a few people from become unimaginable lay wealthy one would have to stop the hundreds of millions of skint shoppers who can't stop shopping.
Terminator X said:
hu8742 said:
Impressive performance figures for sure, but for far less you could have even more impressive performance figures and still transport the whole family + luggage. My Rivian has 835bhp and 910lb/ft of torque. But it's not a Lambo. Of course I'd rather have one of these.
O/T I quite like them, what one have you got?TX.
Got the R1T (launch edition). Went for the A/T tyres rather than the street ones. Quad-motor is probably over-kill, but so what. It's a shame they don't make them for the UK because the size is ideal (Ford Ranger rather than F-150). For a heavy thing, it handles very well (esp with sport mode) and stomp on the accelerator and it'll get you out of any pickle. Off-road capability is brilliant too, helped by having its own air compressor so you can air down/up your tyres. Cost me $77k all in. Bargain.
Charlie_1 said:
JJJ. said:
murphyaj said:
JJJ. said:
Is this hybrid version basically a VW product with some frills and an exotic name?
No.The entire model range is basically a VW product with some frills and an exotic name.
So, a VW badged Audi, badged Lambo?
For me, it’s a prime example of a car that sits at the extreme end of a spectrum of owners.
At one end, owners will buy cars primarily for image, status and getting noticed, irrespective of taste. The actual capability of the car ( apart from noise and colour) is largely irrelevant. Unlike most PHers, they’re not interested in driving dynamics, engineering integrity or other such attributes. IMHO, this is where the Urus sits.
At the other end, are buyers who won’t really care about being noticed when driving their car. They’ve bought their car only for their own consumption and enjoyment, not for the admiration , acclaim or appreciation from others. It’s not about looking cool or status.
All parts of the spectrum of owners can be sufficiently affluent to buy an Urus but many don’t.
So it’s not about envy.
Oh, but the Urus is still tasteless gash.
samoht said:
Ok, 'rebadged' is an overstatement. But the architecture of the Urus is shared with the Touareg, Q8 etc as noted. Some people don't care about architecture and are happy to buy the same car in different clothes. To me it's fundamental, as it strongly constrains weight distribution, suspension fundamentals, which engines and drivetrains can fit, and the basic dimension minimums.
A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)
By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
But against the DBX and the Purpsangue is that if you're are blind you can switch between driving a Urus, Cayenne, Tuareg, Bentayga and Q7 seamlessly as the frame and fittings are all identical. A Revuelto is its own bespoke architecture from the ground-up, not a rebadged VW. Conversely a Urus shares its architecture with the VW, putting the whole engine ahead of the front axle DKW-style
(note front driveshafts)By contrast, the DBX is a bespoke architecture. The Purosangue uses the FF drivetrain where the engine is almost entirely behind the front axle.
I can't afford any of the Urus, DBX or Purosangue but I know which ones I respect, because the latter two vehicles' high asking prices reflect the cost of developing and manufacturing something special.
The downside is that everything must be compromised to fit within a core design that was based around the needs and requirements of housewives and low income earners whereas things like the DBX are zero compromise, ground up designed for the customer.
It's the difference between a tailored suit and a bespoke one. There is a difference in quality as we know from wearing bespoke but that only matters if someone is attempting to rip you off by charging bespoke prices for tailoring a machine made, generic, one size fits all suit. Tailored suits make perfect sense but you'd be a little dim to pay more than bespoke.
So with the VW variants it isn't a quality issue or a snobbery issue but simply a question as to whether a particular tailored VW mass produced, generic base represents fair value when compared to bespoke offerings.
The Cayenne has always struck me as great value. Searing performance, very comfortable and pleasant interior and a very fair price, no comedy mark-up. The Urus and Bentayga starting around £180k these days not so. They are doing a lot of heavy lifting when it comes to assembling all the parts from other brands and then trimming and painting the brand on. Nothing wrong with the end product, the Urus is a fun thing and the Bentayga is a nice thing to bumble around in and both make a great noise and are a hoot to hoon as much as they are to crawl but they're both a lot of money for an imported, generic suit and some local tailoring.
For me, the Cayenne is the best performance van on the market still and I'm not even remotely close to being any kind of Porsche fan but generally repulsed by their ubiquity and the all too often the cheap punter at the helm but that is a distortion from growing up and living in central London where they've never been much more than the go to object for middle aged blokes who have no interest in cars but have reached the promotion level where they must now have one of these objects.
SDK said:
Running such a vehicle on electricity is more eco-friendly than doing it on dino tears !
Only on paper in the case of premium hybrids. Plugging one's hybrid in to the house or parking space is an act of frugality and the bigger the spend the less need there is to maximise cost savings and the trade off between saving a few pennies v the convenience of never bothering with the manual labour of plugging in occurs very quickly in consumers as shown in the data from urban hybrid users over the years. This isn't a product where the urban operator wants to use the electric motor for almost everything and dutifully plugs it in every day and where their usage scenario is a genuine improvement over the comparable ICE. This is very much the other end of the spectrum where not only is the EV element there for extra performance but for tax savings and road and parking advantages and in addition the reward of that lovely V8 engine and the fact that you really aren't going to be bothering to plug it in when you park, standing in the sun or the rain faffing about doing something that is worth absolutely nothing to you.
Something like the full EV G Wagon does very much comply to the logic that regardless how much electricity it uses it is cleaner and better than its corresponding ICE. This hybrid? We have to be honest with ourselves as we know that it'll actually be worse than the ICE as the V8 now has to do more work carrying the considerable weight of the tax savings and VW legislative compliance.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff