RE: Top Gear Test Track Record Smashed
Discussion
Mars said:
Their own criteria for cars they will consider is for any road legal car which can manage a road hump. Can anyone confirm whether the Ultima could?
Shame they are liars isn't it, as the episode in 2003 when they tested 5 "track" cars back to back have been dropped from the powerlap list. A Caterham R400 may not be the most practical car about, but it certainly goes over speed humps !Radical SR3 - 1:19.8
Westfield XTR2 - 1:23.2
Ariel Atom 2 - 1:24.0
Caterham R400 - 1:25.0
Lotus Elise Sport - 1:28.2
That Ultima time is incredible, last year Dunlop tested a Caterham CSR260 at Dunsfold and similarly "broke" the record by a few tenths (1:17.3 IIRC). But that is seconds ! Wow.
OK, so these are all track days cars, not everyday cars but since when have they pretended to be anything else ? What is more they are BRITISH and affordable.
If
s me off royaly when car manufactures take their pretend "race" cars and sell them as track eating monsters. Trouble is people REALLY believe that their lard-arse BMW or Audi or Merc is in fact a Le Mans car with carpets and a Bose sound system. Talk about rubbing it in.
Ultima said said:
The Ultima GTR720 tested is a full road going car with compliant suspension and often used as a daily driver. All the vehicles produced by Ultima Sports Ltd have the usual road luxuries such as air conditioning, ICE, leather trim, sealed luggage carrying compartments and of course road car levels of ground clearance suitable for speed humps and other road obstacles
Speed bumps aren't a problem with most cars if you're careful. It's certainly easier to get over a speed bump in a Caterham than an F40 or probably a Koenigsegg.
Yes, I can only assume that Top Gear do have something against kit cars. If you look at a Caterham on the face of it though, it has a boot, it's reliable, cheap to run and the hood (if you have one) doesn't leak. It has so many plus points over other cars they test that I can't understand why they have this strange policy. You can walk into a showroom and buy a new factory built Caterham, so why not test one? They are made to a very high standard. They keep banging on about Britishness, and have this so called blokey ethos, but they appear to be frightened of testing the very epicentre of the British car industry, which is hand built cars like Morgans, Caterhams, Ginettas etc. We mustn't forget that the Caterham started life as the Lotus 7 which, along with the Elan, was available for self build at home purely to avoid purchase tax. They seem to like modern Lotuses, but forget that Lotuses are in effect in the same family as these other British cars. Even their beloved Aston Martins were, until a few years ago, hand built in a shed.
And it's worth mentioning their double standards. They harped on about the Ariel Atom for ages, and Clarkson loved the thing, yet they won't test a Caterham, which is in a similar vein to the Atom, just slightly more practical and has a heritage going back 50 years. strange...
Yes, I can only assume that Top Gear do have something against kit cars. If you look at a Caterham on the face of it though, it has a boot, it's reliable, cheap to run and the hood (if you have one) doesn't leak. It has so many plus points over other cars they test that I can't understand why they have this strange policy. You can walk into a showroom and buy a new factory built Caterham, so why not test one? They are made to a very high standard. They keep banging on about Britishness, and have this so called blokey ethos, but they appear to be frightened of testing the very epicentre of the British car industry, which is hand built cars like Morgans, Caterhams, Ginettas etc. We mustn't forget that the Caterham started life as the Lotus 7 which, along with the Elan, was available for self build at home purely to avoid purchase tax. They seem to like modern Lotuses, but forget that Lotuses are in effect in the same family as these other British cars. Even their beloved Aston Martins were, until a few years ago, hand built in a shed.
And it's worth mentioning their double standards. They harped on about the Ariel Atom for ages, and Clarkson loved the thing, yet they won't test a Caterham, which is in a similar vein to the Atom, just slightly more practical and has a heritage going back 50 years. strange...
jon- said:
sniff petrol said:
jon- said:
"standard road tyres", anyone know what these are? I see a lot of ultimatas on shaved track tyres (normally the Kumho V70a) which is probably worth 2 or 3 of those seconds over a high performance road tyre.
So you mean if they put those tyres on the Liana then Werry Togan would get round in under a minute! Wow thats some tyre!RobM77 said:
Speed bumps aren't a problem with most cars if you're careful. It's certainly easier to get over a speed bump in a Caterham than an F40 or probably a Koenigsegg.
Koenigsegg has a fast front end lift but actually passes over most speed bumps without using it. I'm pretty sure a driver that knows the Koenigsegg as well as the Ultima lot know their own car would redress the balance.
But if they did admit the Ultima/Caterhams of this world, would the supercar manufacturers be so willing to lend them a car?
I'm guessing the majority of Top Gear viewers are more interested in poster cars being driven rather than the less known efforts...
Still, that means when I treat myself to an Ultima for my 30th, less people will know what it is!
I'm guessing the majority of Top Gear viewers are more interested in poster cars being driven rather than the less known efforts...
Still, that means when I treat myself to an Ultima for my 30th, less people will know what it is!
It's because one Caterham is much like another. It's been the same car for 30 years, with minor changes (no bad thing - if it ain't broke, don't fix it). They tend to review high profile, new cars. Clarkson reviewed one in the times (and gave it 5 stars) and they did that challenge where Stig in a Caterham raced against them building one so it's not like they have anything against them.
I'm not sure why they haven't had an Ultima on - I'd like to see it. I get the impression that Ultima have an occasionally abrasive relationship with the press? Is this the reason?
I'm very interested to see how the Camparo matches up to that time. Their high technology 'ultimate track car' is going to look pretty pointless if it doesn't beat a relatively conventional spaceframed car with a big chevy.
I'm not sure why they haven't had an Ultima on - I'd like to see it. I get the impression that Ultima have an occasionally abrasive relationship with the press? Is this the reason?
I'm very interested to see how the Camparo matches up to that time. Their high technology 'ultimate track car' is going to look pretty pointless if it doesn't beat a relatively conventional spaceframed car with a big chevy.
E4UAN said:
That's a great time, real achievement. Was there any info if it was actually a production model, ie you could walk up and buy an identical one from Ultima, or had it been specially modded for the track? That could be how TG try to differentiate it from the supercars.
The GTR720 is a standard Ultima model, yes.
well done Ultima, finally we now know what we were thinking of for a long time, and they did it, and how
jl34 said:
Ultima's are far more usable than some people give them credit for. I had a passenger seat ride in the red 535bhp demonstrator and couldnt believe how comfortable the seats were, loads of headroom, full airconditioning, and very reasonable ride quality. They are very much as usable on the road and a lot less stressful than worrying about scratching your Zonda-egg-enzo
Much more usable than the other hypercars mentioned as well as a fraction of the price, Servicing a chevy V8 is about 157 times cheaper than a Zonda !, what planet are some people on!?
Looks better than a Zonda IMHO too. The Zonda is a fake racer, covered in the sort of tinsel that makes it appeal to rock stars. The Ultima GTR is a race car trimmed for the road - ie how a true supercar should be.Much more usable than the other hypercars mentioned as well as a fraction of the price, Servicing a chevy V8 is about 157 times cheaper than a Zonda !, what planet are some people on!?
Its ethos is no different from the likes of the F50 or Carrera GT and I see no reason why the lap time shouldn't stand.
Supercars / hypercars are all about posing though, right? They're a big 'look at how much money I have' statement. They have to look flashy Zonda or Lambo style.
If people with quarter of a million to blow on a car wanted a stripped out road racer they could buy an old lemans car, stick some appropriate lights on it and get it through an SVA test. Or, better still, make a road legal Indy car like that bloke int the states.
As far as the Ultimas time comaprison goes - I would say this shows it is potentially faster than the Konig in the hands of the stig. It's impossible to tell how much of the time difference comes from the familliarity of the driver with the car. Presumably, if he's a test driver that Ultima use regualrly, he has a lot of track time in this car.
If people with quarter of a million to blow on a car wanted a stripped out road racer they could buy an old lemans car, stick some appropriate lights on it and get it through an SVA test. Or, better still, make a road legal Indy car like that bloke int the states.
As far as the Ultimas time comaprison goes - I would say this shows it is potentially faster than the Konig in the hands of the stig. It's impossible to tell how much of the time difference comes from the familliarity of the driver with the car. Presumably, if he's a test driver that Ultima use regualrly, he has a lot of track time in this car.
Twincam16 said:
jl34 said:
Ultima's are far more usable than some people give them credit for. I had a passenger seat ride in the red 535bhp demonstrator and couldnt believe how comfortable the seats were, loads of headroom, full airconditioning, and very reasonable ride quality. They are very much as usable on the road and a lot less stressful than worrying about scratching your Zonda-egg-enzo
Much more usable than the other hypercars mentioned as well as a fraction of the price, Servicing a chevy V8 is about 157 times cheaper than a Zonda !, what planet are some people on!?
Looks better than a Zonda IMHO too. The Zonda is a fake racer, covered in the sort of tinsel that makes it appeal to rock stars. The Ultima GTR is a race car trimmed for the road - ie how a true supercar should be.Much more usable than the other hypercars mentioned as well as a fraction of the price, Servicing a chevy V8 is about 157 times cheaper than a Zonda !, what planet are some people on!?
Its ethos is no different from the likes of the F50 or Carrera GT and I see no reason why the lap time shouldn't stand.
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