RE: Ariel Atom 500 V8 Announced

[otolith]

Miguel said:

depending on how you configure the car (engine placement, transmission, etc.), you can have a weight bias toward the rear, giving you more traction, while keeping roughly the same weight.

The advantage is obvious. You have more traction, and thus initial acceleration, as well as acceleration when cornering, or under other adverse conditions, while adding no more weight to compromise your acceleration because the extra weight providing more traction is over your driving wheels, whereas your total weight is the same.

Yes, that's fair enough, driven wheels and weight distribution will contribute to determining how close to the theoretical limit of friction can actually be achieved under acceleration.

[BigBen]

Los Angeles said:

I suspect you are right, Ben, about the publicity.

Gordon Murray is working on a "radical city car unlike any other." I wonder if it will be a more upright version of the Ariel? What's your thoughts?

The problem Ariel have had is they have an 18 month waiting list for the cars so it does not really need updating, however without a signficant update the magazines don't really feature the car. For instance the new Atom 3 has been out for a while now but has not generated much media interest as it is not visually different from the Atom 2 and is not a great deal faster. The 500 will give them a lot of media coverage because it is bonkers in the way the 300 was when it came out.

How do you mean an upright version of the Atom, I would think apart from lightweight the Atom would be a rubbish starting point for a city car.

Ben

[simonrockman]

BigBen said:

Ariel won't make more than a handfull of the V8 model but will get a disproportionate amount of publicity through doing so.

Ariel already gets a disproportionate amount of publicity thanks to Honda - I'd guess the TV ads during an F1 race would cost as much as an Atom.

It might be counter-productive to make too much noise about a different engine.

Simon

[IforB]

simonrockman said:

BigBen said:

Ariel won't make more than a handfull of the V8 model but will get a disproportionate amount of publicity through doing so.

Ariel already gets a disproportionate amount of publicity thanks to Honda - I'd guess the TV ads during an F1 race would cost as much as an Atom.

It might be counter-productive to make too much noise about a different engine.

Simon

They might cost as much as an Atom per second, not an Atom per advert.

[GT40]

Whilst on the subject of the Atom, does anyone know if anything more happened about the super Rocket that was talked about at the time?

[BigBen]

Los Angeles said:

BigBen said:

How do you mean an upright version of the Atom, I would think apart from lightweight the Atom would be a rubbish starting point for a city car.

I was thinking a modular, tubular sort of structure, with no side door entry, but I'd rather hear why you think it will be useless.

I am not sure I see what you mean, I don't think the G Murray city car will be useless just that it will have little in common with the Atom apart from being light. No side doors would make a city car far too much of a compromise, then again GM keeps hinting that the city car will be nothing like anything else.

Ben

[Scotty CSL]

I was speaking to Tom at the factory today.

The price of the 500 BHP Atom is expected to be around £100k

£10k deposit if anyone is interested....

And yes my 10k is on it's way to them......lol

If and when i get any further details on spec, delivery and 0-60 times etc i will post them up for all to see.

Roll on the Spring!

Regards

ScottyB

[sniff petrol]

BigBen said:

Gazboy said:

sniff petrol said:

How long ago since F1 cars had this kind of PWR?

Total guess- 1990?

I would think a lot further back than that. An F1 car is around 500kg and the turbo engines in the 80s put out around the 1000bhp mark. Doubt an F1 engine has been as low as 500bhp since the 70's some time.

Ben

The last win for a Cosworth DFV in F1 was at the 1983 USA GP in a Tyrrell with circa 510bhp and 540kgs

After that all the competitive cars were turbos then went to 3.5l and more powerful. So food for thought, an Ariel Atom with a better PWR than a 25 year old GP winning car.

Edited by sniff petrol on Saturday 12th April 12:32

[BigBen]

Los Angeles said:

BigBen said:

then again GM keeps hinting that the city car will be nothing like anything else.

That's what I mean, Ben. Hard to imagine something that has good crash protection yet is also light, easy to assemble, and cheap to run and own, that doesn't follow the Ariel's example. Murray has said he admires the Lotus philosophy, so I guess it might have plastic panels - but it's the main frame that intrigues me.

The Atom frame is probably quite time consuming to manufacture so out of keeping with a city car that needs to be low cost, also it is made of steel so probably not as light as it could be if made from some advanced composites / plastics which I speculate the city car might be.

Might be interesting to start a thread speculating / guessing about the city car, I am sure plenty of folks will be interested.

Ben

[John Lloyd]

Scotty CSL said:

I was speaking to Tom at the factory today.

The price of the 500 BHP Atom is expected to be around £100k

£10k deposit if anyone is interested....

And yes my 10k is on it's way to them......lol

If and when i get any further details on spec, delivery and 0-60 times etc i will post them up for all to see.

Roll on the Spring!

Regards

ScottyB

Which Spring? They already have an 18 month waiting list.

[peter pan]

The Atom frame is made by Arch who manufactured the chassis frames for Caterhams.
The quality and workmanship can only be described as devastatingly good, with huge attention to detail. In one way it is good that the Atom has no bodywork to speak of, because you can see how well the frame is made.
If anyone has any doubts regarding how well a Caterham frame is put together, have a look at the Caterham race crash at quarry bend, Castle Coombe. This crash was even shown on American TV recently, and shows how a light car can be much safer than a heavy car in a crash ( far less energy to be dissipated ) It was still a mega crash though!

[Scotty CSL]

John Lloyd said:

Which Spring? They already have an 18 month waiting list.

18 Month waiting list for the 500 or for the Atom 3's John?

Can't see them waiting 18 months to launch the new 500 can you?

I must hold my hands up i had a nod and a wink about an Ariel with attitude a while ago so never ordered an Ariel 3, i know there is a waiting list, 14 months when i last enquired, hence the good residuals on second hand cars. 1 thing Ariel seem very good at managing this waiting list and over runs are kept down to a minimum.

They will be wanting to get a 500 on the road and into the press ASAP.

My understanding is different variation of the car new "List" therfore no 18 month wait, but still a wait none the less.

Have asked the question and will let you know what comes back.

Regards

ScottyB

[BigBen]

Scotty CSL said:

1 thing Ariel seem very good at managing this waiting list and over runs are kept down to a minimum.

:ROFL: I think anyone who has ordered one will disagree with you there.

However I agree that the 500 will not be subject to the same delays as they need them out and about for magazine / TV use etc. Currently 18 months for a 'cooking' Atom like the 300

Ben

[Scotty CSL]

No worse than any other maker Ben,

2 Ariel owners i know quoted 12 months got them around 3-4 weeks late, not bad going!

Makes Porsche look useless in comparison!

My 997 turbo was 7 months late, my GT2 order was quoted Q1/2 2008, quite happy to have a flutter that i won't see it until 2009 if i am lucky. Bloody thing is just a number on a screen, they haven't even started building it yet!

ScottyB

[rubystone]

Los Angeles said:

I suspect you are right, Ben, about the publicity.

Gordon Murray is working on a "radical city car unlike any other." I wonder if it will be a more upright version of the Ariel? What's your thoughts?

My thoughts?...he has been trotting out that line for at least the last decade....

[peon]

ATOM F1 UNAUTHORISED
Love it. Ariel's got the goods and the 500 is a real looker.

Ariel with 500bhp presents all sorts of brilliant new problems. Launch control and traction control will help you win a few traffic light drags and save a well healed (but potentially low skilled) pilot some embarrasment, but if you want race winning high corner speeds you are going to need more downforce and possibly more grip than the little wings and tyres seen in the photos can provide.

I can't wait for some serious go fast type to modify this car. Expect to see a bigger fuel tank (for range), a dog ugly triple slotted F1 style (but wider) wing at the back, and another full F1 styley comedy grin double wing at the front. The tyres will grow as much as the geometry can handle.

Call it the Atom F1 Unauthorised, and some committed privateer is going to have a serious, possibly unbeatable, get-round-the-track-quick piece of kit. Now if we could just figure out a way to increase the power...

[sniff petrol]

Which will be the first RST V8 powered car to hit the road then - this or the Caterham 500?

Has this engine been used by a customer on the road yet, in any car? Why did Caparo drop this engine in the end?

[dinkel]

Just curious: is Ariel bigger than C'ham at the mo? Or growing in . . .

[sniff petrol]

dinkel said:

Just curious: is Ariel bigger than C'ham at the mo? Or growing in . . .

Caterham sell far more cars than Ariel even in just the UK, something like 300 per year vs 10

[dinkel]

Wow! Those Ariels look so popular . . .