RE: PH Heroes: Alpine A110

RE: PH Heroes: Alpine A110

Author
Discussion

Mojocvh

16,837 posts

263 months

Friday 24th April 2009
quotequote all
tank slapper said:


I've always like them. A great looking car.
Is that before or after the special stage??

tank slapper

7,949 posts

284 months

Friday 24th April 2009
quotequote all
That was taken at rally day 2007 at the beginning of the stage.

Jem Thompson

930 posts

183 months

Monday 27th April 2009
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So did it use an existing Renault chassis, or a completely new one built by Alpine? I know it said the running gear was taken from the Renault 8 but I am not sure if this includes the chassis or not. Can't imagine we will see anything like this again, the manufacturers are far too conservative these days, and all the small companies seem intent on building hellishly fast (though only on paper and in the creators head), yet dodgy looking supercars.

Essex Exile

390 posts

194 months

Monday 27th April 2009
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One of the most beautiful cars ever built. The proportions are perfect

Squabbler

3,139 posts

206 months

Monday 27th April 2009
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Anybody heard about this?

Bertone Renault Simca S

dinkel

26,959 posts

259 months

Monday 27th April 2009
quotequote all
Aha, small cars eh?


HAB

3,632 posts

228 months

Monday 27th April 2009
quotequote all
Jem Thompson said:
So did it use an existing Renault chassis, or a completely new one built by Alpine? I know it said the running gear was taken from the Renault 8 but I am not sure if this includes the chassis or not.
Alpine used their own central tubular backbone chassis in the A110.



The A110 was actually an evolution of the A108(which if anything, is even prettier than the A110 imho.)
which in turn was an evolution of the A106. iirc they all used Alpines own backbone chassis


A108




A106


I absolutely love Alpines, really wish they were still building cars and evolving the rear-engined layout.

Essex Exile

390 posts

194 months

Tuesday 28th April 2009
quotequote all
Squabbler said:
Anybody heard about this?

Bertone Renault Simca S
PEDANT ALERT!!!
That ain't no Renault!!!
There was an article about the Simca 1220S in Classic & Sportscar a couple of months back.
Another very pretty little French effort.
Much Like Nicole, really.

h4887

278 posts

241 months

Tuesday 28th April 2009
quotequote all
don logan said:
I LOVE these cars!

I once saw a 110 parked outside a hotel in Chamonix being shown to a Japanese man looking to buy it!

They ARE tiny!
They're not so tiny if you previously had a Ginetta G15!

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Wednesday 6th May 2009
quotequote all
A bit late to this thread but hope that I can provide some information for you.
The article by Richard Heseltine was produced when he drove my 1600S in 2007 for an article in Motor Sport but the pictures are not of my car.

The note that HAB placed with the excellent picture of the chassis for a swing-axle A110 says that the A106 used a backbone chassis but actually the A106 and early A108s were built onto a Renault 4CV floorpan. The backbone chassis was introduced on the A108 Cabriolet and the, as he says, carried through all subsequent Alpines including the A610.

The picture of the yellow car is an A110, the A108 Berlinette had intakes in front of the rear wheels to take air to the radiator that was at the front of the engine bay. On the A110 they were closed off because the cars had radiators that were either at the back of the car or ducted in the nose.

There was earlier a question about performance etc of the 1600S. Well There were three variants of the 1600S, the 1600VB from 1970 to 1973 fitted with a 1565cc engine, the 1605cc 1600VC from 1973 to 1974 and the 1600VD from 1974 to 1975, also with 1605cc engines, known as the 1600SC in carburettor form and 1600SI with fuel injection.

The 1565cc "1600 S" from 1969 to 1973 (1600 VB)

The "1600 S" was first shown at the Paris Salon of 1969. It was the homologation production base car for Alpine's then current competition cars. It was fitted with a heavily modified 1565cc engine that had larger inlet valves, a camshaft with substantial valve lift and overlap, a 10.25:1 compression ratio and induction via two twin-choke Weber 45 DCOE carburettors. The "1600 S" was fitted as standard with a 5-speed all synchromesh gearbox with a reinforced differential assembly.

The "1600 S" was homologated for Group 4 competition on 1 January 1970 and sufficient examples had been built by 1 October 1970 to enable Group 3 homologation with the weight given as 650 kg, some 80 kg less than the quoted weight of the "1600" (1600VA)

A 1596cc "Groupe 4 Usine" version incorporated all the necessary modifications for rallying with engine development by Marc Mignotet. The cars had a lightweight bodyshell which weighed approximately 50% of the standard weight, but overall weights of the Group 4 cars generally ranged from a Gp.4 homologated minimum of 685 kg up to about 730 kg. The car also incorporated “big” brakes, perspex side windows and rear screen, Hewland LSD and a 98 litre flexible fuel tank mounted inside the cockpit. The bodyshell was widened by the addition of the flat "pagoda" arch extensions to cover wider wheels.

It is thought that about 800 "1600 VB" were produced. Unfortunately factory records do not split the total production of the "1600 VB" and the next version of the "1600 S" which used a 1605cc engine, the "1600 VC".

1972 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 35,400 FFr
1972 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 52,400 FFr

The 1605cc "1600 S" from 1972 to 1974 (1600 VC)

From mid-1972 the "1600 S" was fitted with a 1605cc engine and the type designation became "1600 VC". This was the same engine that had been fitted to the Alpine A310 from 1971 and was used with the same 5-speed gearbox as on the 1600VB. By increasing the capacity above 1600cc the Berlinette could now be homologated in the next higher capacity class at 1800cc. The 1600 VC was homologated for Group 3 on 1 July 1972 at 710 kg.

The 1798cc engine for the "1600 S Group 4 Usine" was again developed by Marc Mignotet who increased the bore from 77mm to 82.5mm and incorporated his normal tuning modifications. The power output was raised to about 165hp DIN, 180+hp SAE, at 7,000 rpm with a 40% increase in torque compared with the standard "1600 S". These changes enabled Alpine to field cars with sufficient power to win the inaugural World Rally Championship for Makes in 1973 with their 1800cc A110 Berlinette.

The total number of "1600 S" produced is generally reported as 1550 or 1660. However, it is not known how many were the "1600 VC" and how many were "1600 VB"; see previous section. However, it is probable that between 750 and 850 were the "1600 VC" variant.

1973 "1600 S" 1605cc / 140hp / 710 kg / 210 kph / 37,900 F
1973 "1800 Gp 4 Usine" 1798cc / 185hp / 710 to 750 kg / 252 kph / ? F


The 1605cc "1600 SC" and "1600 SI" from 1974 to 1975 (1600 VD)

In 1974 the rear suspension was changed from swing axles to the double wishbone configuration of the A310. The cars were named the "1600 SC" and the "1600 SI" to differentiate between models with Weber carburettors for France, the "SC", and Bosch electronic fuel injection intended for certain export markets, the "SI". The "1600 SC" and the "1600 SI" share the same type designation of "1600 VD". The power output quoted for the "1600 SC" was 140bhp SAE and for the "1600 SI" was 145 bhp.

A "Groupe 3 Usine" version was offered in 1975 with a 5-speed gearbox that had been suitably strengthened for rallying. On the "1600 SI" version the Bosch fuel injection was replaced by a Lucas competition system.

There are three ways to recognise these later cars: the external door handles were deleted and replaced by a push button, the number of wheel nuts changed from 3 for the original swing axle cars to 4 for the later cars with double wishbone rear suspension and a de-mountable rear panel provided easier access for engine/gearbox removal.

The total number of 1600 VD produced is reported as from 481 to 588.

1975 "1600 SC / 1600 SI" 1605cc /140hp/145hp / 710 kg / 210 kph /40,100 F

The last of the 1600cc cars was the "1600 SX", with a 1647cc engine,was first exhibited at the Paris Salon of 1975. Its specification had been heavily influenced by regulations concerning emissions and by the recent fuel crisis. Though it lacked the performance of the 1600S it was considerably quieter and less demanding to drive. The "1600 SX" was the only Berlinette in production in France when the A110 production came to an end at Dieppe in July 1977.

The 389 "1600 SX" brought the final total of A110 Berlinettes produced in France to 7176.

1976 "1600 SX" 1647cc / 109hp / 790 kg / 195 kph / 49,900 F




HAB

3,632 posts

228 months

Wednesday 6th May 2009
quotequote all
Fantastic info, Tim!

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Wednesday 6th May 2009
quotequote all
HAB, thanks for your comment.
Some top level information can be found at the home page of Club Alpine Renault, the longest established club in UK for Alpine enthusiasts, http://www.clubalpinerenault.org.uk/index.asp
Otherwise I'm always pleased to help anyone interested in the A110 and can be contacted at berlinette@tiscali.co.uk.

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Friday 8th May 2009
quotequote all
A bit more about the Alpine A110 and licence built variants:

How much did Alpine A110 Berlinettes cost, what is their homologated weight and what was their top speed?
(Note: Powers are SAE hp)

1963 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 16,650 F
1964 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 16,850 F
1964 "1100" 1108cc / 66hp / 565 kg / 175 kph / 17,790 F
1965 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 17,590 F
1965 "1100" 1108cc / 66hp / 565 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1965 "85" 1108cc / 85hp / 610 kg / 180 kph / 19,780 F
1965 "1100 Comp" 1108cc / 90hp / 565 kg / 190 kph / 22,790 F
1965 "1100 Comp.5 Speed" 1108cc / 90hp / 565 kg / 196 kph / 25,140 F
1966 "Standard" 1108cc / 66hp / 610 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1966 "Standard Hautes Perf" 1108cc / 95hp / 565 kg / 185 kph / 19,015 F
1966 "100" 1108cc / 95hp / 590 kg / 195 kph / 23,290 F
1966 "1300" 1296cc / 115hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 27,200 F
1967 "70" 1108cc / 66hp / 610 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1967 FASA "A110-1100" 1108cc / 53hp / 695 kg / 166 kph / 185,000 ptas
1967 "100" 1108cc / 95hp / 590 kg / 195 kph / 22,890 F
1967 "1300" 1255cc / 105hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 23,950 F
1967 "1300 S" 1296cc / 120hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 27,200 F
1967 "1300 S Usine" 1296cc / / 605 kg / 230 kph / 34,348 F
1967 "1500" 1470cc / 82hp / 700 kg / 185 kph / 20,690 F
1968 FASA "A110-1100" 1108cc / 58hp / 695 kg / 172 kph
1968 "1500" 1470cc / 82hp / 700 kg / 185 kph / 20,690 F
1969 "1600" 1565cc / 92hp / 730 kg / 195 kph / 25,600 F
1970 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 21,600 F
1970 "1300 G" 1255cc / 103hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 26,600 F
1970 "1300 S (Mignotet)" 1296cc / 132hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 32,000 F
1970 "1600" 1565cc / 102hp / 730 kg / 195 kph / 26,700 F
1970 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 30,840 F
1970 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 47,100 F
1971 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 22,520 F
1971 FASA "A110-1300" 1289cc / 76hp / 695 kg / 171 kph / 198.000 ptas
1971 "1300 G" 1255cc / 103hp / 625 kg / 205 kph / 28,670 F
1971 "1300 S (Mignotet)" 1296cc / 132hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 32,400 F
1971 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 31,760 F
1971 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 47,100 F
1972 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 25,400 F
1972 FASA "A110-1300" 1289cc / 76hp / 695 kg / 175 kph
1972 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 35,400 F
1972 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 52,400 F
1973 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 26,900 F
1973 "1600 S" 1605cc / 140hp / 710 kg / 210 kph / 37,900 F
1973 "1800 Gp 4 Usine" 1798cc / 185hp / 710 to 750 kg / 252 kph / ? F
1974 "1600 SC / 1600 SI" 1605cc / 140hp(SC)/145hp(SI) / 710 kg / 210 kph / 38,600 F
1975 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 28,700 F
1975 "1600 SC/1600 SI" 1605cc / 140hp(SC)/145hp(SI) / 710 kg / 210 kph / 40,100 F
1976 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 41,100 F
1976 "1600 SX" 1647cc / 109hp / 790 kg / 195 kph / 49,900 F
1977 "1600 SX" 1647cc / 109hp / 790 kg / 195 kph / 49,900 F
1977 FASA "A110-1400" 1397cc / 98hp / 710 kg / 184 kph / 476,600 ptas

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Friday 8th May 2009
quotequote all
A bit more about the A110 and licence-built variants:

How much did Alpine A110 Berlinettes cost, what is their homologated weight and what was their top speed?
(Note: Powers are SAE hp)

1963 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 16,650 F
1964 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 16,850 F
1964 "1100" 1108cc / 66hp / 565 kg / 175 kph / 17,790 F
1965 "1000" 956cc / 55hp / 565 kg / 170 kph / 17,590 F
1965 "1100" 1108cc / 66hp / 565 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1965 "85" 1108cc / 85hp / 610 kg / 180 kph / 19,780 F
1965 "1100 Comp" 1108cc / 90hp / 565 kg / 190 kph / 22,790 F
1965 "1100 Comp.5 Speed" 1108cc / 90hp / 565 kg / 196 kph / 25,140 F
1966 "Standard" 1108cc / 66hp / 610 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1966 "Standard Hautes Perf" 1108cc / 95hp / 565 kg / 185 kph / 19,015 F
1966 "100" 1108cc / 95hp / 590 kg / 195 kph / 23,290 F
1966 "1300" 1296cc / 115hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 27,200 F
1967 "70" 1108cc / 66hp / 610 kg / 175 kph / 17,890 F
1967 FASA "A110-1100" 1108cc / 53hp / 695 kg / 166 kph / 185,000 ptas
1967 "100" 1108cc / 95hp / 590 kg / 195 kph / 22,890 F
1967 "1300" 1255cc / 105hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 23,950 F
1967 "1300 S" 1296cc / 120hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 27,200 F
1967 "1300 S Usine" 1296cc / / 605 kg / 230 kph / 34,348 F
1967 "1500" 1470cc / 82hp / 700 kg / 185 kph / 20,690 F
1968 FASA "A110-1100" 1108cc / 58hp / 695 kg / 172 kph
1968 "1500" 1470cc / 82hp / 700 kg / 185 kph / 20,690 F
1969 "1600" 1565cc / 92hp / 730 kg / 195 kph / 25,600 F
1970 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 21,600 F
1970 "1300 G" 1255cc / 103hp / 625 kg / 215 kph / 26,600 F
1970 "1300 S (Mignotet)" 1296cc / 132hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 32,000 F
1970 "1600" 1565cc / 102hp / 730 kg / 195 kph / 26,700 F
1970 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 30,840 F
1970 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 47,100 F
1971 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 22,520 F
1971 FASA "A110-1300" 1289cc / 76hp / 695 kg / 171 kph / 198.000 ptas
1971 "1300 G" 1255cc / 103hp / 625 kg / 205 kph / 28,670 F
1971 "1300 S (Mignotet)" 1296cc / 132hp / 605 kg / 220 kph / 32,400 F
1971 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 31,760 F
1971 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 47,100 F
1972 "85" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 25,400 F
1972 FASA "A110-1300" 1289cc / 76hp / 695 kg / 175 kph
1972 "1600 S" 1565cc / 138hp / 650 kg / 215 kph / 35,400 F
1972 "1600 S Gp IV" 1596cc / 172hp / 685 kg / 225 kph / 52,400 F
1973 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 26,900 F
1973 "1600 S" 1605cc / 140hp / 710 kg / 210 kph / 37,900 F
1973 "1800 Gp 4 Usine" 1798cc / 185hp / 710 to 750 kg / 252 kph / ? F
1974 "1600 SC / 1600 SI" 1605cc / 140hp(SC)/145hp(SI) / 710 kg / 210 kph / 38,600 F
1975 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 28,700 F
1975 "1600 SC/1600 SI" 1605cc / 140hp(SC)/145hp(SI) / 710 kg / 210 kph / 40,100 F
1976 "1300" 1289cc / 81hp / 700 kg / 180 kph / 41,100 F
1976 "1600 SX" 1647cc / 109hp / 790 kg / 195 kph / 49,900 F
1977 "1600 SX" 1647cc / 109hp / 790 kg / 195 kph / 49,900 F
1977 FASA "A110-1400" 1397cc / 98hp / 710 kg / 184 kph / 476,600 ptas



dinkel

26,959 posts

259 months

Saturday 9th May 2009
quotequote all
I don't think topspeed is the main thing about these cars . . .

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Wednesday 20th May 2009
quotequote all
Hi dinkel

Couldn't agree more. The essence of the A110 Berlinette in all of the variants is the dynamics of the car, the aesthetics, the aural environment. It's a sensual experience and nothing compares to being in an A110 on a mountain pass with the feel of the car and the sound of the inlet and exhaust inside the car and echoing off the rock faces. If you can't actually be in one then just hearing an A110 being driven with enthusiasm is fabulous.
Someone once said that Escorts growl, Stratos bark but Alpines scream.
If you go back to Richrad Heseltine's article you will see just how taken he was with my car and I had the great pleasure of having Richard navigate for me on a rally in England towards the end of last year. Unfortunately it was extremely cold and there was a problem with the heater but the heated screen worked fine.
If you want to see some A110s in action then visit the Bugatti Owners Club hillclimb at Prescott on 23 & 24 May where Club Alpine Renault will have a stand. Club Alpine Renault will also have a site at the upcoming Silvertone historic festival.
See also http://www.clubalpinerenault.org.uk/

Tim Moores

dinkel

26,959 posts

259 months

Wednesday 20th May 2009
quotequote all
Cheers.

The funny thing is Lotus Europa had the same engine in . . . but everybody wants the Ford TC in!

Strange eh?

Tim Moores

8 posts

185 months

Thursday 21st May 2009
quotequote all
Sorry dinkel but the Lotus Europa didn't have the same engine as the 1600S. The type 46 Europa had a low power 1470cc engine from the Renault 16 with a single progressive twin-choke downdraught carburettor that produced only 82 hp. This was the same unit that was used in the A110 "1500" that weighed around 700 kg as compared with the Type 46 Europa that weighed just over 660 kg.

The first Twin Cam powered Europa was the Type 74 of 1971 that was powered by the 105hp 1558cc engine and still only had a 4-speed gearbox as compared to the A110 1600S of the period that were produced with 138hp 1565cc engines and 5-speed gearboxes.

It wasn't until late 1972 that the Europa was available with the 126 hp "big valve" engine and 5-speed gearbox and by then the weight of the Europa had risen to 713kg as compared to the 138 hp 1600S at 650kg.

dinkel

26,959 posts

259 months

Sunday 24th May 2009
quotequote all
Thanx, I thought the basis was the same engine.

My review here:
http://pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f...

geeeman

1,310 posts

256 months

Saturday 14th November 2009
quotequote all
i love the a110, but way too expensive so i went to france and got an a310 few yrs ago


but one of the greatest giant killers has to be the Ginetta G4, with only 997cc or 1500 cortina lump, it was so successful against much more highly powered machines, i have one of those too...