RE: Driven: Ferrari 458 Italia
Discussion
Not Ideal said:
Rawwr said:
@harrismonkey
chris harris
Best PistonHeads comment? In response to Ferrari press 458 having £13k optional paintwork: "For £13k, I'd want it painted in Jesus's spunk."
Rawwr said:
Not Ideal said:
Rawwr said:
@harrismonkey
chris harris
Best PistonHeads comment? In response to Ferrari press 458 having £13k optional paintwork: "For £13k, I'd want it painted in Jesus's spunk."
j_s14a said:
Gizmo! said:
b14 said:
If only it wasn't so ridiculous looking.
Like someone has beaten it with the "Chris Bangle stick"
Each to their own.Like someone has beaten it with the "Chris Bangle stick"
But I think you need to take down that poster of the Ssangyong Rodius from your wall.
B14 is right, it's fecking ugly. reminds me of...
wolves_wanderer said:
j_s14a said:
Gizmo! said:
b14 said:
If only it wasn't so ridiculous looking.
Like someone has beaten it with the "Chris Bangle stick"
Each to their own.Like someone has beaten it with the "Chris Bangle stick"
But I think you need to take down that poster of the Ssangyong Rodius from your wall.
B14 is right, it's fecking ugly. reminds me of...
There's nothing new about the styling on this car. The rear lights are similar to the f430 and Enzo, and are the worst looking parts of both those cars. The roofline/windows share a profile with the S15 Silvia Varietta, which looked ugly. The headlights look like a mix of Saab and Nissan GTR, both of which have ugly headlights. Fair play to Ferrari for being daring, but it hasn't paid off. The F430 is a much better looking car.
I'd still love to drive one though
Luca Brasi said:
PieterA said:
According to Ferrari (LDM) it's unlikely they'll build a Scuderia version, because the 458 is already that good.
That's what they said about the F430 when it came out, you can always improve a car by making it lighter and adding more power.Im not sold on the looks I have to say, then again, the McLaren doesnt either...
There are quite a few of these doing the rounds in Dubai. Yellow doesn't suit it - makes it look bulky. White is as bad. Red is OK. But in black, with cream interior, on black wheels, this car looks magic. Softens the slightly odd face caused by those lights, and makes the rear haunches seem sleek rather than a bit bulbous. In black, this is the best looking Ferrari since the 355.
Edited by Harry Flashman on Wednesday 15th December 09:51
I knew I'd open a can of worms by stating such sacrilege such as "a Ferrari is ugly".
I think it is a very unresolved design - too many lines doing too many different things. And the face is just awful. No disrespect to the driving experience, I'm sure it is great (although I do take exception to the "handles better than an Elise" comment as I will never respect a car which handles beautifully because a computer makes it so, over one which handles beautifully because the inherent mechanical design is perfect to start with - feels a bit like an airbrushed photo to me).
Ferrari trying too hard I fear. The 430 is a good design, close to classic Ferrari. This feels like a step too far.
Bring back the 355 - the last properly good looking Ferrari ever made. Or even better make it look like a 288GTO, IMO the best looking car ever made.
I think it is a very unresolved design - too many lines doing too many different things. And the face is just awful. No disrespect to the driving experience, I'm sure it is great (although I do take exception to the "handles better than an Elise" comment as I will never respect a car which handles beautifully because a computer makes it so, over one which handles beautifully because the inherent mechanical design is perfect to start with - feels a bit like an airbrushed photo to me).
Ferrari trying too hard I fear. The 430 is a good design, close to classic Ferrari. This feels like a step too far.
Bring back the 355 - the last properly good looking Ferrari ever made. Or even better make it look like a 288GTO, IMO the best looking car ever made.
Edited by b14 on Wednesday 15th December 10:50
I will admit that I am no fan of the way the 458 looks. I think the front and back half look they were designed by two different committees that never spoke to each other.
But having recently driving one at Silverstone thanks to a mate in the industry I have a few comments to make.
I for one am not celebrating the march of the modern supercar. For me the relationship between man and machine is now clouded behind a raft of electronics and sensors. Are these cars faster? Yes they are but are they more fun? I would say the jury is out on that one.
The Ferrari 458, is a great divers car, but comes with a huge caveat, I will explain based on my recent drive.
Little real skill is required to drive the 458 quickly. Your ham-fisted driving is kept under control by a computer 1000's of times more powerful than the one that put men on the moon. The slower less computer controlled Porsche GT3 RS is actually more fun to drive, just ask Chris Harris from EVO magazine.
The DSG gearbox is an amazing thing to use, but requires no finesse or skill. Yes it is very quick, but that is not the be all and end all. I love being able to use a manual gearbox well and have honed my heal and toe gear changes over the years.
As I said before the 458 is a great car, but to truly find out how interfering the electronics are, switch them off at a track and then try and drive as fast as you were before. Like the Euro fighter jet which is so unstable that it cannot fly without computer assistance, the 458 turns into a complete animal when you turn the electronics off. My lap times at Silverstone dropped by nearly 6 seconds with them off. When you turn them back on again you can really feel them working away in the background. It’s like your inputs are being translated by a committee of computers who then decide ultimately what the car needs to do on your behalf.
I am not being a Luddite here; I know progress has to continue. Cars are becoming quicker, safer and cleaner and that is to be applauded. But as the super car war continues manufactures will have to continue to add more electronics to these cars to stop the less skilled drivers from killing themselves.
The fun I get from driving fast is not about chasing that last 10th of a second here or there but its the feeling and feedback that a car gives me. One of the best drives I ever had was driving a 60's Lotus Elan with about 100bhp. To this day only a few cars I have driven have come close to having steering and feel that was a good as that car.
I am not trying to put the likes of the 458 down, I think it is a landmark car. It just feels like it has it has now turned into a computer game.
So looks aside that is why great as the 458 is it would not have a place in my fantasy garage
But having recently driving one at Silverstone thanks to a mate in the industry I have a few comments to make.
I for one am not celebrating the march of the modern supercar. For me the relationship between man and machine is now clouded behind a raft of electronics and sensors. Are these cars faster? Yes they are but are they more fun? I would say the jury is out on that one.
The Ferrari 458, is a great divers car, but comes with a huge caveat, I will explain based on my recent drive.
Little real skill is required to drive the 458 quickly. Your ham-fisted driving is kept under control by a computer 1000's of times more powerful than the one that put men on the moon. The slower less computer controlled Porsche GT3 RS is actually more fun to drive, just ask Chris Harris from EVO magazine.
The DSG gearbox is an amazing thing to use, but requires no finesse or skill. Yes it is very quick, but that is not the be all and end all. I love being able to use a manual gearbox well and have honed my heal and toe gear changes over the years.
As I said before the 458 is a great car, but to truly find out how interfering the electronics are, switch them off at a track and then try and drive as fast as you were before. Like the Euro fighter jet which is so unstable that it cannot fly without computer assistance, the 458 turns into a complete animal when you turn the electronics off. My lap times at Silverstone dropped by nearly 6 seconds with them off. When you turn them back on again you can really feel them working away in the background. It’s like your inputs are being translated by a committee of computers who then decide ultimately what the car needs to do on your behalf.
I am not being a Luddite here; I know progress has to continue. Cars are becoming quicker, safer and cleaner and that is to be applauded. But as the super car war continues manufactures will have to continue to add more electronics to these cars to stop the less skilled drivers from killing themselves.
The fun I get from driving fast is not about chasing that last 10th of a second here or there but its the feeling and feedback that a car gives me. One of the best drives I ever had was driving a 60's Lotus Elan with about 100bhp. To this day only a few cars I have driven have come close to having steering and feel that was a good as that car.
I am not trying to put the likes of the 458 down, I think it is a landmark car. It just feels like it has it has now turned into a computer game.
So looks aside that is why great as the 458 is it would not have a place in my fantasy garage
It's grown on me lots and lots visually.
Very nice design when all is considered, lots of interesting shapes hidden away there that you don't appreciate until you get to see one in 3d and move around it etc.
Performance is clearly stunning for a road car too.
My only bug-bear is the gearbox. I would actually prefer a jolty robot manual than a dsg... not sure why... something a bit more racey about them, that little pause before the next accelerative onslaught
Technically less good, but sensationally better
Dave
Very nice design when all is considered, lots of interesting shapes hidden away there that you don't appreciate until you get to see one in 3d and move around it etc.
Performance is clearly stunning for a road car too.
My only bug-bear is the gearbox. I would actually prefer a jolty robot manual than a dsg... not sure why... something a bit more racey about them, that little pause before the next accelerative onslaught
Technically less good, but sensationally better
Dave
Streetrod said:
The slower less computer controlled Porsche GT3 RS is actually more fun to drive, just ask Chris Harris from EVO magazine.
I don't think that's quite what he said, if I remember the video comparison correctly. We're talking separation of the nth degree, they're both fabulous cars in different ways.I wouldn't buy a 458 if I won the lottery, but at the same time I'd be surprised if I stepped out of one, huge s
t-eating grin on my face, and said, "Well, it's alright, but the electronics ruin it". What's personally interesting is how both Porsche and Ferrari tailor their cars for their customers, I don't think either make 'pure' cars, it's about the byline.
LongLiveTazio said:
Streetrod said:
The slower less computer controlled Porsche GT3 RS is actually more fun to drive, just ask Chris Harris from EVO magazine.
I don't think that's quite what he said, if I remember the video comparison correctly. We're talking separation of the nth degree, they're both fabulous cars in different ways.I wouldn't buy a 458 if I won the lottery, but at the same time I'd be surprised if I stepped out of one, huge s
t-eating grin on my face, and said, "Well, it's alright, but the electronics ruin it". What's personally interesting is how both Porsche and Ferrari tailor their cars for their customers, I don't think either make 'pure' cars, it's about the byline.
The whole electronics thing only really comes into play on the track. If you tried to drive one quickly on the road with the electronics off you might as well point it at the nearest hedge and be done with it as you would be there soon enough anyway.
I think it’s just a shame that a cars fundamental dynamics are dictated purely by the computers on board. To a certain extent you are more of a passenger than a driver.
But at the end of the day to most owners this is not going to be an issue. You only really start to notice the electronic interference once you get above 7/10ths. And if you are driving that fast on the road even with the best computers in the world it’s only a matter of time before you have a rather dramatic car scenery interface
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