Are there car-hating horse riders, like car-hating cyclists?
Discussion
Pigeon said:
It is possible to train/condition a horse so that it behaves safely on the road and does not freak out at things which occur on the road all the time.
No it's not. Obviously you can do your best, but every horse has the possibility to freak out, and pretty much all of them will at some point.When they do freak out, they tend to turn into approximately half a ton of panicking animal, and that's often very hard to control.
Despite the deep eyes which look like they contain deep intelligence, horses are only about as clever as dogs. They can be trained, but only so far.
Occasionally, when subjected to the usual stimulus, a horse will bolt. No idea why.
Pigeon said:
Police horses are so conditioned.
Police horses sometimes freak out with horrible consequences.I'm not going to post them here, but just looking on the web a little I found a few cases of people being killed by them (not during a mounted police charge, but rather in accidents where the horse has bolted or become flustered whilst standing still)
Don't get me wrong, they live to be good at what they do, and they are, but it's just proof that nothing is infallible.
For people who think horses should go around in single file - they aren't bicycles. They have minds of their own.
Horses are pack animals and it's always easier to keep them under control in a pack - a lone horse isn't as happy as one with a buddy.
It's common to ride side by side so they can see each other and don't panic.
The Highway code says that this is OK (not to ride "more than two abreast") - (rule 53).
It also says to keep a horse you're leading to your left (rule 52).
Highway code -- http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Hig...
C
slipstream 1985 said:
there are two kinds of freaks in the world
horse freaks
and cat freaks
infact when i see an attractive lady at work comming through my till i get really dissapointed when i see shes bought a load of catfood.... what a waste
I think I just broke your venn diagram. We have two cats and a horse.horse freaks
and cat freaks
infact when i see an attractive lady at work comming through my till i get really dissapointed when i see shes bought a load of catfood.... what a waste
CraigyMc said:
R1 Loon said:
If you'd done that to my wife, I'd have smashed your face in.
Cock.
And after you'd finished, I'd have smashed other bits of him in.Cock.
Leave me a bit!
I'm an ex horse-riding, car driving, motorcyclist.
Or maybe a motorcycling, car driving, ex-rider.
Or maybe... etc.
It's all about common sense and courtesy.
On the bike I will slow right down, often stop, and sometimes even switch off completely until the horse is past
In the car I slow right down and move to the other side of the road to pass slowly (or follow slowly until I can).
When I used to ride horses I aknowledged anyone who amended their speed or road positioning to accomodate me.
I have only once had abuse from a horse rider who stopped alongside me to "have a go" after I had pulled in and turned the bike off to let her past.
Her bone of contention was that motorcycles were noisy and dangerous and spooked her horses; it didn't seem to occur to her that I had just pulled in and stopped precisely to prevent this happening!
Unfortunately, the horsey world is getting tarred with the same brush that is painting Discovery (and other comedy jeep) owners; the majority of them now seem to be owned by selfish, arrogant w
kers with too much money and no manners or common sense!They probably exist somewhere, although they are generally a more serene type of highway user. They only really get on my wick on country lanes when they've got traffic queued behind them and they don't stop in passing places to let it past.
I wouldn't try and spook a horse, but in these circumstances I've seen people drop the clutch and shoot past with a roar or a blaring car horn just to spook the horse. There is no need for this, and it wouldn't occur if horse riders were a bit more courteous.
I wouldn't try and spook a horse, but in these circumstances I've seen people drop the clutch and shoot past with a roar or a blaring car horn just to spook the horse. There is no need for this, and it wouldn't occur if horse riders were a bit more courteous.
Drivers are far more careful around horses because if you spook the horse, it might well sit on your precious bonnet.
Horses are also a lot larger, and less likely to be "squeezed" by a car.
Also I don't know anyone who commutes by horse. Rush hours provide plenty of scope for conflict between road users.
So it's not that horse riders are more calm than cyclists, it that drivers behave a lot better around horses than they do around bikes.
And I wasn't aware that the thread in SP&L had turned into a flame war - are you particularly sensitive or something?
Horses are also a lot larger, and less likely to be "squeezed" by a car.
Also I don't know anyone who commutes by horse. Rush hours provide plenty of scope for conflict between road users.
So it's not that horse riders are more calm than cyclists, it that drivers behave a lot better around horses than they do around bikes.
And I wasn't aware that the thread in SP&L had turned into a flame war - are you particularly sensitive or something?
Johnnytheboy said:
1. Horse riders are generally a very civilised lot, most of whom are demonstratively grateful when you attempt to pass them wide and slow.
will_ said:
Drivers are far more careful around horses because if you spook the horse, it might well sit on your precious bonnet.
Exactly horse + rider = 1 tonne= no car, hence most car drivers are scared of them/give them lots of room. Bike rider + bike = not much weight at all= no damage to car.Being a bike rider and a car driver I'm aware that space is nice but not always possible. Some drivers give half the road and others half an inch. However wherever you find people you find morons.....
My wife had a horse several years ago - great big lump of a thing, rock hard and bomb proof.
You could let go a 12 bore next to it and it wouldn't bat an eyelid.
A Twix wrapper flapping in a hedgerow?
Oh no - legs flapping all over the place.
No matter how well a horse is 'conditioned', there's always something to spook it.
There's a lot of horsey types around here but 99% of them are very courteous.
Even the hunt will hold the hounds back and let the cars pass.
I find joggers are far worse than horse riders and cyclists.
It doesn't take much to run on the grass verge for 2 seconds when two cars are approaching at a closing speed of 120mph on our country roads.
(I cycle and run on the roads.. but sensibly)
You could let go a 12 bore next to it and it wouldn't bat an eyelid.
A Twix wrapper flapping in a hedgerow?
Oh no - legs flapping all over the place.
No matter how well a horse is 'conditioned', there's always something to spook it.
There's a lot of horsey types around here but 99% of them are very courteous.
Even the hunt will hold the hounds back and let the cars pass.
I find joggers are far worse than horse riders and cyclists.
It doesn't take much to run on the grass verge for 2 seconds when two cars are approaching at a closing speed of 120mph on our country roads.
(I cycle and run on the roads.. but sensibly)
Edited by Zip106 on Saturday 5th February 08:49
Having spent the best part of 10 years fraternising with horsey people, I feel I am extremely well qualified to pass comment on them.
With the exception of one or two 'net slippers', they are an extremely odd bunch of people.
Having said that, whilst there a few car hating mentalists out there, by and large, the majority of people who ride horses on the road are perfectly pleasant individuals who readily acknowledge courteous driving.
Having witnessed, seen the results of, and heard stories of near misses involving bad driving and horses, I am inclined to say that it is the car user who has the main problem - not in the sense that they 'hate horses', but more a case of them not knowing how to approach and safely overtake a horse(s) and rider.
I will add a caveate to the above, because in the same 10 years that I was involved with horsey people, I would also wager that they represent a section of motorists who are most likely to be involved in an accident with a horse (when not towing a box/driving one) - this being based on the high speeds that they drive down country lanes, the large amount of distracting crap they have flying around the inside of their cars, and the (generally) poor condition/mechanical state of their vehicles.
With the exception of one or two 'net slippers', they are an extremely odd bunch of people.
Having said that, whilst there a few car hating mentalists out there, by and large, the majority of people who ride horses on the road are perfectly pleasant individuals who readily acknowledge courteous driving.
Having witnessed, seen the results of, and heard stories of near misses involving bad driving and horses, I am inclined to say that it is the car user who has the main problem - not in the sense that they 'hate horses', but more a case of them not knowing how to approach and safely overtake a horse(s) and rider.
I will add a caveate to the above, because in the same 10 years that I was involved with horsey people, I would also wager that they represent a section of motorists who are most likely to be involved in an accident with a horse (when not towing a box/driving one) - this being based on the high speeds that they drive down country lanes, the large amount of distracting crap they have flying around the inside of their cars, and the (generally) poor condition/mechanical state of their vehicles.
B.J.W said:
Having spent the best part of 10 years fraternising with horsey people, I feel I am extremely well qualified to pass comment on them.
With the exception of one or two 'net slippers', they are an extremely odd bunch of people.
I live in a village where maybe 50% of homes own horses (including my girlfriend) and I have to say that this doesn't tally with my experience. Around here, they tend to be middle class, well educated and responsible people.With the exception of one or two 'net slippers', they are an extremely odd bunch of people.
Several of them are petrolheads, and whilst plenty of them get mad at people who drive like tossers, beyond their available visibility on narrow country lanes, that's mainly 'cos there's a lot of people who drive like tossers around here, too.
If you show common sense, mutual tolerance and respect to all other road users, you won't have a problem.
Johnnytheboy said:
There's a fairly robust thread in SP&L at the mo, which has turned into the usual cyclists vs drivers (well, cyclists vs me 
) flame war.
If anyone complains about cyclists from the driver's perspective on this and other car forums, some cyclists turn up and put the opposing view very robustly. Cycling forums have been known to have a campaigning (or similar) section which is almost entirely devoted to anti-car discussion.
I would assume that all the things internet cyclists hate about cars and drivers (passing too close/speeding/the inequity of consequence of accidents etc.) would apply at least equally to horse riders. And yet in years on Safespeed and a couple of years on here, I can't recall horse rider vs driver flame wars resulting from anyone saying "bloody horse riders/horse lorries" with the same dreary regularity as whenever anyone criticises cyclists.
Any idea why? My theories so far (it was a long drive home):
1. Horse riders are generally a very civilised lot, most of whom are demonstratively grateful when you attempt to pass them wide and slow. This behaviour is reflected in their internet personas.
2. Horse riding is on average a more rural activity than cycling. Urban people are ruder, so the drivers are ruder and the reaction of cyclists are more rude. Plus there's less traffic where they ride.
3. Horse riding isn't generally seen as an practical alternative mode of transport but as a leisure activity. Consequently it doesn't contain the environmental undercurrent that cycling does for some cyclists, i.e. you aren't riding a horse to reduce car use and are thus unlikely to resent cars on environmental grounds.
4. There have been huge raging arguments every time anyone complains about horse riders/owners and I've just not noticed.
In which case I'll try and start one by saying I hate those rigid bodied horse lorries, which have to be the slowest and least likely to pull in vehicles on the road system today. Off you go...
The reason you've attracted such ire, is that you have got things completely wrong, made wholly incorrect statements, and want to ban things. I have criticised you not as a cyclist, but as a car driver because i *hate*, more than I hate horses, selfish, numpty, nimby car drivers like yourself.) flame war. If anyone complains about cyclists from the driver's perspective on this and other car forums, some cyclists turn up and put the opposing view very robustly. Cycling forums have been known to have a campaigning (or similar) section which is almost entirely devoted to anti-car discussion.
I would assume that all the things internet cyclists hate about cars and drivers (passing too close/speeding/the inequity of consequence of accidents etc.) would apply at least equally to horse riders. And yet in years on Safespeed and a couple of years on here, I can't recall horse rider vs driver flame wars resulting from anyone saying "bloody horse riders/horse lorries" with the same dreary regularity as whenever anyone criticises cyclists.
Any idea why? My theories so far (it was a long drive home):
1. Horse riders are generally a very civilised lot, most of whom are demonstratively grateful when you attempt to pass them wide and slow. This behaviour is reflected in their internet personas.
2. Horse riding is on average a more rural activity than cycling. Urban people are ruder, so the drivers are ruder and the reaction of cyclists are more rude. Plus there's less traffic where they ride.
3. Horse riding isn't generally seen as an practical alternative mode of transport but as a leisure activity. Consequently it doesn't contain the environmental undercurrent that cycling does for some cyclists, i.e. you aren't riding a horse to reduce car use and are thus unlikely to resent cars on environmental grounds.
4. There have been huge raging arguments every time anyone complains about horse riders/owners and I've just not noticed.
In which case I'll try and start one by saying I hate those rigid bodied horse lorries, which have to be the slowest and least likely to pull in vehicles on the road system today. Off you go...
I think it is *you* who are the type of car driver who damages my freedom to drive my car more that possibly all other parties put together - walkers groups, cycling groups, greens, Brake, slow drivers and the rest of them, don't do my favourite activity as much harm as people like yourself do. You give all those groups all the ammunition they need to attack me.
Camaro91 said:
Yeah but then your keyboard would be broken 
Not really because it would specifically have had to be my wife and therefore real life. The fact he did it to others and it makes him feel like a big man, doesn't bother me directly. However I do see him as a cock, albeit my insults are virtual not face to face.I have been brought up with and worked with large animals and can report, with some authority, that horses are stupid animals owned by ignorant if well meaning idiots. Most of them, in fact all of them with possibly one or two exceptions, have much large animal enthusiasm, but little large animal skill.
These animals are mollycoddled, spoilt and generally pampered, but seem to do a good job of running up huge bills, then when the vet has run out of ideas or paid for his new car/holiday gets shot.
Obviously it is the owners fault. They are either young girls that have yet to discover boys or older women that are ignored by men. All of their nervousness is transmitted to the horse. The horse gets jumpy, so the rider/owner then tries to avoid what ever it was that made it jump, when what they should be doing is finding what made it jump then doing it over and over again until stops jumping.
If people want to take horses on the road, there should be a minimum age that they can do it, 17 or 18 maybe. The horse should have an annual check to make sure it is fit to be on the road and the rider should have to undergo a test. No more than 2 or maybe 3 horses should be allowed to travel in convoy, they should also be insured and have to pick their st up. You might think it is a bit harsh, but the roads are just to busy and dangerous to have a big lump of meat that is hardly under control using them, it is not safe for rider, horse or other road users.
I've not encountered a horse on my bicycle (I don't go on far on it) but do meet them in the car, motorbike and tractor. I give them room and creep past most are ok, but there is a sizeable number of little bhes . I've met loads of horsey women and can think of only 2 I'd go for a drink with, the rest are all hat stand and only have one topic of conversation they will talk about. Horses.
...and why is it that horsey people keep their horses in with electric fences, but can't maintain the fking things and wonder why Dobbin keeps getting out? fk wits.
These animals are mollycoddled, spoilt and generally pampered, but seem to do a good job of running up huge bills, then when the vet has run out of ideas or paid for his new car/holiday gets shot.
Obviously it is the owners fault. They are either young girls that have yet to discover boys or older women that are ignored by men. All of their nervousness is transmitted to the horse. The horse gets jumpy, so the rider/owner then tries to avoid what ever it was that made it jump, when what they should be doing is finding what made it jump then doing it over and over again until stops jumping.
If people want to take horses on the road, there should be a minimum age that they can do it, 17 or 18 maybe. The horse should have an annual check to make sure it is fit to be on the road and the rider should have to undergo a test. No more than 2 or maybe 3 horses should be allowed to travel in convoy, they should also be insured and have to pick their s
t up. You might think it is a bit harsh, but the roads are just to busy and dangerous to have a big lump of meat that is hardly under control using them, it is not safe for rider, horse or other road users.I've not encountered a horse on my bicycle (I don't go on far on it) but do meet them in the car, motorbike and tractor. I give them room and creep past most are ok, but there is a sizeable number of little b
hes . I've met loads of horsey women and can think of only 2 I'd go for a drink with, the rest are all hat stand and only have one topic of conversation they will talk about. Horses. ...and why is it that horsey people keep their horses in with electric fences, but can't maintain the f
king things and wonder why Dobbin keeps getting out? fk wits. I think the problem is you only notice the bad drivers/riders. For example most people will have a complaint about the driving of a trucker, yet how many trucks have they driven past who have dont nothing wrong? (except the elephant racing on dual carriageways, they ALL seem to do that!).
Personally i dont think horses should be allowed to ride on the tarmac. Sure people will point out that the roads were originally built for horse and carts 20,000 years ago blah blah blah. But times have changed, traffic moved much faster and its (some of) the money paid for by car taxes which maintains the roads.
Put it another way, if your car did a wheelie, threw you through the windscreen and crashed every time another car passed you at more than 15mph then it would fail its MOT and wouldnt be allowed on the road! Why should horses be any different?
Funnily enough its not the horse rides themselves which hack me off. Its the car drivers which go OTT when they see a horse. Just yesterday i came up behind a horse and as usual was preparing to slow down and do a wide overtake. But i couldnt because the guy in the opposite lane literally stopped 100 yards ahead while the horse went past, it took bloody ages! I think the bloke might have taken the hint when i actually started banging my head on my steering wheel. This seems to happen quite a lot, if anything it must be embarassing for the horse rider!
Personally i dont think horses should be allowed to ride on the tarmac. Sure people will point out that the roads were originally built for horse and carts 20,000 years ago blah blah blah. But times have changed, traffic moved much faster and its (some of) the money paid for by car taxes which maintains the roads.
Put it another way, if your car did a wheelie, threw you through the windscreen and crashed every time another car passed you at more than 15mph then it would fail its MOT and wouldnt be allowed on the road! Why should horses be any different?
Funnily enough its not the horse rides themselves which hack me off. Its the car drivers which go OTT when they see a horse. Just yesterday i came up behind a horse and as usual was preparing to slow down and do a wide overtake. But i couldnt because the guy in the opposite lane literally stopped 100 yards ahead while the horse went past, it took bloody ages! I think the bloke might have taken the hint when i actually started banging my head on my steering wheel. This seems to happen quite a lot, if anything it must be embarassing for the horse rider!
kambites said:
I can't say I've ever met a car hating cyclist
Meet Doug Bollen, car hating cyclist and well known net kook:http://www.cyclingcrowd.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/uk-bicy...
on the most tenuous of connections.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljPFZrRD3J8
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