RE: A Return To Straight Six Engines For Aston?
Discussion
Seeker UK said:
That helps, but in the future when fuel is £2+ a litre, even well heeled, committed petrolheads will think twice about a NA big V8 or V12 as a daily driver. AM knows that to survive, it can't sell enough cars as expensive weekend toys.
If AM sell a product which has a turbo / supercharged staright 6 which is nearly as quick as a NA V8 and return 35mpg+ on a run, the average buyer is going to go for that and as AM are first and foremost a business to make money, that's what they'll do.
It'll still be a beautifully made car, rapid, smooth and aspirationally expensive and exclusive but it won't deliver power linearly. Bummer.
A forced induction straight 6 should have no power or torque deficit against a NA V8. Look at the Ford Falcon, the 4 litre turbo straight six compared very well to the 5.4 NA V8. I like straight 6s, they are a smooth, elegant powerplant, very AM!If AM sell a product which has a turbo / supercharged staright 6 which is nearly as quick as a NA V8 and return 35mpg+ on a run, the average buyer is going to go for that and as AM are first and foremost a business to make money, that's what they'll do.
It'll still be a beautifully made car, rapid, smooth and aspirationally expensive and exclusive but it won't deliver power linearly. Bummer.
g3org3y said:
I was under the impression that the Cygnet was made so that AM could continue to produce V8s/V10s/V12s and not have to resort to 'small' forced induction engines?
It will never make enough of an impact. The emissions are based ona fleet average. THey would have to sell tons of cygnets for it to do that. For the necessary volumes it would have to be about half the price to compete with the size segment. That would undermine the brand image. Imagine council estate with rows of cygnets on motability.Frankly I think the cygnet has a place and that place is not an emissions book balancer. People want to help the environment now or be seen to. Famous and rich alike are buying things like the gwiz. Aston think, and I would agree, that small and frugal should not necessarily be luxury free. So Ms Knightly you can have this elctric Go-Kart with an inside like a portaloo or the Aston with hand stitched leather and billet grill which will return 60mpg.
Ecconomy is here to stay everyone is downsizing and fitting high efficency engines. As long as it's quick and has the smooth drivability you would expect whats the problem.
Kawasicki said:
A forced induction straight 6 should have no power or torque deficit against a NA V8. Look at the Ford Falcon, the 4 litre turbo straight six compared very well to the 5.4 NA V8. I like straight 6s, they are a smooth, elegant powerplant, very AM!
I forgot to add an emoticon for 'sarky' for the last part of the last sentence of my post (after 'but'). This whole "it's not NA so it's power delivery is s
e" doesn't mean a hoot to most drivers and if TG and EVO didn't bang on about, I suspect even less people would care. Edited by Seeker UK on Thursday 24th February 08:51
Oh God, this has shades of the (late) TVR, Peter Wheeler era about it. I know PW had inteded to replicate the Great British sports car; to produce an erstwhile DB5/6 or E-type.
Massive success, then they start messing about with a new six-cylinder engine and.... oops.
I hope not a repeat, but...
Massive success, then they start messing about with a new six-cylinder engine and.... oops.
I hope not a repeat, but...
Seeker UK said:
I forgot to add an emoticon for 'sarky' at the end of the last sentence of my post. This whole "it's not NA so it's power delivery is se" doesn't mean a hoot to most drivers and if TG and EVO didn't bang on about, I suspect even less people would care.
sorry, didn't pick up on your silent sarkiness!e" doesn't mean a hoot to most drivers and if TG and EVO didn't bang on about, I suspect even less people would care. Alex Gurr said:
I love the idea of the return of the classic 6 cylinder, but am worried that in today's world of bigger is better it will be seen as a backward step.
They can't get much bigger though can they? We're running out of what constitutes 'progress' on that front.I quite like the idea of smaller, more manageable engines and performance through light weight. It also means the cars will have a life after their first ownership - once they get into the second-hand market and less wealthy ownership, they'll be cheaper to run and broaden the role for AML specialists and Works Service, ensuring more jobs and skills retained.
Seeker UK said:
I forgot to add an emoticon for 'sarky' for the last part of the last sentence of my post (after 'but'). This whole "it's not NA so it's power delivery is se" doesn't mean a hoot to most drivers and if TG and EVO didn't bang on about, I suspect even less people would care.
e" doesn't mean a hoot to most drivers and if TG and EVO didn't bang on about, I suspect even less people would care. Edited by Seeker UK on Thursday 24th February 08:51
Why does Clarkson always decide to demonstrate turbo-lag by flooring the car in 5th and complaining that it'll be overtaken by a Polo or whatever? Surely if you buy a turbocharged sports car, you know (or soon learn) how to use the gears to get the best out of it?Twincam16 said:
Why does Clarkson always decide to demonstrate turbo-lag by flooring the car in 5th and complaining that it'll be overtaken by a Polo or whatever? Surely if you buy a turbocharged sports car, you know (or soon learn) how to use the gears to get the best out of it?jake15919 said:
c_seven said:
I can't help thinking a 2.5 blown six is a bit ordinary, I mean it's a Subaru engine give or take a cylinder.
Wow the relaxation of the licencing laws is really starting to kick in.
sootyrumble said:
Absolutely and with the new variable turbos like Porsche use or as BMW did on the early 335i's using two turbos one small and one larger turbo for higher revs turbo lag can be virtually eradicated if the engine is above 1500 rpm. I think people have a complete misconception about new designed turbocharged cars, and yes it may mute the sound a little but if your telling me Astons "Acoustic" engineers cant get a nice synthesised noise (Which is all that they do to the N/A cars now) then i would be very surprised.
Granted, no argument, but there is always a delay, its a question of how long it lasts, they won't pull with the immediacy of a big bang motor.I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say they should make it a hybrid with a nice hight revving 3.0-3.5 I6, rather than a turbo. Then maybe slap a SC on the side for a Vantage version.
MSTRBKR said:
Oh dear. I recently applied to their graduate scheme and in one of the sections I confidently proclaimed that I didn't think an AM would be an AM if it wasn't normally aspirated. Woops.
Woops indeed. DId they reply to you reminding you about the DB7 and Virage Vantage?Lazerblue said:
Clarkson sometimes hit's the nail on the head!
Death of the supercar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siZQHDY1-48
No, he doesn't.Death of the supercar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siZQHDY1-48
FesterNath said:
c_seven said:
Of course we all know the reasons things are moving this way, but I can't help thinking a 2.5 blown six is a bit ordinary, I mean it's a Subaru engine give or take a cylinder.
6 cylinder; give or take a cylinder means a 5 or a 7. What has that got to do with Subaru?!!! Twincam16 said:
Why does Clarkson always decide to demonstrate turbo-lag by flooring the car in 5th and complaining that it'll be overtaken by a Polo or whatever? Surely if you buy a turbocharged sports car, you know (or soon learn) how to use the gears to get the best out of it?
BUT I do ALWAYS take everything Clarkson says with a pinch of salt
fido said:
jake15919 said:
c_seven said:
I can't help thinking a 2.5 blown six is a bit ordinary, I mean it's a Subaru engine give or take a cylinder.
Wow the relaxation of the licencing laws is really starting to kick in.Oddball RS said:
Granted, no argument, but there is always a delay, its a question of how long it lasts, they won't pull with the immediacy of a big bang motor.
Not so much its only if the revs are super low which is why Jeremy has to start at like 20-30 mph in the highest gear possible, the new Mclaren is meant to be hugely tractable and completely annihilates the 458, the new Porsche 911 has incredible standing acceleration and in gear times. In the last 5 years turbo technology has moved forwards alot due to the need created by tighter emissions personally i have allways loved turbocharged cars and used to like the lag then an explosion as the engine when bananas but that is not so true anymore.I would be interested to hear from a Nissan GTR owner or a Porsche 911 driver what they find regards lag??
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff