The 207 GTi

[DS3R]

No I am not essexplumber in disguise,

However I have noticed these drop in price signifiantly, and as they share the same 150bhp PSA/BMW 4-cyl engine as a Mini Cooper, are they worth a punt?

Before you tell me, yes I know it is not a 205 GTi and some smart arse will define a second in time when "Peugeot lost the plot", it is not as pretty as a Mini I agree, although having decent eyesight I have no need for a dinner-plate sized speedo, nor the naff-feeling plastic switches you get in a Mini dashboard. I also appreciate the interior of the Pug is hardly avant-garde.

It seems several things go wrong with the Pug engine (timing tensioner issues) and cats don't seem to last- do the same things happen to the Mini lump?

Early low mileage cars 57 platers with 30- 40k can be had for £6k or thereabouts. £6k does not buy a lot of Mini at the best of times.

The PH write-up was farourable, so why does it get such a bad write-up from the PH massive?

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?f=23&...

[mister.t]

DS3R said:

It seems several things go wrong with the Pug engine (timing tensioner issues) and cats don't seem to last- do the same things happen to the Mini lump?

Timing tensioner is very common on R56 S'. Finally a fix with the new Valvetronic engine, not sure if they went in the 207. Never heard anything about cats on MINI's either, totally different exhaust I imagine.

[anonymous-user]

Bit ugly though aren't they.

For £6500 you could get a tidy 197 Clio with 16,000 miles...

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2606775.htm

Or one with 42,000 miles for £5395.

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2272533.htm

I know what I'd get.

[Chrisw666]

Does the GT not have 150ps and the GTI have a full fat 175?

I don't hate them but I couldn't love one either, as cheap mid/small sized transport the 207 does the job while being fairly comfortable and practical. But boy is it a heavy car and the ones I have driven have such numb lifeless steering that any attempts at keen driving just put you at risk of falling asleep at the wheel or understeering into a hedge.

If you want a bit of power, don't need to much space but want to sometimes carry 4 people and some stuff, aren't image concious and don't value feedback and chassis dynamics too highly then they are probably suitable for you. If the last bit is important then you will get fed up very quickly.

[vit4]

Driven a shopping one and it felt disconnected. I find that with most cars with power steering, but this was the worst. Couldn't feel where it was, if that makes sense.

[robsco]

Nice enough cars; the Minis are sharper as you'd expect, but at least the interior of the 207 will be ergonomically tolerable and you won't see a 207GTi on every street corner.

[matt3001]

Get a 197 if you can, better all round car! Not the build quality of a cooper s though!

[mnkiboy]

DS3R said:

...as they share the same 150bhp PSA/BMW 4-cyl engine as a Mini Cooper...

I thought the GTi was 175bhp? The 150bhp is the GT I think.

Edit: Already answered. Really should refresh my screen more than once every 15 minutes.

Edited by mnkiboy on Wednesday 6th April 10:43

[robsco]

matt3001 said:

Get a 197 if you can, better all round car! Not the build quality of a cooper s though!

Where does this build quality malarkey come from? Every Mini I've driven, from the R53s to the R56s, all have some truly woeful and brittle plastics inside. I've never driven one that doesn't buzz and rattle either.

[matt3001]

robsco said:

Where does this build quality malarkey come from? Every Mini I've driven, from the R53s to the R56s, all have some truly woeful and brittle plastics inside. I've never driven one that doesn't buzz and rattle either.

I agree the Mini isnt perfect by any stretch. But I had a 197F1 as a long term loan car a couple of years back and that broke down at least 4 or 5 times. Always sensors. Fast french hatches love to eat through sensors

[anonymous-user]

matt3001 said:

Fast french hatches love to eat through sensors

So true

(They are cheap though, the sensors I mean.)

[K87]

I thought the GT was only about 115bhp? Thought that was a similar block to the 106, which coupled with the 106 cams, followers, and springs makes about 150bhp.

I may be wrong but I'm sure thats what the GT was, JP4 engine I believe, same as the C2 VTS

[Chrisw666]

K87 said:

I thought the GT was only about 115bhp? Thought that was a similar block to the 106, which coupled with the 106 cams, followers, and springs makes about 150bhp.

I may be wrong but I'm sure thats what the GT was, JP4 engine I believe, same as the C2 VTS

Nope, it is the PSA 1.6 Turbo.

[va1o]

I'd have one, the engine is excellent and they are certainly very good value for money compared to the MINI. The interior isn't at all bad either. Not really a true hot hatch though.

[HellDiver]

K87 said:

I thought the GT was only about 115bhp? Thought that was a similar block to the 106, which coupled with the 106 cams, followers, and springs makes about 150bhp.

I may be wrong but I'm sure thats what the GT was, JP4 engine I believe, same as the C2 VTS

You're totally and utterly wrong in every way.

[DS3R]

Wrong link in my OP, sorry, thought that article was discussing the GTi, it wasn't.

It is the GTi I've seen (so 175bhp/ a la new Cooper S). It's clearly not a classically adored vehicle, but I'd be surprised to find a 175bhp Mini with sensible miles for under 10k- 12 from a dealer.

I can't see how the Pug is really half the car...

[SteveS Cup]

I've been looking at these recently, there's a white one near me with a 'ring sticker on it, lowered and sounds like it's been mapped (either that or they've but an atmospheric dv on it!).

I really like the look of them plus as mentioned they're no where near as common as the Mini nor anywhere near as expensive.

It uses the same engine as the new DS3 as well doesn't it?

Comparing it to a 197 though imo is pointless, the way you'd drive them is very different. I appreciate they're in the same league but imo you either want a revvy na hot hatch or you want a turbo charged hatch.

The 197 is also awful on petrol for the performance you get and bloody costly if you want more power.

Where as I'm presuming as the engine in the pug is quite widely used tuning options are readily available and initial maps etc are probably big bang for small buck.

[300bhp/ton]

DS3R said:

No I am not essexplumber in disguise,

However I have noticed these drop in price signifiantly, and as they share the same 150bhp PSA/BMW 4-cyl engine as a Mini Cooper, are they worth a punt?

Before you tell me, yes I know it is not a 205 GTi and some smart arse will define a second in time when "Peugeot lost the plot", it is not as pretty as a Mini I agree, although having decent eyesight I have no need for a dinner-plate sized speedo, nor the naff-feeling plastic switches you get in a Mini dashboard. I also appreciate the interior of the Pug is hardly avant-garde.

It seems several things go wrong with the Pug engine (timing tensioner issues) and cats don't seem to last- do the same things happen to the Mini lump?

Early low mileage cars 57 platers with 30- 40k can be had for £6k or thereabouts. £6k does not buy a lot of Mini at the best of times.

The PH write-up was farourable, so why does it get such a bad write-up from the PH massive?

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?f=23&...

What I struggle with is the rational that the 207 GTI could ever be the answer. Not saying it's bad, but for the same money you can buy:

-newer
-faster
-more fun
-more practical
-better looking
-better residuals
-more reliable
-better image

And quite often many or most of the above combined. The 207 might not actually be a bad car, but unless you are some sort of Peugeot nut there is always a better car alternative no matter your criteria.

Edited by 300bhp/ton on Wednesday 6th April 11:29

[robsco]

doogz said:

They've all had cracked dashes and door panels?

Where in my post did I type that?

[K87]

HellDiver said:

You're totally and utterly wrong in every way.

care to expand on that?