Wheel sizes getting silly?

[Flibble]

A lot of the dodgy ride is due to suspension setup rather than low profiles. People (i.e. joe moron) equate a rough bouncy ride with "sporty" and think it makes the car better, when it really just makes it crap. Having high profiles softens it, but you could get much the same effect by having sensibly tuned suspension even with big wheels.

[Zad]

Having ultra low profile tyres and moving the work to the suspension springs still equates to more unsprung mass though, which equals lower efficiency and poorer handling. In order to cope with some of the roads around here, the tyres would have to have a phenomenal internal pressure, just to avoid pot-holes and traffic calming smashing the wheel to bits.

[fathomfive]

MC Bodge said:

Ford have been at it for years

Really wouldn't want to have a bad case of OCD with those tyres

[the-photographer]

Here's some testing carried out in Germany (with weights)

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/testbericht/opt...

http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?u=http%3A%...

(apparently not scientific if you believe the comments)

[the-photographer]

Vladimir said:

Nope -I compared my 160 styles with 225/45 17" non RFT CSC3s to a 19" M Sport (225M) alloys with Bridgestone RFT tyres. I forget the exact breakdown and it took ages to find the weights (wheels - easy, tyres - had to use a US website - VERY hard to find tyre weights) but mine come in (wheel and tyre) at a whisker under 20kg (approx 12kg wheel, 8ish for the tyre), a rear 19" on 255/35(I think) RFTs came in at 29ish kg per corner. A HUGE amount of extra unsprung weight.

Edited by Vladimir on Tuesday 26th April 17:12

I reckon that right, a 17" GTI wheel is 11.16KG, which you could swap for a very expensive OZ Alleggerita at ~8KG

[g3org3y]

19 inch vs 16 inch.



I think that photo sums up a lot about how the car industry has 'progressed' in the last 15 years or so.

Edited by g3org3y on Wednesday 27th April 09:42

[zakelwe]

Parked next to a Cayenne the other day, 21 inch wheels and when I got home found they cost £3600 on the configurator. A couple of days later some 19 inchers on a Cayman at £1600. Better to have 17 inch forged wheels or the stock 17 inch and then £1700 worth of carbon bits to lose even more weight. But it's all for looks.

Modern cars do make "normal" wheels look small though, I don't think it is the huge wheel arches though, it is the amount of depth of metal under the windows. In the old days windows were deep ( original 5 series? or 3 series as in the photo above ) where as the Bangle inspired 5 series has such deep heavy metal sides it makes 17 inch wheels look like something an original mini used. Either that or it is the American rappers and the tuning scene over there encouraging the manufacturers.

It's not only the bigger wheels making the cost more, the tyres are bigger then so they cost more. And weigh more too. The road noise is up, changing a wheel is more difficult and the ride suffers as everyone says.

Just so they look better. Or do they? Well from the side, but from the front or back smaller diameter wheels make the tyres look fatter and more chunky, a classic example being

http://www.classicdriver.com/upload/images/_uk/110...

or the Countach of course being the ultimate example.

Chris Harris wrote that he hopes the new Toyota Coupe, which is supposed to get back to Toyota's fun roots, has 16 inch lightweight wheels on it. I bet it doesn't though, I bet it has something a lot heavier. And the tyres will be too wide.

Come the revolution though all S line Audi drivers will be first up against the wall.

[k-ink]

Looking back, these now look like they're on skateboard wheels...





But it will no doubt leave modern cars with stupid large hoops far behind on twisty bumpy B-roads.

[jsg612]

I think in all fairness to modern day expectations of cars, the majority have got it right. In most cases I think it's around...

15"-16" Small city car
17"-18" Medium sized family hatch/coupe
19"-20" Large saloon/estate

It's when you come to spec an Audi A1 with 18" wheels or a Rangie with 22" wheels that annoys me. Then you have the mere Transit Van, still on it's original tiny 15" castors.

[Vladimir]

jsg612 said:

I think in all fairness to modern day expectations of cars, the majority have got it right. In most cases I think it's around...

15"-16" Small city car
17"-18" Medium sized family hatch/coupe
19"-20" Large saloon/estate

It's when you come to spec an Audi A1 with 18" wheels or a Rangie with 22" wheels that annoys me. Then you have the mere Transit Van, still on it's original tiny 15" castors.

Too big. And they haven't got it right - loads of people are breaking wheels, shaking their teeth out and shelling out a fortune on tyres for a modest saloon.

My cousin has an A6 2.7TDI S-Line - what should be a good mile cruncher is actually completely ruined by the hideous crashy ride on it's comedy 19s (about two feet wide) and he's knackered two of the rims already. It's a FWD, mildly nippy luxobarge not a track car.

[Riknos]

15's look great on my car, and due to the fact someone stuck lowering springs on it, they fill the arches perfectly.. so much so the front looks like the wheel is too big for the arch. Oh and they're on 55 heigh tyres. £40/£45 a corner for decent tyres is awesome too

[lunchbox]

g3org3y said:

19 inch vs 16 inch.



I think that photo sums up a lot about how the car industry has 'progressed' in the last 15 years or so.

Edited by g3org3y on Wednesday 27th April 09:42

That's just it, cars have got bigger so the wheel size has followed. That's not even a fair comparison because the modern equivalent of an E30 M3 is even bigger than that 1 series.

[unpc]

Totally agree that this big wheel thing has got way out of hand. That said my Jag looks great on 20"s. Shoot me!

[Dangerous2]

munroman said:

A friend has had 5 Series for about 20 years, but as he travels to remote parts of Scotland he wanted 'normal' wheels and tyres, and a proper spare, as well as hating the ride on run flats.

BMW's dealer looked down their nose at him when he requested this, 'it couldn't be done'.

He bought a Passat CC and loves it, so BMW have probably lost a customer for life due to the silly wheels.

pretty poor service from the dealer, they could surely have sourced 5 sensible wheels and tyres themselves and fitted them once the car had arrived from the factory.

[Dangerous2]

Vladimir said:

If the trend is from BTCC - look at a BTCC race track - many potholes on them? Many speed bumps? No.

Edited by Vladimir on Tuesday 26th April 19:58

hmmm... perhaps other facets of modern driving have been influenced by the BTCC too.

crashing into people and driving off without stopping to leave insurance details.
general troglodytic attitude
etc.

[Dangerous2]

1878 said:

Maserati QP on 22" wheels? As if Maserati running costs aren't enough as it is, goodness knows what those tyres will cost to replace.
http://pistonheads.com/sales/2748542.htm

they look a bit aftermarket. They took one of the most elegant cars out there and made it look like it grew up in wales. good one.

[oldcynic]

I've been surfing the ads for a Caravelle for family transport recently and I can't believe the number of vans on 20" bling alloys. Personally I'd expect a van to be on a small set of steelies with plenty of tyre to absorb the impact of kerbs & potholes.

The one benefit of this is of course that there are plenty of sensible wheels on sale for the winter tyres.

[FamilyDub]

I remember reading 'Fast Car' as a lad and thinking, 'my gawd those 16's on that Nova are huuuuuuuge!'

That said, certain cars look great with the big wheels, like that 1M, above...

[ZeeTacoe]

1878 said:

Maserati QP on 22" wheels? As if Maserati running costs aren't enough as it is, goodness knows what those tyres will cost to replace.
http://pistonheads.com/sales/2748542.htm

Burn the wheels and I'd have that if only for the lovely red interior.

[JVaughan]

I sold my Mondeo ST because the 18" wheels were too hard for the UK's crap roads, and on every surface other than a new motorway, it was harsh. Downgraded to an old 406 Oil Burner on 15" wheels and its brilliant, so soft and comfortable on every surface, tyres are now £40 a corner instead of £125 and as it was a downgrade into Banger-nomics im not in any rush to upgrade any time soon