Has it now become a nightmare to sell a private car...?
Discussion
Ved said:
maz8062 said:
The cheek of it! Imagine if you'd read that after buying it. I'd be furious and back around for a quiet word or 2.
From the ad:
"Nothing materially wrong with it a genuine car."
Apart from the front end damage and accident...
Back to the OP's original point: its not all gloom and doom. I just sold the family's 3rd/summer car. I placed an ad on PHeads and Autotrader and within a few days I had a couple of genuinely interested prospects.
One arranged to see the car on Saturday, and confirmed by txt the day before he was still coming. I had cleaner and properly prepared the car and the paperwork, keys etc were all present. The guy was familiar with the model and this was a low mileage, garaged, low owners example with a decent spec. I pointed out some minor scratches and a ding, demonstrated that everything worked, and took him for a 5 minute drive.
On returning to the house, he looked through the service history, noting the recent cam belt service and original sales brochure etc. We had a good humoured haggle over a cup of coffee, and shook hands on a fair price.
He came around 24hrs later with the cash, we did the V5 thing, and he drove the car away.
Couldn't have been more painless and I got more than 2x what some trader offered me in p-ex last November.
SS7
One arranged to see the car on Saturday, and confirmed by txt the day before he was still coming. I had cleaner and properly prepared the car and the paperwork, keys etc were all present. The guy was familiar with the model and this was a low mileage, garaged, low owners example with a decent spec. I pointed out some minor scratches and a ding, demonstrated that everything worked, and took him for a 5 minute drive.
On returning to the house, he looked through the service history, noting the recent cam belt service and original sales brochure etc. We had a good humoured haggle over a cup of coffee, and shook hands on a fair price.
He came around 24hrs later with the cash, we did the V5 thing, and he drove the car away.
Couldn't have been more painless and I got more than 2x what some trader offered me in p-ex last November.
SS7
Ozzie Osmond said:
At the end of the day it's a big, executive saloon, 12 years old and 70,000 miles. Such cars depreciate heavily for one reason - there's not much demand for them in the used market. Punters are nervous of the "big bills" potential. Not to mention the rising cost of petrol and insurance. It may cost fiesta money but it'll never be run for fiesta money.
This is what is worrying me having decided to sell the Porker. I am pretty much 100% going to sell to a specialist / dealer and take the hit of a few grand as I can't face the great unwashed and dreamers.CarbonM5 said:
Advert said:
Contact: Mr C
E's are goodGot any Vera's?
Drive Blind said:
CarbonM5 said:
Advert said:
Contact: Mr C
E's are goodGot any Vera's?
But the ad may detract everyone written like that, reminds me of a high end Car Dealer years ago (early mid 90's in performance car, fast lane etc) who's ads were all written like that.
Does he have to say it's had a smash? No. It's hardly the sort of thing that you put in a for sale ad!
It has been repaired by a BMW dealer, had a new bonnet, & bumper, paint - so no paint chips. £4k from a dealer? They will have charged £500 to open the bonnet so hardly major damage! No lights on the dash because it's been repaired!
Probably most of us on here own cars that have had damage repaired at some point.
Come on guys, he's not hiding anything!
NiceCupOfTea said:
Does he have to say it's had a smash? No. It's hardly the sort of thing that you put in a for sale ad!
It has been repaired by a BMW dealer, had a new bonnet, & bumper, paint - so no paint chips. £4k from a dealer? They will have charged £500 to open the bonnet so hardly major damage! No lights on the dash because it's been repaired!
Probably most of us on here own cars that have had damage repaired at some point.
Come on guys, he's not hiding anything!
Just to clarify Im not hiding anything on the car and the damage eventually amounted to a bonnet, bumper and oil cooler replaced as a precaution. I asked for a copy if the repair for my records so I could provide evidence that it wasn't a cheap repair. All done by main dealer. It isn't registered as such and is guaranteed for life of the car.
As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
I was about ready to punch some of the potential buyers when I was selling my Merc last year. I put it on PH and got not even a sniff of interest despite lowering the price, put it on AT and it opened the floodgates for imbeciles everywhere.
Everything they needed to know was in the advert along with numerous pictures, yet they STILL asked about the MOT, tax and servicing. They asked where I was, despite the location being in the advert. And all but one of the callers asked me for my bottom price (of the car, not of my arse) as literally the first question.
Some of the offers were just insane - 'I can only get XX off my credit card to pay for it' - I mean, WTF?
I gave up being polite in the end.
Everything they needed to know was in the advert along with numerous pictures, yet they STILL asked about the MOT, tax and servicing. They asked where I was, despite the location being in the advert. And all but one of the callers asked me for my bottom price (of the car, not of my arse) as literally the first question.
Some of the offers were just insane - 'I can only get XX off my credit card to pay for it' - I mean, WTF?
I gave up being polite in the end.
Truckosaurus said:
Wacky Racer said:
Get a decent deposit, at least £100, and MAKE IT CLEAR it is non returnable if they change their mind for any reason, AND the price agreed is firm.
I thought the current accepted wisdom was a 'no deposit' policy?The car stays 'for sale' until the buyer stumps up the full amount. The seller is then not turning away other potential purchasers whilst there is still a chance a numpty buyer can forfeit his £100 when he realises his insurance will be £2000 not the £500 he thought it might be, or he finds (or wins on ebay) a similar car for £250 less than yours.
The buyer also is better protected if they conclude the deal once and for all as they could spend several days organising insurance and a convenient collection time only to find someone else has appeared and gazumped them and the seller has just had to kindly returned your £100.
Each to their own I suppose, just always the way I have gone about things. I can see the advantages with your way though.
1974nc said:
Just to clarify Im not hiding anything on the car and the damage eventually amounted to a bonnet, bumper and oil cooler replaced as a precaution. I asked for a copy if the repair for my records so I could provide evidence that it wasn't a cheap repair. All done by main dealer. It isn't registered as such and is guaranteed for life of the car.
As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
So if they don't ask over the phone you're not going to tell them until they arrive to view it? One of my questions is 'is it HPI clear?'. which is more of a check of the honesty of the seller- if I was serious about the car I would have done a check before calling. I gather that these repairs didn't go through the insurance? Therefore your response to my question would be 'yes', which is true, but I would have driven the distance to come and view the car to find £4k of invoices for a crash repair. Needless to say I would be fuming if I had 'bothered' to come and view, and I certainly wouldn't even consider going any further (what else could this guy be 'forgetting').As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
Next time I buy the car I will change my question to 'has it ever been in a crash' to cover this type of seller.
You KNOW it will put people off, and that's the only reason you've neglected to put it in the advert.
I don't see why he should disclose the minor accident damage in the advert. After all, he is trying to sell the car. The objective is to entice purchasers, not put them off. And so long as it has been properly repaired, what is the problem?
Asking, "Is it HPI clear?" is not the same as asking, "Has it suffered any accident damage?" The former means, "Is the car still owned by a finance company and/or recorded on the register as stolen or damaged?" The latter means what it says.
So long as the seller answers all questions honestly, it's buyer beware. If I were the seller, I would detail the car properly, take some decent pictures, re-write the advertisement so that it is well-ordered and comprehensive and ask for more money.
Asking, "Is it HPI clear?" is not the same as asking, "Has it suffered any accident damage?" The former means, "Is the car still owned by a finance company and/or recorded on the register as stolen or damaged?" The latter means what it says.
So long as the seller answers all questions honestly, it's buyer beware. If I were the seller, I would detail the car properly, take some decent pictures, re-write the advertisement so that it is well-ordered and comprehensive and ask for more money.
STW2010 said:
1974nc said:
Just to clarify Im not hiding anything on the car and the damage eventually amounted to a bonnet, bumper and oil cooler replaced as a precaution. I asked for a copy if the repair for my records so I could provide evidence that it wasn't a cheap repair. All done by main dealer. It isn't registered as such and is guaranteed for life of the car.
As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
So if they don't ask over the phone you're not going to tell them until they arrive to view it? One of my questions is 'is it HPI clear?'. which is more of a check of the honesty of the seller- if I was serious about the car I would have done a check before calling. I gather that these repairs didn't go through the insurance? Therefore your response to my question would be 'yes', which is true, but I would have driven the distance to come and view the car to find £4k of invoices for a crash repair. Needless to say I would be fuming if I had 'bothered' to come and view, and I certainly wouldn't even consider going any further (what else could this guy be 'forgetting').As for me thinking its down on power that's probably just my perception but read the posts and you'll have noted I'm having it checked over as a precaution.
If this puts people off then so be it however I'm not about to put in the advert about the repair bit as I mentioned if anyone bothers to come acnd view then the paperwork is there to view.
Forgot that everyone on Ph has owned their cars from new and can verify no panel has ever been marked.
Next time I buy the car I will change my question to 'has it ever been in a crash' to cover this type of seller.
You KNOW it will put people off, and that's the only reason you've neglected to put it in the advert.
Crashes don't go on HPI anyway, only if it gets written off does anybody care.
STW2010 said:
You KNOW it will put people off, and that's the only reason you've neglected to put it in the advert.
Of course he knows that. And, assuming the car has been repaired properly and there was no structural damage, there's absolutely no reason why it SHOULD put people off. He'll get either no response, or people giving him ridiculous lowball offers far below its market value.STW2010 - Do you know what you are talking about or are you another internet jockey that appears to fit the old adage "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"
For the record AGAIN - The car was repaired VIA THE INSURANCE COMPANY at BMW Main Agent as specified in policy terms and conditions!
The full disclosure of the repair is with the documents of the car 'WHICH I REQUESTED FROM BMW' when they repaired the car so i could provide evidence that any works to the car had been carried out to factory standards with OEM parts. This carries a lifetime guarantee!
CAT D is a uneconomical to repair and means the insurance has paid out the value of the car to the insured and disposed of the car as they deemed fit. i.e either salvage or bought back by owner.
When you sell a car do you put in the advert statements such as 'damaged bumper in a parking incident 2 years ago/knocked off wing mirror on a garage wall/buckled wheel on a pothole etc
Of course you dont and im not about to put that in my advert. I reckon you will find 90% of cars will have had some sort of repair done in their time to bodywork so your holier than thou attitude rankles me.
As i said if someone asks me then I will tell them but I cant see that as the car has had a bumper and bonnet etc after a jogging pace bump all repaired by a main agent that it is now unsaleable and I should evidently sell it for scrap value.
For the record AGAIN - The car was repaired VIA THE INSURANCE COMPANY at BMW Main Agent as specified in policy terms and conditions!
The full disclosure of the repair is with the documents of the car 'WHICH I REQUESTED FROM BMW' when they repaired the car so i could provide evidence that any works to the car had been carried out to factory standards with OEM parts. This carries a lifetime guarantee!
CAT D is a uneconomical to repair and means the insurance has paid out the value of the car to the insured and disposed of the car as they deemed fit. i.e either salvage or bought back by owner.
When you sell a car do you put in the advert statements such as 'damaged bumper in a parking incident 2 years ago/knocked off wing mirror on a garage wall/buckled wheel on a pothole etc
Of course you dont and im not about to put that in my advert. I reckon you will find 90% of cars will have had some sort of repair done in their time to bodywork so your holier than thou attitude rankles me.
As i said if someone asks me then I will tell them but I cant see that as the car has had a bumper and bonnet etc after a jogging pace bump all repaired by a main agent that it is now unsaleable and I should evidently sell it for scrap value.
>tongueincheek<
Can i ask, if there is no evidence of the accident on the HPi report & the car itself plus it's not CAT-D/C/etc why can't you withold the invoices showing this repair. i.e not show/give evidence of the work to the buyer, as presumably theres nothing other than this piece of paper that show that this work was carried out. (oh, apart from these threads)
Otherwise i can't see you ever selling the car to be brutally honest.
Can i ask, if there is no evidence of the accident on the HPi report & the car itself plus it's not CAT-D/C/etc why can't you withold the invoices showing this repair. i.e not show/give evidence of the work to the buyer, as presumably theres nothing other than this piece of paper that show that this work was carried out. (oh, apart from these threads)
Otherwise i can't see you ever selling the car to be brutally honest.
The issue here isn't that the car or other cars out there have had work done on them, previous ones I've bought and sold as an example, but that you've avoided saying that in the advert. If you'd said that in the ad you wouldn't have all the other questions and change of tone in the thread.
If you drove 200 miles to buy a car that claimed in the ad the all was and has been rosy only to find out that there was a crash and a large bill you wouldn't like it one bit and would instantly wonder what else was not as advertised.
I went to look at a Hawkeye STI and there was over spray of about 100mm x 5mm above the front bumper going on to plastic that was not supposed to be painted. I immediately walked away. Does this mean that the car was two halves glued together? No. But because it was not mentioned in the advert everything else in the car was up for doubt.
I would add it to your advert and then your car will sell.
Honesty is always best, especially when a perceived deception is so easily traceable.
If you drove 200 miles to buy a car that claimed in the ad the all was and has been rosy only to find out that there was a crash and a large bill you wouldn't like it one bit and would instantly wonder what else was not as advertised.
I went to look at a Hawkeye STI and there was over spray of about 100mm x 5mm above the front bumper going on to plastic that was not supposed to be painted. I immediately walked away. Does this mean that the car was two halves glued together? No. But because it was not mentioned in the advert everything else in the car was up for doubt.
I would add it to your advert and then your car will sell.
Honesty is always best, especially when a perceived deception is so easily traceable.
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