what is an 'early' 3.4 996?
Discussion
My 3.4 litre 996.1 isn't ULEZ compliant, my 5.4 litre W203 is. I've setup auto-pay for ULEZ/C-Charge, so it doesn't matter now, but I was taking the C55 before that as it meant I didn't get an annoying bill in the post if I forgot to pay the charge that day.
I don't think that it'll play a part in the values of these cars - but, if all major cities introduce a version of the ULEZ then it will have a pretty significant impact.
I don't think that it'll play a part in the values of these cars - but, if all major cities introduce a version of the ULEZ then it will have a pretty significant impact.
richthebike said:
Ah except I now see it is extending in 2021...
A lot of people don't realize still that not only is it expanding, but also that unlike previous zones, it's not just limited hours.
Its 24/7.
The next mayoral elections though are May 2020, Tory Candidate has said he will cancel the expansion.
Edited by hyphen on Sunday 1st December 18:50
As a city of london resident, I used to have a 90% discount on congestion charge. So making my commute from EC1 to W1U, was seriously bonkers and easy with my old 986. (only 2-3 days a week of course). The only problem was the non-sufficient parking so If I was late, I would end up paying ridicolous parking fees in the street. Now with ULEZ, that kind of fun is completely out of question....
ooid said:
As a city of london resident, I used to have a 90% discount on congestion charge. So making my commute from EC1 to W1U, was seriously bonkers and easy with my old 986. (only 2-3 days a week of course). The only problem was the non-sufficient parking so If I was late, I would end up paying ridicolous parking fees in the street. Now with ULEZ, that kind of fun is completely out of question....
Fun? Sounds like a crap drive to me 😄Let's face it, if they half in value for any reason, and are suddenly worth 5 to 8 grand, theres no massive downside unless anyone genuinely bought one thinking they'd make money.
% change can be massive but the quantum is still pretty small.
If you're looking at the potential cost (of the ULEZ fee) and thinking it looks a bit steep, then you need to take a look at first year road tax + depreciation on something new and tasty.
% change can be massive but the quantum is still pretty small.
If you're looking at the potential cost (of the ULEZ fee) and thinking it looks a bit steep, then you need to take a look at first year road tax + depreciation on something new and tasty.
Edited by richthebike on Sunday 1st December 21:24
ooid said:
Loads of poverty boxsters out there with 2-3k price range (even running!).. so I won't be suprised if 996's go into 5-6k range soon, really not much a difference between both cars.
If part prices were much affordable, they could have been a great hobby car for many, like mx5 or m3 but its just too expensive to keep them in the shape, for what they actually are.
The MX-5, much though I enjoyed mine, just isn't in the same ball park, so cost parity isn't a realistic aspiration. If part prices were much affordable, they could have been a great hobby car for many, like mx5 or m3 but its just too expensive to keep them in the shape, for what they actually are.
The M3 (most generations) is normaly considered "not cheap" to run. Running costs and upgrades for an E46 and a 996, for road use, are pretty similar, in my experience.
As it stands, I think they do make a great hobby car. Loads of specialists, lots of aftermarket bits, enjoy use vs sitting still.
Living very very far from London I couldn't give a toss about ULEZ or any other plans London has. I dare say all other cities will follow suit eventually but it still won't make a difference to me. I work in Glasgow and Edinburgh and thinking about it now I very rarely see a 996 or even a 997, see plenty of 991s.
I guess if the 996 were to depreciate to £5k then we would see a lot more of them getting broken for parts or just scrapped when they threw up a big bill. I can't help seeing the silver lining in that scenario. Cheap parts supply and added future rarity.
I guess if the 996 were to depreciate to £5k then we would see a lot more of them getting broken for parts or just scrapped when they threw up a big bill. I can't help seeing the silver lining in that scenario. Cheap parts supply and added future rarity.
I'm confused by that second part. I think its saying what I wrote but just the other way about. ie prices stay low if there are still lots available.
I don't really think we can draw too much of a comparison between 996 and 986 prices. They might share lots of parts and look the same from some angles but they are very different propositions. I mean, why did most of us here spend 2 or 3 times the money on a 996 over a 986? Bit more practical? Bit more "manly"? or simply because it's a 911 and a Boxster doesn't scratch that itch?
I think there will always be a premium for that reason.
I don't really think we can draw too much of a comparison between 996 and 986 prices. They might share lots of parts and look the same from some angles but they are very different propositions. I mean, why did most of us here spend 2 or 3 times the money on a 996 over a 986? Bit more practical? Bit more "manly"? or simply because it's a 911 and a Boxster doesn't scratch that itch?
I think there will always be a premium for that reason.
nunpuncher said:
I'm confused by that second part. I think its saying what I wrote but just the other way about. ie prices stay low if there are still lots available.
I don't really think we can draw too much of a comparison between 996 and 986 prices. They might share lots of parts and look the same from some angles but they are very different propositions. I mean, why did most of us here spend 2 or 3 times the money on a 996 over a 986? Bit more practical? Bit more "manly"? or simply because it's a 911 and a Boxster doesn't scratch that itch?
I think there will always be a premium for that reason.
Some specific boxster 986 parts are cheap compared to 996 parts like gearboxes. A 996 6 speed manual gearbox is £2500 but a 6 speed [3.2s] 986 manual gearbox is more like £500. Headlights and doors, bonnet, seats are all shared and therefore similarly priced. There might be some extra tax on 996.2 specific parts like headlights but that's just a gut feeling. I think the popularity of the 986 and therefore the amount being broken has made their parts cheaper.I don't really think we can draw too much of a comparison between 996 and 986 prices. They might share lots of parts and look the same from some angles but they are very different propositions. I mean, why did most of us here spend 2 or 3 times the money on a 996 over a 986? Bit more practical? Bit more "manly"? or simply because it's a 911 and a Boxster doesn't scratch that itch?
I think there will always be a premium for that reason.
If a 996.1 was only worth £5k in good condition we'd probably see a lot more parts available cheaply - until they were all used up. If a 996.1 has a broken gearbox but is worth £12k it will hopefully be fixed. If it is only worth £5k and a gearbox is £2.5k second hand then you'd probably be more inclined ot break and but another that works.
So I think there is a value of the car to cost of repairs type ratio thing going on.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
This has all got a bit theoretical and we're all mostly agreeing with each other. It seems that as soon as they creep sub 10, people get interested, and then demand stops them going any lower. It's a 300 bhp 911 after all.
The boxster sets a pretty strong floor price, and for the time being the 997 sets a ceiling. Of course there's overlap, but the band is pretty well defined.
richthebike said:
This has all got a bit theoretical and we're all mostly agreeing with each other.
It seems that as soon as they creep sub 10, people get interested, and then demand stops them going any lower. It's a 300 bhp 911 after all.
The boxster sets a pretty strong floor price, and for the time being the 997 sets a ceiling. Of course there's overlap, but the band is pretty well defined.
Yup, I think edc's post reiterates my original point and ATMs post above certainly does.It seems that as soon as they creep sub 10, people get interested, and then demand stops them going any lower. It's a 300 bhp 911 after all.
The boxster sets a pretty strong floor price, and for the time being the 997 sets a ceiling. Of course there's overlap, but the band is pretty well defined.
I'm actually wishing I never brought this up.
Anyone got any work planned over winter? I'll be doing a suspension refresh (maybe brakes as well). Just about got the garage sorted out so I can fit it in with enough space to work.
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