991.2 GT3 RS - Here it is
Discussion
Ducati0 said:
RSVP911 said:
Oh great, that’s helping. 
It’s all crazy ! Not just the RS’s plenty of other brands creating the problemWhat’s so frustrating is it’s so solvable - if production matched supply : I completely understand why this will never happen as Porsche must be absolutely delighted that the circus exists : I just wish we could go back to order what you like, surfer depreciation , move on .
Never going to happen - the horse has well and truly bolted and it seems to be getting faster and faster with each model release
RSVP911 said:
Never going to happen - the horse has well and truly bolted and it seems to be getting faster and faster with each model release
All markets have periods of correction at some point irrespective of what the economy does...The secret is on an individual basis, is not to get too involved directly...By that i mean only buy what you enjoy and if its depreciation proof, all well and good..It saddens me when i see some used(hardly driven) GT cars turn up at OPCs six months or so old, with only a paltry 200-500 miles on the clock. In these cases its pretty obvious there was never any intention to drive the car, only to gloat in the hype of having secured a much wanted Porsche..
There are people who are active on this very forum, which are as guilty of this shady practice as anybody...but i'm not one of them thank god..!
I had a discussion about this with my DP a couple of months ago, and he assured me that all the latest 'halo' cars which end up on independent lots would be 'secret shopped' by Porsche to find the identity of the owner.This should result in said culprit never receiving a special car ever again..
I'm willing to trade my GT3 for the RS end of the year which is a good system IMO, as if i'd flipped it, i wouldn't have it to make the deal happen. Its a good system to prevent flippers from re-offending..!!
RSVP911 said:
It genuinely really upsets me - the whole circus is so frustrating on every level. It’s self perpetuating ; the craizier the prices get, the more people scramble and do daft things to get the allocations as Porsche squeezes more out of them , driving people to try and cover their exposure by flipping or at least finding the temptation “impossible” to ignore.
What’s so frustrating is it’s so solvable - if production matched supply : I completely understand why this will never happen as Porsche must be absolutely delighted that the circus exists : I just wish we could go back to order what you like, surfer depreciation , move on .
Never going to happen - the horse has well and truly bolted and it seems to be getting faster and faster with each model release
This is all a real shame it seems now a GT car is just a widget to be traded, if you have enough money you can have a car. Unfortunately it is now beyond me I had hoped I could get a GT3 at list which I could just about afford but these are now crazy prices £300K for an RS the whole thing has gone mad exactly as you quote above. With the gen 1 991 GT3, Porsche I seem to recall put a ban on resale through OPC's for the first 6 mths to try and address the bad press, that seems to have been abandoned in search of even more profit. Once Porsche was seen as the car for the enthusiasts, great driving dynamics, reasonable running costs and sensible cost to purchase. What happened to the days when Porsche struggled to sell GT cars, they depreciated, and if you saved hard Mr Average could buy a 5 year old GT car not any more, you need big money to be a good customer to be offered a car or have big money to buy a flipped car. There still seems, despite Porsche saying otherwise to be a good percentage of GT cars sold to buyers who have little intention of driving the cars, you could probably just about tolerate good customers getting first shout of every new model if they drive the cars but as RSVP911 says it is self perpetuating. Probably just sour grapes on my part, lets see what happens with the next GT4 / Spyder. What’s so frustrating is it’s so solvable - if production matched supply : I completely understand why this will never happen as Porsche must be absolutely delighted that the circus exists : I just wish we could go back to order what you like, surfer depreciation , move on .
Never going to happen - the horse has well and truly bolted and it seems to be getting faster and faster with each model release
Taffy66 said:
I'm willing to trade my GT3 for the RS end of the year which is a good system IMO, as if i'd flipped it, i wouldn't have it to make the deal happen. Its a good system to prevent flippers from re-offending..!!
I am sure you are that is still flipping at the highest level , split the profit and get the next halo car, that’s what everybody wants lol and is the worse solution to it all. That means the same people get the best cars at a discount and the normal people have to pay overs ! It's like getting a £20 to £30k discount on every new car ! Yes please where do I sign.
Either make more or if you get a GT or halo car then you cannot have another for 3 years.
In agreement here. Everyone wants to ride that wagon! If you are in that circle with your OPC, it's beyond me why you would flip for the quick buck. Short sighted. Just drive and enjoy as you will still get overs for it when it is factored into the deal for the next GT.
Anyone who flips should be banned for life. Also, no one should be getting consecutive GT releases, regardless of how many Panameras they bought. Even if they put thousands of miles on road/track. Everyone should get a shot and maybe 3 or 4 releases down the line they can get another one. Maybe I'm just bitter though
Anyone who flips should be banned for life. Also, no one should be getting consecutive GT releases, regardless of how many Panameras they bought. Even if they put thousands of miles on road/track. Everyone should get a shot and maybe 3 or 4 releases down the line they can get another one. Maybe I'm just bitter though
There is a lot of bitter people on this,its a good business model,get all the numptys to buy other vehicles and keep turning them over to get a gt.
Why should any one who has only supported the brand for a short period of time of even five years get a car over some one who has supported the brand,especialy the rs models for say 20/30 years.Reason being its better to convert your competing market in to your brand,seen as a real winner.No one is interested in me buying my gt3rs once in a blue moon and never sells it.
Look at the classless colour schemes,gapping gills to rads,crapy plastic ducts,and people are paying how much over!They are overpriced at list,how many have stated the gt cars are cheap and should be more! More money for more plastic,scaffolding crappy cages that look real s
t.
Its nothing new and will always go on,i can see it,people stamping there feet in the dp office after some one bought them a apple,but why cant i have one.The last thing i want to see is thousands of rs models like the last one,talk about diluting the brand of what used to be a special car for sport drivers.
Why should any one who has only supported the brand for a short period of time of even five years get a car over some one who has supported the brand,especialy the rs models for say 20/30 years.Reason being its better to convert your competing market in to your brand,seen as a real winner.No one is interested in me buying my gt3rs once in a blue moon and never sells it.
Look at the classless colour schemes,gapping gills to rads,crapy plastic ducts,and people are paying how much over!They are overpriced at list,how many have stated the gt cars are cheap and should be more! More money for more plastic,scaffolding crappy cages that look real s
t.Its nothing new and will always go on,i can see it,people stamping there feet in the dp office after some one bought them a apple,but why cant i have one.The last thing i want to see is thousands of rs models like the last one,talk about diluting the brand of what used to be a special car for sport drivers.
I don’t see how p/x’ing your GT3 (at list) to the OPC (who will sell at market) and give you a GT3RS allocation (at list ie under market) is not flipping? It’s the same bandwagon / circus etc. Just because the car has 1000 miles rather than 500 doesn’t make a difference IMO.
Easiest way to solve this is to increase the retail price closer to market. If a GT3 was £180k, I think it would take plenty of people out of the game.
It is a shame that the price puts many genuine enthusiasts out of contention but that is life. I would love a 60s V12 Ferrari and would use it but it’s not going to happen. I have learned to be happy with what I have.
Easiest way to solve this is to increase the retail price closer to market. If a GT3 was £180k, I think it would take plenty of people out of the game.
It is a shame that the price puts many genuine enthusiasts out of contention but that is life. I would love a 60s V12 Ferrari and would use it but it’s not going to happen. I have learned to be happy with what I have.
What I struggle to understand is the constant need for change.
How much better/faster/nicer is the .2 RS compared to the .1 RS? Probably only racing drivers would be able to tell the subtle differences in handling from the old car to the new. If you were blindfolded and drove a gen 1 RS and gen 2 RS back to back, could you tell the difference?
I think some posters on here are being insincere when they state the reason they want the newer car is because they want to drive it. Most probably they want the newer car as its newer and shinier and its free motoring. Its a vicious cycle of which we are all guilty of perpetuating, not just the flippers.
How much better/faster/nicer is the .2 RS compared to the .1 RS? Probably only racing drivers would be able to tell the subtle differences in handling from the old car to the new. If you were blindfolded and drove a gen 1 RS and gen 2 RS back to back, could you tell the difference?
I think some posters on here are being insincere when they state the reason they want the newer car is because they want to drive it. Most probably they want the newer car as its newer and shinier and its free motoring. Its a vicious cycle of which we are all guilty of perpetuating, not just the flippers.
I see two types of people on this thread...The ones playing the game, who are on the pitch enjoying themselves playing until they break the rules and get sent off..
The ones not on the pitch playing but merely spectating...... are sitting on the sidelines swearing obscenities at the players..
It is what it is..!!
The ones not on the pitch playing but merely spectating...... are sitting on the sidelines swearing obscenities at the players..
It is what it is..!!
Taffy66 said:
I see two types of people on this thread...The ones playing the game, who are on the pitch enjoying themselves playing until they break the rules and get sent off..
The ones not on the pitch playing but merely spectating...... are sitting on the sidelines swearing obscenities at the players..
It is what it is..!!
I'll be the first to admit I am a spectator because I cant afford to play but I am passionate about Porsche. The ones not on the pitch playing but merely spectating...... are sitting on the sidelines swearing obscenities at the players..
It is what it is..!!
I just wish the players would talk a little more about where they have been in their cars, what nice roads they have driven, their times on trackdays and future road trip plans instead of moaning because they cant have the latest trinket.
It is what it is..!
Surely everybody is entitled to do what they want with their hard earned ? At some point in our lives we all have some luck (in different ways) but that doesn’t mean that in most situations “the others” have a view what you should do with your luck/gain. In some cases people will sell because of unforeseen circumstances, equally some might be happy just to use 200-400 miles per year & enjoy seeing it in their garage & knowing they can go for a drive whenever they want to. I don’t get the people that constantly think you should do x,y & z with the money you have worked hard for.
v8ksn said:
What I struggle to understand is the constant need for change.
How much better/faster/nicer is the .2 RS compared to the .1 RS? Probably only racing drivers would be able to tell the subtle differences in handling from the old car to the new. If you were blindfolded and drove a gen 1 RS and gen 2 RS back to back, could you tell the difference?
I think some posters on here are being insincere when they state the reason they want the newer car is because they want to drive it. Most probably they want the newer car as its newer and shinier and its free motoring. Its a vicious cycle of which we are all guilty of perpetuating, not just the flippers.
yep I cannot afford these cars new if they drop 40% , I have owned many great icons, BMW CSL , 996 GT3 to name just 2 of the 90 odd cars I have owned, but I waited and got them both at £38k as it happens,How much better/faster/nicer is the .2 RS compared to the .1 RS? Probably only racing drivers would be able to tell the subtle differences in handling from the old car to the new. If you were blindfolded and drove a gen 1 RS and gen 2 RS back to back, could you tell the difference?
I think some posters on here are being insincere when they state the reason they want the newer car is because they want to drive it. Most probably they want the newer car as its newer and shinier and its free motoring. Its a vicious cycle of which we are all guilty of perpetuating, not just the flippers.
I would rather cars drop in price and I buy one 2nd hand after 2 years.
what an allocation has done for me is allow me to own a brand new GT4 and a brand new GT3 on a small income ie I am not a high rate TAX earner but own a £190k retail price car !!!
But not many cars interest me, I had my name down on the GT4 for 2 years , and while that was/is a great car when I could try a manual GT3 it was a no brainer to change it, but I have no interest in the 991.1 cars or any of the new PDK cars. (see my are PDK dull thread ;-) )
The new Manual GT3 is the first manual GT3 in 6 years !!! and they also ripped out the E-diff and dialed down the electrics which go hand in hand with the PDK, RWS and E-diff to let the car self drive , so it drives nothing like a automatic GT3 and still takes a big load of skill, in fact it's quite a hard car to drive.
It's a magic thing to be able to buy a manual , Norm ASP 4.0l 9k reving, real Diff sports cars in todays age, in fact it's the only one I can think of for sale in 2018.
I am shocked only 50 odd people choose that configuration !!! I guess a lot of the PDK owners had no choice in the 1st batch and a big % will flip to the RS !! the rest wanted self driving PDK by choice.
So going forward for the "Driver" the 2nd hand market will be very slim for what I see as the best choice in the 991.2 GT3 range and that's a great shame for people who want one later on as they will be slim pickings.
If the clutch was not so heavy I would be in a 997.2 GT3, but again they are NOT selling, so IS the manual car DEAD at these prices !!!! and the people with the money do want the latest and greatest new shiny thing !
TDT said:
Consumerism, One-up-manship, Keeping up with the Jones', Pub Talk, Willy-Waving,Greed, Human Nature.
Take your pick..all of the above.
Spot on. Its not that different to the "I spec PCCB's because of the difference in weight as I turn the corner into Tesco" thread elsewhere. This is people often aspire to the latest/greatest etc, and I'm definitely one of them, but you might as well admit that and get on with it.Take your pick..all of the above.
What's interesting to watch is the speed of the falling 2RS (I mean the speed of the falling price not of the car itself!). I know of at least one very early car which traded at 585k to the second owner, but now cars are appearing under 450k retail, which for those owned by the dealers not on SOR would put them at or even under 400 for trade. Amusingly I was offered a 2RS last week at 475 with the OPC insisting it "should really be 495", which was clearly a lie as others were available for less than 475 elsewhere, let alone their 495 dream. This week the same dealer is talking 50k cheaper so maybe the penny is dropping.
Its quite a correction to watch, and caused totally by mad early prices - first owners of 2RS shouldn't care as they a) still have the car and b) are in the money anyway, people who bought in the overs market (flipees?!) shouldn't care because they know what they're doing when they pay inflated numbers, so that just leaves the poor traders who might be left holding the baby. We can reserve our sympathy for them.....
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