People seem to be taking a bit of a bath on GT3 cars
Discussion
isaldiri said:
LaSource said:
Lost interest in the brand to some extent anyway.
Stockholm syndrome. You know you'll be back.... 
GT4 yet again will be on every ones want list at the price it will be, it's just out there on it's own for the driver market sub £80k
LaSource said:
…...
I think OPCs should be free to look after their best customers, if any cars are taken back in for the next best one then they should be offered to their next best who missed out at the original list price. Then Porsche would be rewarding loyalty and strengthening their belief in their list price framework....or raise the list price.
EDIT: to be frank it is a bit of a boring topic now. It is what is it. Maybe the change in economic climate is closing this recent phase. Lost interest in the brand to some extent anyway.
I think your last sentence sums things up perfectly. As somebody who would potentially buy a Porsche in the future, the whole OPC game is the main thing that is putting me off. I won't pay 'overs' for a stock production car, I won't play the game of having to buy (and a significant loss) multiple Porsche models that I don't want to climb an imaginary ladder to get to the front of a queue for the model I would like either. I'm sure Porsche couldn't care less that I dismissed a GT3 RS and bought a 570s, but as the economic climate changes, maybe one day they will. I think OPCs should be free to look after their best customers, if any cars are taken back in for the next best one then they should be offered to their next best who missed out at the original list price. Then Porsche would be rewarding loyalty and strengthening their belief in their list price framework....or raise the list price.
EDIT: to be frank it is a bit of a boring topic now. It is what is it. Maybe the change in economic climate is closing this recent phase. Lost interest in the brand to some extent anyway.
Halo models are a great way of advertising a brands core strength, Halo models nobody can actually buy soon become a source of customer delusion IMHO.
hunter 66 said:
993rsr . totally agree my old friend , nice to see normality returning ........yes I had my RS out in the rain this morning as it was bought to use .
The drivel from 911R is unrelenting and easier just to ignore , now there are two sides to GT ownership and sadly there are a few on here that just speak money , the investment aspect of the cars .
The constant bloody talk about good spec /poor spec and it will not sell if poor spec ........ thank god that will all now go away .
Who cares I could not afford to pay overs , despite constant chat of "put your money where your mouth is " , but was lucky to get a RS , and yes specced it poorly with Steel brakes , because I do not give a s
t about the next owner , I bought it for my fun .
Hopefully 2019 will be a fun year and real Porsche talk
Hunter, 997GT3 also out in the rain on its way to MOT, where comparison with last certificate shows it did 4826 miles this year. 991.2GT3 has 7210 on the odometer and the CGT did a less creditable 2850 miles this year. So just shy of 15k GT miles in 2018. Cars all now practically worthless. But nevermind as it all starts again at the RS day in early March. Seasons Greetings The drivel from 911R is unrelenting and easier just to ignore , now there are two sides to GT ownership and sadly there are a few on here that just speak money , the investment aspect of the cars .
The constant bloody talk about good spec /poor spec and it will not sell if poor spec ........ thank god that will all now go away .
Who cares I could not afford to pay overs , despite constant chat of "put your money where your mouth is " , but was lucky to get a RS , and yes specced it poorly with Steel brakes , because I do not give a s
t about the next owner , I bought it for my fun .Hopefully 2019 will be a fun year and real Porsche talk
It does always make me chuckle when people who've paid list come on here and say they have no problems with overs...haha, of course you don't. Maybe I should be less sensitive but those who mention people who've paid overs as having accepted a huge hit and aren't bothered about losing money - argh, nonsense - no one likes losing money and especially not to flippers.
On the current car bubble I have made ~100k and also paid out ~100k in overs. So I've made nothing and lost nothing. The whole thing does leave a very bad taste however. My longterm OPC weren't able to supply me a 991.2 GT3 but were able to offer me a car (they'd sold to someone who lived 300 miles away who had never bought a car from them before, friend of the principle I'm told)...at 45k over list - I told them to stick it. I have a second batch 991.2 GT3 RS coming (I wanted a first batch)...my OPC offered me 2 first batch zero mile cars at 80k overs (owners changed there mind on delivery)...one of which I grudgingly bought (having negotiated price). Yeah, so if you're getting every car at list easy to say you have no issue with overs. If you're a simple car guy like me that just wants to drive cars then overs is a load of BS.
On the current car bubble I have made ~100k and also paid out ~100k in overs. So I've made nothing and lost nothing. The whole thing does leave a very bad taste however. My longterm OPC weren't able to supply me a 991.2 GT3 but were able to offer me a car (they'd sold to someone who lived 300 miles away who had never bought a car from them before, friend of the principle I'm told)...at 45k over list - I told them to stick it. I have a second batch 991.2 GT3 RS coming (I wanted a first batch)...my OPC offered me 2 first batch zero mile cars at 80k overs (owners changed there mind on delivery)...one of which I grudgingly bought (having negotiated price). Yeah, so if you're getting every car at list easy to say you have no issue with overs. If you're a simple car guy like me that just wants to drive cars then overs is a load of BS.
Porsche911R said:
isaldiri said:
LaSource said:
Lost interest in the brand to some extent anyway.
Stockholm syndrome. You know you'll be back.... GT4 yet again will be on every ones want list at the price it will be, it's just out there on it's own for the driver market sub £80k
"I think 991.1 GT3, RS and GT4 are in for a massive correction, overs on cars like these are just not sustainable long term after new models come out and are dropping daily. I am shocked at 991.1 prices to be fair how high they still are."
pete.g said:
Porsche911R said:
isaldiri said:
LaSource said:
Lost interest in the brand to some extent anyway.
Stockholm syndrome. You know you'll be back.... GT4 yet again will be on every ones want list at the price it will be, it's just out there on it's own for the driver market sub £80k
"I think 991.1 GT3, RS and GT4 are in for a massive correction, overs on cars like these are just not sustainable long term after new models come out and are dropping daily. I am shocked at 991.1 prices to be fair how high they still are."
CrashBang said:
This ^
Worth mentioning that Pistonheads is the only forum where any GT3 threads are dominated by values, residuals, spec, overs etc etc - Which could suggest that many whom post here are indeed speculators with ulterior motives.
Check out Rennlist....there are hundreds of threads on spec, colour, deviated stitching, residuals, ADM (dealer margin over and above RRP) etc.Worth mentioning that Pistonheads is the only forum where any GT3 threads are dominated by values, residuals, spec, overs etc etc - Which could suggest that many whom post here are indeed speculators with ulterior motives.
I wanted a 991.2 GT3 Manual new to my spec - Dream car thing. I had only purchased 1 Porsche in my car history from OPC 1 year old. Unfortunately i was told by an OPC "you need to buy more cars, we have people buying 10 cars a year" - I told the DP i can't compete with that and only want one car. Then we inquired about a Macan, response was "The new one is on its way lets get your buying history up". No way would buying history be mentioned before the GT bubble. Was also told "We only sell to people who drive there cars" - I saw a 3 year old 991.1 GT3 in the showroom with 500 miles on the clock, only to be told he traded it in for a 991.2 GT3. Its a complete con!!
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bullst. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models.
Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bulls
t. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models. Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
lowndes said:
Hunter, 997GT3 also out in the rain on its way to MOT, where comparison with last certificate shows it did 4826 miles this year. 991.2GT3 has 7210 on the odometer and the CGT did a less creditable 2850 miles this year. So just shy of 15k GT miles in 2018. Cars all now practically worthless. But nevermind as it all starts again at the RS day in early March. Seasons Greetings
LOL - i was also out in the rain to MOT the GT4 - 12533 on the clock - adding 10000miles since picking it up in March 2017. These things are so good on the road.Cheib said:
CrashBang said:
This ^
Worth mentioning that Pistonheads is the only forum where any GT3 threads are dominated by values, residuals, spec, overs etc etc - Which could suggest that many whom post here are indeed speculators with ulterior motives.
Check out Rennlist....there are hundreds of threads on spec, colour, deviated stitching, residuals, ADM (dealer margin over and above RRP) etc.Worth mentioning that Pistonheads is the only forum where any GT3 threads are dominated by values, residuals, spec, overs etc etc - Which could suggest that many whom post here are indeed speculators with ulterior motives.
The rennlist forums with the driving enthusiasts in are the 997 GT3, 996 GT3 and air-cooled.
TDT said:
lowndes said:
Hunter, 997GT3 also out in the rain on its way to MOT, where comparison with last certificate shows it did 4826 miles this year. 991.2GT3 has 7210 on the odometer and the CGT did a less creditable 2850 miles this year. So just shy of 15k GT miles in 2018. Cars all now practically worthless. But nevermind as it all starts again at the RS day in early March. Seasons Greetings
LOL - i was also out in the rain to MOT the GT4 - 12533 on the clock - adding 10000miles since picking it up in March 2017. These things are so good on the road.JayK12 said:
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bullst. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models.
Absolutely agree a lot of it is BS - but I don't think I would of got a GT3 if I hadn't of built up at least some kind of relationship with my OPC, and if that meant servicing, MOT'ing, warranty renewals, and taking a bit of finance.. then fairs fair IMO. I'm in.t. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models. I do hear some sorry tales of people who have had to buy stuff they don't want in order to get a 'halo' car. Luckily I have only ever bought what I am happy to own and drive. And within reason, always will (see below).
And I am just talking about regular GT models here, nothing limited like a 997 4.0rs / 991r etc. I'm not stupid, if my OPC said "buy that Camel-Toe Pink Boxster in the corner of the showroom for £100k and I'll give you our *only* Limited Edition 4.2 992.5 RS allocation... I'd have my cheque book out my pocket quicker than John Waynes spud gun
Phooey said:
JayK12 said:
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bullst. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models.
Absolutely agree a lot of it is BS - but I don't think I would of got a GT3 if I hadn't of built up at least some kind of relationship with my OPC, and if that meant servicing, MOT'ing, warranty renewals, and taking a bit of finance.. then fairs fair IMO. I'm in.t. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models. I do hear some sorry tales of people who have had to buy stuff they don't want in order to get a 'halo' car. Luckily I have only ever bought what I am happy to own and drive. And within reason, always will (see below).
And I am just talking about regular GT models here, nothing limited like a 997 4.0rs / 991r etc. I'm not stupid, if my OPC said "buy that Camel-Toe Pink Boxster in the corner of the showroom for £100k and I'll give you our *only* Limited Edition 4.2 992.5 RS allocation... I'd have my cheque book out my pocket quicker than John Waynes spud gun
- I got 3% discount on my Speciale
- My friend was offered a 997 GT3 RS 4.0 allocation having only bought one previous Porsche
- I was offered a 997 GT2 with 10k discount
- My OPC had 2 Cayman Rs delivered with no buyers
Normality will return...I hope!
JayK12 said:
I wanted a 991.2 GT3 Manual new to my spec - Dream car thing. I had only purchased 1 Porsche in my car history from OPC 1 year old. Unfortunately i was told by an OPC "you need to buy more cars, we have people buying 10 cars a year" - I told the DP i can't compete with that and only want one car. Then we inquired about a Macan, response was "The new one is on its way lets get your buying history up". No way would buying history be mentioned before the GT bubble. Was also told "We only sell to people who drive there cars" - I saw a 3 year old 991.1 GT3 in the showroom with 500 miles on the clock, only to be told he traded it in for a 991.2 GT3. Its a complete con!!
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bullst. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models.
Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
I really hope all these dealers fail, complete and utter arrogance.Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bulls
t. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models. Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
cayman-black said:
JayK12 said:
I wanted a 991.2 GT3 Manual new to my spec - Dream car thing. I had only purchased 1 Porsche in my car history from OPC 1 year old. Unfortunately i was told by an OPC "you need to buy more cars, we have people buying 10 cars a year" - I told the DP i can't compete with that and only want one car. Then we inquired about a Macan, response was "The new one is on its way lets get your buying history up". No way would buying history be mentioned before the GT bubble. Was also told "We only sell to people who drive there cars" - I saw a 3 year old 991.1 GT3 in the showroom with 500 miles on the clock, only to be told he traded it in for a 991.2 GT3. Its a complete con!!
Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bullst. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models.
Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
I really hope all these dealers fail, complete and utter arrogance.Seeing comments from people saying things like "didn't want to haggle to much as I have a good relationship with my OPC" or "Took Porsche finance to bolster the relationship" make me cringe!!, its all bulls
t. They take your money, pull you in on false hopes and sell the GT car you really want to there mate who rotates it back in the showroom or rotates loads of other models. Bring back the days of buyers power, and deprecating cars.
JayK12 said:
I just hope the buying power comes back to the buyers. I still own a Porsche and like it very much. But a lot of my friends have purchased other brands instead, as they refuse to play any games. I have asked for a 718 Spyder (can't believe I've had to ask for a car lol) - should it be NA. No hopes, if I don't get one I wont pay overs, I'll just get go to another brand to keep what I have.
I'm on the list for a GT4, but I'm only interested in a new car specced by myself. I'm not going to beg for one, trade in my 981 GTS below market value or pay overs for someone else's allocation.I refuse to play games and will be more than happy to keep my current car if my OPC decide I'm not worthy. I'll probably look into modifying it if that's the way it goes.
The Surveyor said:
I think your last sentence sums things up perfectly. As somebody who would potentially buy a Porsche in the future, the whole OPC game is the main thing that is putting me off. I won't pay 'overs' for a stock production car, I won't play the game of having to buy (and a significant loss) multiple Porsche models that I don't want to climb an imaginary ladder to get to the front of a queue for the model I would like either. I'm sure Porsche couldn't care less that I dismissed a GT3 RS and bought a 570s, but as the economic climate changes, maybe one day they will.
Halo models are a great way of advertising a brands core strength, Halo models nobody can actually buy soon become a source of customer delusion IMHO.
So you wanted a GT3 but wouldn’t pay ‘overs’.Halo models are a great way of advertising a brands core strength, Halo models nobody can actually buy soon become a source of customer delusion IMHO.
So you bought a 570s instead.
So given general macca depreciation; you’ll likely lose more on the 570S at list that you would have done paying overs on a GT3?
Is that not cutting off the nose to spite your face?
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