What’s the right price for a 991.2 GT3 ?

[Fokker]

Hi John. Well done on the allocation.

It looks like most of the gen 2 GT3 RS' are in the hands of used car dealers at the moment. Only 3 on the OPC locator.
Does that £180k include the Wiessach pack? Ive been so busy with all this brexit nonsense that I'm out of touch with the market.

Just bought a GTS 991.2 in Graphite blue as a useable daily while I wait for the price of Tourings to fall

[Porsche911R]

Taffy66 said:

Common sense says that with 650 gen 2 GT3s in the UK, prices can only go one way..I'd be very surprised if any OPC will bid list for a GT3 right now..I'm glad i sold mine to my OPC when i did as i'm lucky to have got an RS allocation.
I think Cheib made some good points regarding being able to buy 720s,488s and even F12s in the £150Ks..I paid £128K for my 458 last Xmas which was an absolute bargain especially considering it was £235K when new with all the Carbon etc..However today there are several 458s in that price range although perhaps without the resale 'must have' carbon racing seats..If 458s are dropping in value then every other sports/super car will follow suit IMO.
Even high spec 600LTs are in the £160Ks with zero miles which is a steal at that money..991.2GT3s need to be at least £20k less money than the aforementioned true supercars as they're not exactly rare..My new RS is going to be £180K list and already looks expensive compared to some others, before mentioning paying daft 'overs'.!

I think what you forget is a 991.2 MANUAL GT3 has no other competition ! and people will buy them who want to drive manuals.

it's out on it's own and offers some thing these super cars cannot. I would love a Ferrari to look at and the drama of owning one and the smile on my face when I open the garage door, but it's not a manual GT3 :-)

the 991.1 GT3 never came in manual either.

so 650 cars is not that many cars, very few are for sale really when you think 650 cars are in the UK, people love to see drops in prices (they still won't buy one) but the manual GT3 will stand the test of time imo.
1/2 are Auto's half again comforts, 1/2 again tourings !!! really the choice when buying is a pretty low pool of cars.

now when it comes to your new RS at £180k I would rather a Perf at £170k, now £70k below list. Although list on GT products is safe money and why 80% people buy them over a 2nd hand Perf, in fact I even think I would take a 600lt over a 991RS if I were in the £200k Automatic super car market.

sorry to say Carbon racing seats in the 458 and Perf's are not very nice seats !!! way way to hard, where in the 570 range the buckets are the nicer softer seats. But if I were buying either 458's or a Perf I would want their normal seat (which is still bucket shaped anyway)

I think for the enthusiast Porsche does win over other brands for running costs and by a BIG margin and if you want a Manual super car well it's a GT3 and that's that.

Atm I am looking at buying a MX5...….I cancled my 30th ed but a few are up for sale below list and it's very tempting and do the 220bhp BBR kit on it straight away.

You need a Super car to show, clean etc and a dare I say it Cayman R to drive or even just that MX5 !!!!

Edited by Porsche911R on Tuesday 17th September 10:26

[av185]

blackmamba said:

I don’t think most people are bothered about earlier or later cars, there were no material revisions as far as I am aware and the only issue is the warranty (that can be renewed and should be factored in to the price). Condition, spec and miles make the difference.

Not true, trade value on a 2017 67 plate GT3 with 3k miles is £5k less than a 2018 18 plate GT3 with 3k miles assuming identical specs.

Entirely understandable as most buyers would pay more a later plate and newer car, same scenario for any other used car in fact.

[Taffy66]

The Carbon race seats in my 458 are a totally different proposition to the ones in a Lambo..I agree that the latter are very hard for long drives yet i love my 458 seats..Compared to the LWBs on my 981 Spyder they are easier for ingress/exit plus they have infinitely adjustable backrest angle..In terms of supercars my current absolute favourite is the Ultima Evolution or even better their RS..The Ultimas make all other well known supercars seem heavy,dull and slow.

Edited by Taffy66 on Tuesday 17th September 11:01

[av185]

The main problem with the race seats in the Performante is anyone over 6' cannot see properly out of the windscreen especially so in the Spyder.

Which is a slight drawback to say the least.

All part of the indiosyncracies of Lamborghini ownership apparantly although many would prefer to call it a right pita.

[Taffy66]

av185 said:

The main problem with the race seats in the Performante is anyone over 6' cannot see properly out of the windscreen especially so in the Spyder.

Which is a slight drawback to say the least.

All part of the indiosyncracies of Lamborghini ownership apparantly although many would prefer to call it a right pita.

I know that the standard non carbon Lambo seats are set too high for a 6' guy and his eyes would be level with the windscreen header..Their CF race seats albeit uncomfortable are set much lower and are the only practical option for anyone 6' or over.

[av185]

Wonder where all these OPC top spec low mileage 18 plate GT3s are at bargain prices someone was meant to be posting up?

[Porsche911R]

Taffy66 said:

The Carbon race seats in my 458 are a totally different proposition to the ones in a Lambo..I agree that the latter are very hard for long drives yet i love my 458 seats..Compared to the LWBs on my 981 Spyder they are easier for ingress/exit plus they have infinitely adjustable backrest angle..In terms of supercars my current absolute favourite is the Ultima Evolution or even better their RS..The Ultimas make all other well known supercars seem heavy,dull and slow.

As you know I am seat fussy so compairng the crap 981 seats holds nothing to me as I hate those also ;-)

I was just shocked how hard the race 458 seats are for a road car and not that easy to get out with the side skirts, like wise the race Perf seats are hard as wood, but in a Macca the race seats are much better.

just goes to show you don't always want to tick buckets, best seats are still Recaro poles and by a massive margin over any other imo.

[Taffy66]

Porsche911R said:

As you know I am seat fussy so compairng the crap 981 seats holds nothing to me as I hate those also ;-)

I was just shocked how hard the race 458 seats are for a road car and not that easy to get out with the side skirts, like wise the race Perf seats are hard as wood, but in a Macca the race seats are much better.

just goes to show you don't always want to tick buckets, best seats are still Recaro poles and by a massive margin over any other imo.

I had Recaros in my old Integra Type R about 20 years ago and still the best seats on any car i've ever owned..

[f1ten]

Cheib speaks a lot of sense

A mac 720s at 155k for space ship performance and my god can it corner...
458 and 488 have the badge and don't let down on the driving experiences either....
I'm an ex porsche driver (owner) converted to prancing horse, so I'm bias!

Economy across the west is going one way whether you like to admit it or not...


Add into it over supply of supercars and people are not keeping their toys long now and want to experience more things in Less time.

Even the Amg gtr is now at 125k fairly new which is also a pretty fun drive...

Alot of choice for us petrol heads...

Cheib said:

I am not sure you can draw that parallel AV. The 991.1 GT3 displayed rock solid residuals in a market where cars were appreciating generally for the first year or two. Market is very different now and...car market is in the st and they made twice as many 991.2’s as 991.1’s. The real problem for 991.2 GT3 prices is that 488’s and 720s’s are available for under £160k....don’t know what the right differential is but I reckon £20k feels about right....and then there’s 458’s which are available for less. All us Porsche diehards might not consider one of those but I reckon an awful lot of people that might buy a GT3 would.

Add to that maybe a 1000 GT4’s/Spyder’s coming to the UK in the next 18 months and then the new GT3....I don’t see how the market can go anywhere but down. There seem to be a fair number of buyers that just want the latest GT product from Stuttgart so I reckon a lot of GT3’s get traded in against those.

[Porsche911R]

f1ten said:

Cheib speaks a lot of sense

A mac 720s at 155k for space ship performance and my god can it corner...
458 and 488 have the badge and don't let down on the driving experiences either....
I'm an ex porsche driver (owner) converted to prancing horse, so I'm bias!

Economy across the west is going one way whether you like to admit it or not...


Add into it over supply of supercars and people are not keeping their toys long now and want to experience more things in Less time.

Even the Amg gtr is now at 125k fairly new which is also a pretty fun drive...

Alot of choice for us petrol heads...

zero choice if you want a manual car !

[IMI A]

Porsche911R said:

f1ten said:

Cheib speaks a lot of sense

A mac 720s at 155k for space ship performance and my god can it corner...
458 and 488 have the badge and don't let down on the driving experiences either....
I'm an ex porsche driver (owner) converted to prancing horse, so I'm bias!

Economy across the west is going one way whether you like to admit it or not...


Add into it over supply of supercars and people are not keeping their toys long now and want to experience more things in Less time.

Even the Amg gtr is now at 125k fairly new which is also a pretty fun drive...

Alot of choice for us petrol heads...

zero choice if you want a manual car !

Its a v.tough choice to choose between a 720s and .2 GT3 manual or PDK at the same money. At 111k + options the GT3 a no brainer but when both are £150k ooft hard choice. Would need to drive both but I suspect i'd still go for GT3 being the saddo i am but I'd leave the Porsche showroom wondering if I'd made a mistake! The 720s is so much car for the money it defies logic as a used buy. They're so cheap you do wonder whats wrong with them and the Mcl dealers.

[Taffy66]

Fokker said:

Hi John. Well done on the allocation.

It looks like most of the gen 2 GT3 RS' are in the hands of used car dealers at the moment. Only 3 on the OPC locator.
Does that £180k include the Wiessach pack? Ive been so busy with all this brexit nonsense that I'm out of touch with the market.

Just bought a GTS 991.2 in Graphite blue as a useable daily while I wait for the price of Tourings to fall

Hi Dave.My new RS is £180K including the £2k showroom tax..Its a Black one with Weissach pack,PCCBs and Platinum Mag rims..It was a bit of a battle to get one but i persevered and it paid off..Its coming sometime around mid next month and i can't wait..I will be taking it on a couple of track days before winter sets in...Silverstone will be the first one and undecided on the other depending on available dates.

[2010spy]

Fokker said:

Hi John. Well done on the allocation.

It looks like most of the gen 2 GT3 RS' are in the hands of used car dealers at the moment. Only 3 on the OPC locator.
Does that £180k include the Wiessach pack? Ive been so busy with all this brexit nonsense that I'm out of touch with the market.

Just bought a GTS 991.2 in Graphite blue as a useable daily while I wait for the price of Tourings to fall

Surely the Tourings are worthless, given that Mr D doesn't rate it.

[comfortably numb]

av185 said:

Any link to all these 'low mileage good spec' OPC cars? Can't see any.

The only cars that fail to sell are the poor spec/weird spec/overpriced cars with 'issues.'

As proved time and time again on this and other forums it is easy to browse through ads and quote a base line figure but as most cars people previously posted up have proved, the cheaper cars (not just GT3s but any Porsche GT) are only cheap for a reason whether it be steel brakes, weird spec, non OPC car, no leather, non c16, high miles, early car or multi owners.

I don't come on here to ruffle anyone's feathers, simply to report what I have experienced during my time shopping for a car (which I have now bought, so no link I'm afraid). You may not accept it, and you may not like it, but as of right now more than 5% of the UK population of last run GT3s are in the Porsche network. Many have been sitting there for some time and dealers want to sell them, so if you haggle you can get one very close to list. I simply report that in case there is anyone following this forum who is interested in actually buying a car, rather than doing a 'mark to market' on their own.

[av185]

comfortably numb said:

av185 said:

Any link to all these 'low mileage good spec' OPC cars? Can't see any.

The only cars that fail to sell are the poor spec/weird spec/overpriced cars with 'issues.'

As proved time and time again on this and other forums it is easy to browse through ads and quote a base line figure but as most cars people previously posted up have proved, the cheaper cars (not just GT3s but any Porsche GT) are only cheap for a reason whether it be steel brakes, weird spec, non OPC car, no leather, non c16, high miles, early car or multi owners.

I don't come on here to ruffle anyone's feathers, simply to report what I have experienced during my time shopping for a car (which I have now bought, so no link I'm afraid). You may not accept it, and you may not like it, but as of right now more than 5% of the UK population of last run GT3s are in the Porsche network. Many have been sitting there for some time and dealers want to sell them, so if you haggle you can get one very close to list. I simply report that in case there is anyone following this forum who is interested in actually buying a car, rather than doing a 'mark to market' on their own.

Congratulations on your purchase they are great cars.

Btw 5% is actually a relatively low number of GT cars in the OPC network compared to past GT cars and considering it is two years since the first cars were first delivered.

[browngt3]

IMI A said:

Its a v.tough choice to choose between a 720s and .2 GT3 manual or PDK at the same money. At 111k + options the GT3 a no brainer but when both are £150k ooft hard choice. Would need to drive both but I suspect i'd still go for GT3 being the saddo i am but I'd leave the Porsche showroom wondering if I'd made a mistake! The 720s is so much car for the money it defies logic as a used buy. They're so cheap you do wonder whats wrong with them and the Mcl dealers.

For me it is of no consequence what price a 720s is. Even if they were cheaper I wouldn't sell my GT3 to get one. Not just because of the manual, there's that amazing n/a engine too. The Porsche is also better quality, better looking imo and benefits from cheaper running costs and a superior dealer network. There's a good reason the GT3 holds its value better than virtually anything else, it's quite simply the best modern car available for the driving enthusiast. Indeed the only car (in manual form) in its sector for the driving enthusiast.

[IMI A]

browngt3 said:

IMI A said:

Its a v.tough choice to choose between a 720s and .2 GT3 manual or PDK at the same money. At 111k + options the GT3 a no brainer but when both are £150k ooft hard choice. Would need to drive both but I suspect i'd still go for GT3 being the saddo i am but I'd leave the Porsche showroom wondering if I'd made a mistake! The 720s is so much car for the money it defies logic as a used buy. They're so cheap you do wonder whats wrong with them and the Mcl dealers.

For me it is of no consequence what price a 720s is. Even if they were cheaper I wouldn't sell my GT3 to get one. Not just because of the manual, there's that amazing n/a engine too. The Porsche is also better quality, better looking imo and benefits from cheaper running costs and a superior dealer network. There's a good reason the GT3 holds its value better than virtually anything else, it's quite simply the best modern car available for the driving enthusiast. Indeed the only car (in manual form) in its sector for the driving enthusiast.

I'm looking forward to driving both soon. If GT3 as good as you say it is I'm sure I'll buy one.

[browngt3]

av185 said:

Congratulations on your purchase they are great cars.

Btw 5% is actually a relatively low number of GT cars in the OPC network compared to past GT cars and considering it is two years since the first cars were first delivered.

Yes, I would also say 5% is a low number. Maybe someone in the industry can confirm if this is consistent for this sector?

[browngt3]

IMI A said:

I'm looking forward to driving both soon. If GT3 as good as you say it is I'm sure I'll buy one.

Excellent, I'm looking forward to reading your review!